Jump to content

U.S. Army Brassards & Armbands 1898 to 1918 Part 2


Recommended Posts

  • Replies 351
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

  • 1 month later...

Military Government Fireman.

 

post-322-0-80252800-1414531155.jpg

 

 

Stamp that explains exactly what it is:

 

post-322-0-07496300-1414531170.jpg

 

 

 

AEF Fire Marshal Brassard

After America declared war on Imperial Germany, the QTMC soon realized the great danger from fire in the hundreds of wooden buildings that has sprung up all across the nation to house the millions of arriving volunteers, recruits and conscripts. Provisions for camp fire departments were made and fire stations were erected in training camps, troop staging areas, warehouse storage facilities and at Army hospitals. Camp fire marshals, officers, NCOs and soldiers with experience in big city fire departments were culled from the officer corps and the arriving recruits to help fill the ranks. Overseas, the AEF created similar fire fighting outfits to protect the myriad of installations that were constructed by the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers from fire.

 

Photo No. 96: The photo on the left depicts the Fire Marshal of Brest and what one would assume to be his driver. Note that both men are wearing a brassard composed of two colors on the left arm. It’s possible that this brassard whether it was of AEF or French manufacture, might represent the office of the Fire Marshal and his staff. The close up of the two enlisted men from the following photo (both of whom were also members of the Brest Fire Brigade) are both wearing a dark colored brassard. This brassard could be the symbol of an AEF Fire Company or perhaps a French Fire Brigade.

 

Does any forum member know anything about U.S. Army or AEF firefighting insignia from WW I?

 

 

donation2007.gifdonation2008.gifdonation2009.gifdonation2010.gifdonation2011.gif


donation2012.gifdonation2013.gifdonation2014.gifdonation2015.gifdonation2016.gif


donation2017.gif

Link to post
Share on other sites

Nice brassards! Thanks for posting.

 

Other than the Corps, General Staff trench Clip, I've not seen any of these before.

 

Do you have any other information on any of them?

 

Were they part of a group or did you pick them up individually?

 

Unfortunately I have no specific info on any of them. They were all part of a "brassard hoard" I obtained recently. I'll post more photos when I get in a "photo resizing" mood.

donation2007.gifdonation2008.gifdonation2009.gifdonation2010.gifdonation2011.gif


donation2012.gifdonation2013.gifdonation2014.gifdonation2015.gifdonation2016.gif


donation2017.gif

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • 2 weeks later...

Here's a nice visual reference of the "1st Corps I" brassard as seen in post #129 by 'KurtA'. This image is a cropped version of the larger original portrait. My best guess on a time frame is the immediate postwar/Occupation era.

post-518-0-26058500-1415423353.jpg

WANTED!

WWI Aero Squadron items such as insignia, uniforms & my favorite- PHOTOS! Will purchase or work out a possible trade

HIGHLY SOUGHT- Anything related to the AEF Photo Sections or 85th,258th & 278th Aero Squadrons.

To be alone, to have your life in your own hands, to use your own skill, single-handed, against the enemy. It was like the lists of the Middle Ages, the only sphere in modern warfare where a man saw his adversary and faced him in mortal combat, the only sphere where there was still chivalry and honour. If you won, it was your own bravery and skill; if you lost, it was because you had met a better man
-Cecil Lewis


donation2008.gifdonation2009.gif

Link to post
Share on other sites

This is an interesting picture--not only for the subject Doughboy and motorcycle but because of the date:

 

The Allied Armies entered Germany simultaneously on 1 December 1918--they were still required by the terms of the Armistice to maintain 25KM distance from the retreating German Army. When the AEF Third Army reached the German border in late November they paused for regrouping and to care for their many sick soldiers--Spanish flu and Mumps--The pause actually was a good thing because the presence of so many Doughboys in Luxembourg helped to quell the Bolshevik's plans to create a revolution there.

