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THE M14 BATTLE RIFLE...SAD DEMISE?


ka bar
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  • 3 years later...

Better late than never (I guess) - I just came across this thread while searching for "National Match" (ammo) of all things so I've got to put my two cents worth in.

Between being a rifleman (0311) and a machine gunner (0331) I was a fire team automatic rifleman for a while with an M-14 and here are just a couple of the things I learned about it. 1) You throw the bipod away, it's useless, adds weight, and makes you a target. 2) The M-14 is excellent on full auto IF you use it properly. Fire from the hip with your left arm locked straight down from your shoulder to the top of the barrel cover (I forget the exact term) in 3 - 5 round bursts and there is no climb.

The reason(s) it was removed were multiple and above my pay grade, but this is what I believe. It was considered too long and heavy for jungle use (everyone compared it to the AK-47's short length) but nobody who used it complained about the length or weight (considering the firepower). Next, the US had to comply with the NATO standard 5.56 round which was BS. Being NATO's biggest supplier we should have said "If you want NATO to have the same caliber as the U.S, so we can give you free ammo, switch to 7.62". The main selling point for the 5.56 ammo was the weight. Troops could carry twice as much 5.56 as 7.62.

And then of course there is the reason that is never mentioned - politicians getting their bank accounts fattened from the Colt Co.

And I won't even bring up the forgotten issue of the M-16 being issued before it was even combat-ready. Anybody have any real idea how many troops were found dead with jammed M-16s before the problem (wrong gunpowder) was corrected?

 

Art

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Cobra 6 Actual

Another thing about the wooden stock M-14 was that it could be used as an impact weapon and, in fact, during the 1968 time frame when I was a Drill Sergeant we spent much quality time teaching both the Vertical Buttstroke and the Horizontal Buttstroke. If you buttstroked someone with an M-14 he was not getting up.

 

Towards the end of my time with a BCT unit we received the M-16’s ... and after breaking several of them at the Bayonet Range we realized they they were NOT impact weapons.

 

An unintended consequence of the changeover from M-14 to M-16 also was that during the many riots in the late 1960 - early 1970 era responding units often had to revert to the M-14 or use riot control batons.

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Another thing about the wooden stock M-14 was that it could be used as an impact weapon and, in fact, during the 1968 time frame when I was a Drill Sergeant we spent much quality time teaching both the Vertical Buttstroke and the Horizontal Buttstroke. If you buttstroked someone with an M-14 he was not getting up.

 

 

You forgot the "Smash". That was always fun too and it kept many dentists busy making false teeth not to mention all the broken noses.

 

Parry left, horizontal butt stroke, smash, recover. Drilled into our heads till it was as natural as "By your leave, Sir" Now if I could just remember what I had for breakfast :lol:

 

Art

 

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439th Signal Battalion

post-4009-0-27432000-1531689436.jpg

My pal from Echo Recon 3-7th Infantry,199th LIB with his M14 and M84 scope, 1970.

 

 

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I carried one in Vietnam for a while. It would fire two consecutive rounds and then jam. Had the armorer look at it but it was never fixed. I got my M16 and never looked back. It appeared to be a glorified M1 with a box magazine and some cosmetic changes. The 7.62 NATO round is roughly equivalent to the 30-06 round the M1 used.

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It was too long for SMG and Carbine work (a folding stock was developed but never issued past some troop trials)

 

I had the great pleasure over the weekend to see one of the folding stock versions made for the m14. This particular version was 1 of 12 that were made and only the third to known to still exist, and looked and seemed to function fine.

 

Marty

 

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We shot them in BCT, Ft. Ord. in March 1969. Being a 91P (x-ray tech), I didn't even handle a M16 until VN School at Ft. Riley in 1971. Nixon announced a troop cutback and I got diverted to Germany. Never made it to VN. We carried M16s when ourt in the field in our unit (7th Evacuation Hospital).

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M-14_rifle_demonstration.jpeg

 

 

I think we still have those mounts...somewhere LOL..we have a glass stock one in our gun room, with a TA01 ACOG.

 

(btw, I've worked at Trijicon since '96.)

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Kurt Barickman

I was a gunnerś mate guns on active duty from 1981-4. In GM A school we trained with M-16s, got to the fleet and our and most of the ship armories carried M-14s. Hard to remember but we had fully auto M-14s or was it a selector switch that made in fully auto?? Can´t remember for sure, great gun but I never had to hump that thing with ammunition like an infantry man would have. I do have a distinct memory of shooting it on fully auto from the helo deck while doing some fantail fire and it picked you right up; definitely shoot with bursts. Fired the same round as our M-60s of which we had four in our armory on board USS Stump DD-978.

 

Kurt

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We had the M16A1 in basic training at Ft. Dix, January to February 1970, but at my first assignment, Ft. MacArthur, CA, I was assigned an M14. Never got to fire it, but carried it in an Armed Forces Day parade in Torrance, CA. Right after we were confined to base in case we we were needed at the local college demonstrations resulting from the Kent State shootings and invasion of Cambodia.

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From what I've read and seen one of the problems was the wooden stock.It didn't hold up in humid and hot jungles of Vietnam.I've never held one so correct me if Im wrong, but it looks awkward and heavy to carry around in the jungle and in close quarter engagements.It was also not very accurate with full auto.It is a great rifle and very accurate if your shooting in semi, but it didn't perform the way the military wanted too which is why it was replaced by the m16 which was lightweight, easier to handle.The m16 also didnt have anything made from wood so it held up better in a jungle enviorment.Also as other have pointed out already it never really went out of service.

 

Sent from my SM-J727VPP using Tapatalk

 

 

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Several M14 wooden stocks broke during basic when the recruit drove to the ground during training. The instructor taught us to break our fall into the dirt using the rifle butt, which sometimes caused the stock to split at the grip. The fiberglass sticks held up better.

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M-14_rifle_demonstration.jpeg

 

 

I think we still have those mounts...somewhere LOL..we have a glass stock one in our gun room, with a TA01 ACOG.

 

(btw, I've worked at Trijicon since '96.)

You're off balance, put your shoulder into it troop! :)

 

Art

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