Father (WWII - 101st AB) & Son (VN - USAF) Grouping

[jguy1986]

Bill, I agree with you that the majority of WWII paratroops wore the CIB on the pocket flap, but I think this is one of those "exceptions to the rule" and the setup in that photo is very similar to how the Ike jacket looks today, with CIB just above the pocket flap. You can see the muzzle on the badge, unless I'm seeing it wrong, below the GC ribbon in the pic. The main difference I can see is that there's an oval on the jacket now, and ribbons appear to be moved around a bit, but it's still jump wings then ribbons then CIB. Perhaps he had the oval in his personal effects and wanted to put it on the jacket after the photo was taken, and things got rearranged a bit when he put the rest of the insignia back on, or perhaps it could also be a second jacket pictured. Any way, it's a terrific grouping.

 

Best,

-- Jon

[David D]

That is one outstanding grouping! Congrats on this!

 

-Dave

[fstop61]

Museum-quality grouping, to say the least. They really don't get any better than that. Congratulations on the score of the century.

[Bellumbill]

jbguy -

 

Ok, yes, I see what you are getting at now. The photo is not so clear but I mistook what appears on the photo as a ribbon bar below the first row of ribbons! Now I see you are saying THAT is likely the CIB and I think you are probably correct.

 

Anyway, just making an observation about the awards authorized in his discharge versus what is on the uniform. Not a big deal as it in no way detracts from the excellence and historical quality of this grouping!

 

Best,

 

Bill K.

[MasonK]

I sit here in a puddle of slobber.... wow. Historic Grouping!! Well done. Thank heavens it wasn't bused up and sold on Ebay (Frick and Dye items ...)

 

Riley

 

 

Hey, thanks for posting. I LOVE THAT BRITISH 101st patch on the jump jacket; very cool. I don't ever think I have seen a British Eagle Patch on anything other than on a dress uniform.

 

Kurt

 

 

AMAZING grouping here! What a great find. Thank you for sharing!

 

 

Incredible you have all of this from one Vet. Congrats and cherish this. Stoney

 

 

Good grief, this is truly in a league of its own. Congratulations on acquiring it, must feel about like winning the lottery to a militaria collector!

 

 

That is one outstanding grouping! Congrats on this!

 

-Dave

 

 

Museum-quality grouping, to say the least. They really don't get any better than that. Congratulations on the score of the century.

 

Thank you all for the kind words and great feedback! I truly does feel like winning the lottery. I'm still in awe of everything that was included! I'm also glad the seller decided to keep it all together. I had a lengthy conversation the day I went to view the group and they definitely appreciate the history.

 

Read through some of the letters last night and they have some interesting content. Just ordered some nice binders and sleeves so I can start putting them in order as I really don't want to continue handling them.

[MasonK]

jbguy -

 

Ok, yes, I see what you are getting at now. The photo is not so clear but I mistook what appears on the photo as a ribbon bar below the first row of ribbons! Now I see you are saying THAT is likely the CIB and I think you are probably correct.

 

Anyway, just making an observation about the awards authorized in his discharge versus what is on the uniform. Not a big deal as it in no way detracts from the excellence and historical quality of this grouping!

 

Best,

 

Bill K.

 

Bill,

I appreciate the feedback. Below is a close-up of the photo with Charles and his Wife. You'll see the CIB much clearer in this photo. Unfortunately when I resized the original photo, it lost some of the detail.

 

The oval, however, is missing. My guess is it was sewn on later and he had to remove the ribbon bar to do so. When the ribbons were reattached, they were put on out of order.

 

[Brian Dentino]

Wow! I will be following this thread for a while to come to see what information you post based on all those letters/paperwork. A truly remarkable find!!!!

[MasonK]

Wow! I will be following this thread for a while to come to see what information you post based on all those letters/paperwork. A truly remarkable find!!!!

 

Thanks, Brian!

[Normandy1944]

Awesome grouping and unique.

I wish I could own such a grouping once.

[MasonK]

Awesome grouping and unique.

I wish I could own such a grouping once.

 

Thanks, Normandy!

 

In due time...I had the same thought until a week ago when this one fell in my lap. These items are still out there waiting to be found.

[Normandy1944]

 

Thanks, Normandy!

 

In due time...I had the same thought until a week ago when this one fell in my lap. These items are still out there waiting to be found.

 

The only difference is I don't live in the US but in the Netherlands

[Herbf]

These appear to be propaganda leaflets.

 

e.jpg

 

f.jpg

 

g.jpg

The first is a favorite of mine. It says "This was the plan" and shows what the Germans expected to gain in the Battle of the Bulge.

[Captainofthe7th]

Eric, this is a killer grouping. I know a lot of people will be jazzed up about it since it's airborne, and that's definitely neat -- but just the amount of photos, documentation, that folder of 'German paperwork,' and the son's uniform makes this grouping what it is. Wow! Easily one of the best groups I've seen on these forums.

 

Enjoy!

 

Rob

[Eric Queen]

Great find. Not much to add to what others have said. The M42 would definitely be my favorite piece in the group and this (below) would be my second. Super rare ID photo (passbild) of an SS panzer officer (wearing officer black wrapper). Not something you see every day.

[MasonK]

The first is a favorite of mine. It says "This was the plan" and shows what the Germans expected to gain in the Battle of the Bulge.

 

Thanks for the translation, Herb!

 

Eric, this is a killer grouping. I know a lot of people will be jazzed up about it since it's airborne, and that's definitely neat -- but just the amount of photos, documentation, that folder of 'German paperwork,' and the son's uniform makes this grouping what it is. Wow! Easily one of the best groups I've seen on these forums.

 

Enjoy!

