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SEEKING INFORMATION ON LEFT LOOKING NAVY EAGLE HAT BADGES


Jay Seay
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Well Unclegrumpy, it should make a lovley hood ornament then. : )

 

But that hallmark is still an eyesore, it just is. Not well done at all.

Now I know what to look for in an authentic Luke hallmark......

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Well Unclegrumpy, it should make a lovley hood ornament then. : )

 

I think you are still jumping too fast here. While my gut is that this one may well end up on your car someday, I think it is premature to mount it yet.

 

One thing I think that you are not fully considering is it can take years....sometimes many many years....to resolve some of these "mysteries". Input from something like this Forum, can sometimes speed up the process, but the answer is not always instantaneous.

 

Personally, I think where you are at, is if you believe the story you have is true, you still have hope. Nobody has been able to confirm what you have is a copy yet, and that is positive. I think you need to be patient and keep looking and studying....eventually this will be resolved one way or the other.

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Salvage Sailor

Sage advice as many a questionable item has later been proven to be authentic when another with clear provenance comes to light.

 

Conversely, most questionable items are proved to be something else entirely, be it put together, knock-offs or fantasy pieces.

 

As you say, time will tell.

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Here are some more pics, and more can be sent.

 

I have reduced, and reduced the size of these files 3 times.

And out of six only two would finally load. I had various backgrounds,

and various lighting variations.

 

May I suggest the forum bosses fix that? So much detail that can

be gained is lost because of upload restrictions.

 

I have spent 45 minutes trying to upload, reduce, and re-reduce

then upload six files, over and over.

 

So if these pictures aren't good enough, fix the system

and let me know when, I'll be glad to post more. But in 2014 going

on 2015, I would think large files that could be magnified well would

be a plus on a site such as this, and with all the magnificent technology

available. Yes, I've seen the section on file uploading. It shouldn't be that

difficult.

I can send these files on g-mail fine, without reducing them. All six. But

only two here. :dry:

 

 

 

 

 

 

post-150611-0-51556200-1414980389.jpg

post-150611-0-63933000-1414980401.jpg

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Sent these through and copying from my email after multiple reductions, maybe these two will load?

 

 

 

 

post-150611-0-54163500-1414981979.jpg

post-150611-0-96586200-1414982125.jpg

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Tell me gentlemen, that this probable counterfeit I have posted isn't far more beautiful than the one

that is posted as a "known good" K. G. Luke?

 

There should be a separate thread started on the proposed good Luke posted above on this page

so as not to distract, or appear to distract from this one in question.

 

The eagle on the "good" Luke, and the whole shield and back, to include the very poor hallmark just

look like very poor craftsmanship, they just do. And that has nothing, absolutely nothing, to do with

this probable counterfeit I have. I have had a couple of others agree with me on that, but I can't get

to jump in with their post. Oh well. I think this will look great on a Black Lexus with a Gold Package. :)

 

.....all the best-

J

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Tell me gentlemen, that this probable counterfeit I have posted isn't far more beautiful than the one

that is posted as a "known good" K. G. Luke?

 

There should be a separate thread started on the proposed good Luke posted above on this page

so as not to distract, or appear to distract from this one in question.

 

The eagle on the "good" Luke, and the whole shield and back, to include the very poor hallmark just

look like very poor craftsmanship, they just do. And that has nothing, absolutely nothing, to do with

this probable counterfeit I have. I have had a couple of others agree with me on that, but I can't get

to jump in with their post. Oh well. I think this will look great on a Black Lexus with a Gold Package. :)

 

.....all the best-

J

 

Couple of things:

 

1. We still don't know if the one you have is counterfeit. Like Salvage Sailor sagely said, sometimes these things take time. For many years, I was writing off all the Viking left-facing eagles, as I knew a similar style was faked about 25 years ago. That was, until I found one, still in the original box, untouched for 70 years, with a photo of the veteran wearing it in 1941. Egg on my face...but sometimes things come to light that change the game, and it just takes time.

 

2. Regarding your photos. You can e-mail them to me in their original size, if you'd like, and I can post larger sized images up here. Send me a PM and I'll send you my e-mail address. Or, depending on your software, there are several good tutorials on the forum about compression of photos for uploading on here. Being that it is almost 2015, there is some very good software out there for .jpg compression, and there are plenty of people on here who would be happy to help you navigate them.

 

3. With the additional photos, it's fairly clear to see that yours was cast vice struck. Please note the red circles on the images where there are marks from what I would consider to be a sub-par casting. While it's entirely possible that KG Luke made cast insignia, all of it that I've seen so far (and that's on here) appears to be struck. Beauty is, of course, in the eye of the beholder, but I will continue to remain suspicious of it until we can prove that KG Luke made cast Navy officer hat devices, as no evidence gathered thus far can support that idea.

 

My opinions-

 

Dave

 

11-3-2014 6-58-15 AM.jpg

11-3-2014 6-59-55 AM.jpg

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A couple of points worth mentioning or repeating.....

 

The Luke eagle Stewart's Military has is a real, original, wartime one, and one that others like it exist.

 

Beauty is not always the determining factor, especially when "new" looking is one of the leading attributes.

 

Opinions matter, but there is also an academic element that requires investigative inquiry, continued research, and hopefully in the end, some proof.

 

It is not a popularity contest.

 

And lastly, no matter how much you want something to be good does not make it so. It either is or it isn't, and there is just no escaping that.