 

So the question is: What is this guy doing in Germany some 18 days before the rest of the AEF? and who took his picture? Looks like two possible answers: The writer was in error and this picture was actually made in December or, there is one heck of a neat story out there that somebody needs to write.

 

Knowing that most of the German Army was still hunkered down in front of the Allied Armies on 12 November and nobody was moving --the Third Army wasn't even officially organized until 14 November --so I would suspect the date is wrong but boy I'm sure hoping somebody out there knows more about this guy and his bike because that would have been an interesting adventure.

Al

 

 

A Harley Davidson motorcycle and side car enters Germany on November 12, 1918. Of interest is the fact that the sidecar bears the initials “M.D.S.” indicating that the vehicle belongs to the Motor Dispatch Service. Close inspection reveals that the rider is wearing a dark colored brassard on his left arm, which also probably bears the initials “M.D.S.” indicating that he is a messenger bearing dispatches

 

AFB
"When in doubt, Go cyclical"

 

For more information on

"In a Strange Land: The American Occupation of Germany 1918-1923"

"Let's Go! The History of the 29th Infantry Division"

"To Hell with the Kaiser: America Prepares for War 1916-1918 Volumes 1 and 2"

"Desert Uniforms, Patches, and Insignia of the US Armed Forces"

"Forgotten Soldiers of WWI: America's Immigrant Doughboys"

"Play Ball! Doughboys and Baseball During the Great War"

go to

https://www.amazon.com/author/alexanderf.barnes

Link to post
Share on other sites

This is a very famous photo to Harley-Davidson fans. The story behind it is that the driver Corporal Ray Holtz and a captain who was in the side car were captured the night of November 8th, 1918. Holtz told the captain they were going the wrong way and the dim officer refused to believe him. The captain ordered Holtz to stop at a farm house to ask direction. The house happened to be a German command post which led to their capture. When the war ended they were released and Holtz rode into Germany to look around. From what I remember of the stor he went into a German town and then returned west to allied own lines later that day.

SEE MY BASEBALL CARD PROJECT: www.studiogaryc.com/baseball-blog/

SEE MY VINTAGE POSTER ART: www.studiogaryc.com

Link to post
Share on other sites

Gary---that is an interesting story....any idea of what unit he belonged to?

 

A quick review of the West Point Atlas of American Wars and the American Battlefield Commission maps shows most of the AEF had large areas of France or the countries of Belgium and Luxembourg between them and the German border. Maybe it was the 7th which was still in the area near the Lorraine front---

 

 

regards,

Al

This is a very famous photo to Harley-Davidson fans. The story behind it is that the driver Corporal Ray Holtz and a captain who was in the side car were captured the night of November 8th, 1918. Holtz told the captain they were going the wrong way and the dim officer refused to believe him. The captain ordered Holtz to stop at a farm house to ask direction. The house happened to be a German command post which led to their capture. When the war ended they were released and Holtz rode into Germany to look around. From what I remember of the stor he went into a German town and then returned west to allied own lines later that day.

 

AFB
"When in doubt, Go cyclical"

 

For more information on

"In a Strange Land: The American Occupation of Germany 1918-1923"

"Let's Go! The History of the 29th Infantry Division"

"To Hell with the Kaiser: America Prepares for War 1916-1918 Volumes 1 and 2"

"Desert Uniforms, Patches, and Insignia of the US Armed Forces"

"Forgotten Soldiers of WWI: America's Immigrant Doughboys"

"Play Ball! Doughboys and Baseball During the Great War"

go to

https://www.amazon.com/author/alexanderf.barnes

Link to post
Share on other sites

I seem to recall he was captured and put in a local prison in Belgium. If you search around for his name I'm sure some detailed articles will come up. Harley-Davidson has used Holtz and that picture in the advertising and magazine since the war. A call to their museum might get even more detail, they are meticulous record keepers.