 

Rob

 

Thanks, Rob! I agree in that as a grouping, overall it has a lot going for it. The best grouping I've ever had, even without the 101st connection. The letters spanning this soldiers entire time in service is what makes it great to me. I just started putting them in sleeves. Hope to finish organzing them before the weekend so I can have some free time to do a read through.

 

Regarding the "German Documents" folder, after taking a better look, I believe this would have been used for intelligence training rather than something Charles had to translate for the Nuremberg trials as previously thought. Still an interesting item, nonetheless. My guess is the blank Solderbuch may have been used for the same purpose.

 

Great find. Not much to add to what others have said. The M42 would definitely be my favorite piece in the group and this (below) would be my second. Super rare ID photo (passbild) of an SS panzer officer (wearing officer black wrapper). Not something you see every day.

 

Thanks, Eric. Wasn't sure what the purpose of the photo was. I appreciate you helping to ID.

[MasonK]

Thanks to a member of WRF, I now have some if the German documents translated.

 

The items addressed to Hitler are indeed invitations (see post 22 - http://www.usmilitariaforum.com/forums/index.php?/topic/227870-father-wwii-101st-ab-son-vn-usaf-grouping/&do=findComment&comment=1808357)

 

• First one is a formal dinner invitation from the Japanese Ambassador with a response that Hitler would be unavailable to attend

 

• Second is an invitation for tea from the head of the NSDAP's foreign press bureau, Ernst Hanfstaengl, also with a response that Hitler would be unable to attend.

 

The letter to Keitel in post 24 (http://www.usmilitariaforum.com/forums/index.php?/topic/227870-father-wwii-101st-ab-son-vn-usaf-grouping/&do=findComment&comment=1808359)

translates as follows:

 

"Olmütz*, 12 Nov. 1943

To His Excellency
General-Feldmarschall
Keitel

Führer's headquarters

Out of the many thousands of German boys who have fallen for Germany in the present war, I have selected one and made a memorial for him in a few verses.

Brought into a suitable form, it was photographed and was liked by all of my acquaintances.

It would be the fulfilment of my most fervent wish if the Führer were to set eyes on it, so I thought about how Your Excellency is so close to the Führer and would therefore not keep one devout Sudeten German's verses from him.

I beg to properly thank Your Excelleny and signed with the German salute of

Heil Hitler!

 

The memorial referenced in the Keitel letter is a poem, which translates as follows:

 

"One German boy's legacy

Dear parents!

Much sorrow did you suffer through my death;
my battery commander himself informed you.
You were so good to me in all the years,
and I know for certain - You will not forget me.

Never could I find words
for the feelings that I had for you.
I loved you much - yet proudly I have to admit
I loved my people and homeland as well.

And in a manly way, I could fulfil my duty,
when the Führer called me to arms.
Quietly, I looked forward to me seeing action,
and then to every letter from home.

Never did I complain, not even in the toughest hours,
and only thought: "Soon, spring must come."
The snow melted away - The cold had vanished
and warm sunshine smiled down once more.

Then the bullet hit me in the enemy's land
and took from me what both of you had given me.
My body lies somewhere in the steppes
the soul is with him who directs it all.

As my legacy, it is this that I want to tell you:
I happily gave my young life;
for the people and the Führer, I had endured
that which may seem impossible to you back home.

Yet, as my death in the face of the enemy commits you
to dedicate everything to the German people - as I did -
you have to be as faithful and devoted as the Führer himself
until the day the skies on the horizon become clear.

You must not be sad, nor must you mourn me,
that I had fallen for the Fatherland.
"Let victory be our avenger", is what you are to say,
for it alone gives meaning to my sacrifice.

Otto"

 

The document below the Keitel letter in post 24 is the dedication page from Mein Kampf (no relation to the Keitel letter) and translates as follows:

 

"To the newlywed couple Welzel - Weber, presented with the best wishes for a happy and blessed marriage by the registrar's office of Fritzlar on 20th April 1939" (which, of course, is also Hitler's birthdy) and signed by an communal official/employee acting on behalf of the registrar.

 

 

[MasonK]

Also, thanks to Mark Bando, I was able to confirm Wahler was a member of IPW (Interrogation of Prisoners of War) Team 9. Roster below:

 

 

Lastly, just ordered a copy of "No Victory in Valhalla" by Ian Gardner as Wahler is referenced a couple times in this book. Looking forward to giving it a read.

[MasonK]

Well, I visited with the sellers yesterday to discuss some other things (I'll share here later ).

 

As I said early, there may be more to this group and there sure is. While there, I picked up Wahler's parachute!

 

There are two parachutes, both are made of silk. One is complete and the other has some sections cut out of it (which are present). I assume one was the main, the other his reserve.

 

Also included is a spring loaded camo pilot chute, dated 1943, and a parachute lead which appears to made of nylon.

 

 

[MasonK]

 

[MasonK]

My dog (a pug) in the background for scale.

 

 

Close-up of material/construction

 

[MasonK]

This morning, I receive an email from the seller with these photos. A few CIB's, his GCM (not named), couple cap patches, few collar brass and a pair of JR Gaunt wings.

 

I plan on picking these up tomorrow. Stay tuned for some more items!

 

 

[MasonK]

Some better photos of the items above as well as some new additions to the group.

 

 

 

[MasonK]

British made, JR Gaunt wings

 

 

Some more misc insignia that would not have belonged to Charles

 

[MasonK]

Additional letters, Charle's Selective Service card and more negatives of photos he took with the 101st

 

 

Negatives of photos while stateside with the 4th ID.

 

 

 

 

 

[MasonK]

Lastly, we were also able to locate a bunch of slides from Walter's service in Vietnam (Charles' son).