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From this new thread:

 

http://www.usmilitariaforum.com/forums/index.php?/topic/223550-a-couple-of-badges-from-a-local-dealer/&do=findComment&comment=1770652

 

Here's the reverse of a couple of small sized (1") hat devices. The hallmark matches that of the one from Stewarts as far as font, depth, and irregularities.

 

 

11-4-2014 4-17-48 PM.jpg

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The hallmark matches that of the one from Stewarts as far as font, depth, and irregularities.

 

 

 

Are you sure Boss? To my eyes, the Luke maker's mark on the Stewart's larger eagle looks razed, while on these two smaller ones stamped.

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Are you sure Boss? To my eyes, the Luke maker's mark on the Stewart's larger eagle looks razed, while on these two smaller ones stamped.

 

Sorry...I should have been more specific. I meant the sterling hallmark, rather than the maker mark.

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No problem!

 

I think one thing that is interesting about these little guys, is the stamped hallmark. Most of the other Luke insignia in the the other thread has a raised hallmark....including the smaller ones, like the Army Officers branch insignia.

 

A raised hallmark is much more difficult to reproduce, but seeing more clearly original stamped ones does not help us much with the large hat badge in question.

 

I will say, these side cap insignia and the large Stewart's hat badge, all exhibit similar manufacturing style, age, and patina, which were things that were brought up earlier, but seeing more photo evidence, probably does a better job explaining.

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Gents,

 

I'm just following this thread from my other one. I agree, most K G Luke markings are raised, ie, part of the die.

 

I don't know if it helps, but the only other stamped K G Luke marking I have is attached.

 

Note that my 3 stamped items came from totally different sources at different times - the 2 line marking with abbreviated Melbourne appears to be produced by a single stamp though. Given that the one in question has totally separate K G Luke and fully spelt out MELBOURNE, comparing them in detail may not be 100% valid (ie, the markings would have been made by different punches).

 

Regards

Mike

post-11042-0-57168400-1415338921.jpg

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Let me see if these load. I agree, if something is beautiful it don't make it real. I was just saying the guy that made these missed

his calling, he should have worked for Luke. Maybe the guy I got them from got duped, and he just passed that on to me, but he's

in ill health in a wheelchair with a stroke.....so that's the way it goes.

post-150611-0-08360100-1415399653.jpg

post-150611-0-63994100-1415399676.jpg

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Dave, just swap me for that Mercedes emblem.......It'll look great on my Acura.

 

OK, thanks for all the input, I doubt Luke cast these, and if they did I would think

 

they would have done a better job, but, looking at the hallmark and eagle/shield

 

on the larger example, that kinda surprises me. That'll teach me not to look at

 

Luke or Gaunt in the future. The only ones left are repros i suppose. Thanks.

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I would agree with Dave. I have never seen a full size officer's cap device with cast parts. All have been stuck with smooth, well finished surface. Interesting information on this rare item. Thanks to all!

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  • 2 months later...

post-9865-0-68799300-1421953669.jpgLet's bring this debate back up Attached is a genuine Luke ATS full size officer hat badge. It's struck, with a raised hallmark, but the photo detailing the rear almost looks like casting near the anchors...

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This is not a Luke, however, it is an early left facing metal eagle from a WW1 Navy Cross group. If you click on image you will get a larger picture.

Dick

post-9487-0-26443000-1422018438.jpg

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  • 1 month later...

 

Couple of things:

 

1. We still don't know if the one you have is counterfeit. Like Salvage Sailor sagely said, sometimes these things take time. For many years, I was writing off all the Viking left-facing eagles, as I knew a similar style was faked about 25 years ago. That was, until I found one, still in the original box, untouched for 70 years, with a photo of the veteran wearing it in 1941. Egg on my face...but sometimes things come to light that change the game, and it just takes time.

 

2. Regarding your photos. You can e-mail them to me in their original size, if you'd like, and I can post larger sized images up here. Send me a PM and I'll send you my e-mail address. Or, depending on your software, there are several good tutorials on the forum about compression of photos for uploading on here. Being that it is almost 2015, there is some very good software out there for .jpg compression, and there are plenty of people on here who would be happy to help you navigate them.

 

3. With the additional photos, it's fairly clear to see that yours was cast vice struck. Please note the red circles on the images where there are marks from what I would consider to be a sub-par casting. While it's entirely possible that KG Luke made cast insignia, all of it that I've seen so far (and that's on here) appears to be struck. Beauty is, of course, in the eye of the beholder, but I will continue to remain suspicious of it until we can prove that KG Luke made cast Navy officer hat devices, as no evidence gathered thus far can support that idea.

 

My opinions-

 

Dave

 

 

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  • 7 years later...

Here is a group I just picked up. Left facing Eagles 1 PB, 1 SB pre-41 and a post 41, Amcraft mfg, in sterling (Eagle) and rolled gold (Anchors) PB modified, I would suspect early run and last an ID badge of a Lt with a Left facing eagle (possibly bullion) all came together. Sorry no history to share. I welcome input

WW1 PB a.jpg

WW1 PB b.jpg

WW1 SB b.jpg

WW1 SB a.jpg

Amcraft sterling-rolled gold hat badge ajpg.jpg

Amcraft sterling-rolled gold hat badge b.jpg

Amcraft sterling-rolled gold hat badge c.jpg

N.Y Navy Yard Badge pre-ww2 a.jpg

N.Y Navy Yard Badge pre-ww2 b.jpg

N.Y Navy Yard Badge pre-ww2 c.jpg

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