SEE MY BASEBALL CARD PROJECT: www.studiogaryc.com/baseball-blog/

SEE MY VINTAGE POSTER ART: www.studiogaryc.com

Link to post
Share on other sites

Here's another armband that us Third Army Nerds have come up with---It is being worn by a member of the AFG color guard for Memorial Day 1922 in Coblenz---It says "Veterans of Foreign Wars V.F.W." Note: Post 700 was the VFW post most of these guys belonged to.

post-2235-0-35001500-1415654110.jpg

AFB
"When in doubt, Go cyclical"

 

For more information on

"In a Strange Land: The American Occupation of Germany 1918-1923"

"Let's Go! The History of the 29th Infantry Division"

"To Hell with the Kaiser: America Prepares for War 1916-1918 Volumes 1 and 2"

"Desert Uniforms, Patches, and Insignia of the US Armed Forces"

"Forgotten Soldiers of WWI: America's Immigrant Doughboys"

"Play Ball! Doughboys and Baseball During the Great War"

go to

https://www.amazon.com/author/alexanderf.barnes

Link to post
Share on other sites

and here's a whole group from the same ceremony including civilians with the armband---Note that they are forming up in front of the American Legion Hall in Coblenz.

post-2235-0-96815400-1415654376.jpg

AFB
"When in doubt, Go cyclical"

 

For more information on

"In a Strange Land: The American Occupation of Germany 1918-1923"

"Let's Go! The History of the 29th Infantry Division"

"To Hell with the Kaiser: America Prepares for War 1916-1918 Volumes 1 and 2"

"Desert Uniforms, Patches, and Insignia of the US Armed Forces"

"Forgotten Soldiers of WWI: America's Immigrant Doughboys"

"Play Ball! Doughboys and Baseball During the Great War"

go to

https://www.amazon.com/author/alexanderf.barnes

Link to post
Share on other sites

Another note: by this time the Army had re-established enlisted rank for both sleeves---so even with 4 overseas stripes and one hash mark, this guy is still a private....rank was tough in those days....

 

 

and happy 239th Birthday to all of the brothers

Semper Fi,

Al

Here's another armband that us Third Army Nerds have come up with---It is being worn by a member of the AFG color guard for Memorial Day 1922 in Coblenz---It says "Veterans of Foreign Wars V.F.W." Note: Post 700 was the VFW post most of these guys belonged to.

 

 

AFB
"When in doubt, Go cyclical"

 

For more information on

"In a Strange Land: The American Occupation of Germany 1918-1923"

"Let's Go! The History of the 29th Infantry Division"

"To Hell with the Kaiser: America Prepares for War 1916-1918 Volumes 1 and 2"

"Desert Uniforms, Patches, and Insignia of the US Armed Forces"

"Forgotten Soldiers of WWI: America's Immigrant Doughboys"

"Play Ball! Doughboys and Baseball During the Great War"

go to

https://www.amazon.com/author/alexanderf.barnes

Link to post
Share on other sites

Here's another guy in the same detachment ---I'm guessing that they were either shiny silver or white with black or blue lettering---

Best for Vet's day to all of the Vets here and their families

 

S/F

Al

post-2235-0-56603700-1415743338.jpg

AFB
"When in doubt, Go cyclical"

 

For more information on

"In a Strange Land: The American Occupation of Germany 1918-1923"

"Let's Go! The History of the 29th Infantry Division"

"To Hell with the Kaiser: America Prepares for War 1916-1918 Volumes 1 and 2"

"Desert Uniforms, Patches, and Insignia of the US Armed Forces"

"Forgotten Soldiers of WWI: America's Immigrant Doughboys"

"Play Ball! Doughboys and Baseball During the Great War"

go to

https://www.amazon.com/author/alexanderf.barnes

Link to post
Share on other sites

Al -

What a treat this is...I don't recall a WWI era VFW brassard ever being documented in photos before.

-Chuck

WANTED!

WWI Aero Squadron items such as insignia, uniforms & my favorite- PHOTOS! Will purchase or work out a possible trade

HIGHLY SOUGHT- Anything related to the AEF Photo Sections or 85th,258th & 278th Aero Squadrons.

To be alone, to have your life in your own hands, to use your own skill, single-handed, against the enemy. It was like the lists of the Middle Ages, the only sphere in modern warfare where a man saw his adversary and faced him in mortal combat, the only sphere where there was still chivalry and honour. If you won, it was your own bravery and skill; if you lost, it was because you had met a better man
-Cecil Lewis


donation2008.gifdonation2009.gif

Link to post
Share on other sites

Here's a nice visual reference of the "1st Corps I" brassard as seen in post #129 by 'KurtA'. This image is a cropped version of the larger original portrait. My best guess on a time frame is the immediate postwar/Occupation era.

Great documentation of the I Corps brassard, Chuck!

 

This is a fascinating thread. I have revisited many times to see what new things appear!

Top dollar paid for WWI AEF Tank Corps uniforms, medal groups, equipment and photos,
unit histories and rosters...especially anything associated with

301st (Heavy) Tank Bn
Drop me an email and let me know what you have.

 

donation2015.gifdonation2016.gif

Link to post
Share on other sites

Forgive me if I have posted this one before...I have long thought this was an oddity.

 

I always thought that the Red Cross nurse was wearing a General Staff Corps armband, but that just doesn't make too much sense, being that the photo was taken in a Cedar Rapids, Iowa, studio.

 

post-949-0-86620500-1416001519.jpg

 

Preparing it for posting here, I am more inclined to think it is just a "gold star" on a crepe armband.

 

post-949-0-52241400-1416001542.jpg

JAG

Top dollar paid for WWI AEF Tank Corps uniforms, medal groups, equipment and photos,
unit histories and rosters...especially anything associated with

301st (Heavy) Tank Bn
Drop me an email and let me know what you have.

 

donation2015.gifdonation2016.gif

Link to post
Share on other sites

Jag - cool photo of the nurse. Could her brassard be red, white and blue, possibly some sort of patriotic armband?

 

KurtA - thanks for posting more brassards from your recent brassard haul. I'm pretty sure that the two red Transport Police and the yellow Transport Commander are British made.

 

The British Army had a wide variety of brassards in a rainbow of colors for every purpose and occasion. I think it was the British Army's use of brassards that influenced the AEF to adopt them. Many of the British designs and colors were copied outright by the AEF.

 

Does anybody know or have any guesses as to what the initials 'F' and 'S' represent in the white "Railway Guard F.S. Service" brassard?

 

Thanks to all for posting.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Here is a Motor Dispatch Service (MDS) shoulder patch, recently posted by TCS Shultz that belonged to Private Alfred J. Labrie who served in the 1st Army, HQ Regiment’s Motor Dispatch Service, presumably as a messenger. Here’s a link for anyone interested in looking at the content of that post:

 

http://www.usmilitariaforum.com/forums/index.php?/topic/223981-wwi-ww1-us-1st-army-hq-reg-motor-dispatch-service-mds-patch/?hl=%2Bmotor+%2Bdispatch+%2Bservice

 

I’ve posted it here because the background color of the SSI is similar to that of the MDS brassard that was shown earlier in this post. Is this just a coincidence or could there be some significance to the amber/orange background color?

post-5143-0-32969100-1416040290.jpg

Link to post
Share on other sites

Recalling that I had a poor quality photo of MDS riders from the 369th Regiment, 93rd Division, I decided to check to see if any of the messengers wore a similar insignia. Sadly, they did not. However, I did notice what appear to be dark colored brassards being worn on the left forearm of at least two of the messengers, as well as some sort of SSI or unusual rank insignia on the upper left arm of one of men.

 

Also of interest is the mix of U.S. and French Army steel helmets and the fact that just one motorcycle is present, yet there are five bicycles!

post-5143-0-91403100-1416040340.jpg

Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

By using this site, you agree to our Terms of Use.