jackconaway Posted April 7, 2014 Share #1 Posted April 7, 2014 this is a example of a fake ww2 3rd pattern usmc first aid pouch. note the lack of markings on the inside of the male snaps. and the flimsy fabric securing the hook. this type of thin fabric has been seen on many other fakes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jackconaway Posted April 7, 2014 Author Share #2 Posted April 7, 2014 ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jackconaway Posted April 8, 2014 Author Share #3 Posted April 8, 2014 ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jackconaway Posted April 8, 2014 Author Share #4 Posted April 8, 2014 ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gunbunnyB/3/75FA Posted April 8, 2014 Share #5 Posted April 8, 2014 i have also seen these sold as prewwII miners pouches as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bellasilva Posted April 8, 2014 Share #6 Posted April 8, 2014 Not trying to be forum police or anything but I'm pretty sure there's a thread you started on this pouch from a few days ago in the "real or what?" section. Maybe you can ask a mod to consolidate the comments because it can be a good reference for those such as myself who are taking interest in USMC field gear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jackconaway Posted April 8, 2014 Author Share #7 Posted April 8, 2014 Not trying to be forum police or anything but I'm pretty sure there's a thread you started on this pouch from a few days ago in the "real or what?" section. Maybe you can ask a mod to consolidate the comments because it can be a good reference for those such as myself who are taking interest in USMC field gear. i cross posted pretty much the same thing to field and personal gear for reference Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve1987 Posted April 8, 2014 Share #8 Posted April 8, 2014 Hi Jack, You're right this is a fake pouch. I've been doing my homework on this fake for a while after foolishly buying one before all the details were known. These are much better than the typical weathered re-enactment grade fakes and were made to deceive collectors. I bought mine from a member here on USMF and I don't believe he knew better at the time of sale. This pouch has tricked some very advanced USMC collectors and those who have one shouldn't feel too bad about falling for it. It's probably best to consolidate your posts on the topic to this one thread. This is the forum where most USMC gear collectors hang out. I wouldn't be surprised if the fellow you dealt with knows who the 'artist' is. The seller of the pouch shown above goes by the e-bay handle 'mrnva' and I believe this is the fellow who has sold many fake USMC gear items at the SOS. 'mrnva' has also sold these fake pouches on e-bay: 'mrnva' has also sold this very advanced fake DQP shovel cover: Amongst his listings you will often find fake "rigger made" items and the infamous "DQP shovel" that is actually French post-war surplus. He has some good items from time to time. I have bought the occasional original item from him, however I don't think I would deal with him again. I've noticed he often buys good groupings to piece out in separate auctions -- not something I'm morally a fan of but that's where he's usually getting the authentic stuff. Of course 'mrnva' will not listen to reason, I think it's pretty obvious at this point what's going on here. The sad news is that when we post this sort of information the fakers are taking notes as well, and that's been a personal hesitation for me to dive into this subject. Ultimately the gig is up on this pouch and it's exposed for what it is. -Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jackconaway Posted April 8, 2014 Author Share #9 Posted April 8, 2014 i have a $225 fake shovel cover from him that i bought at the show... i actually purchased the pouch that i posted pictures of as well. but returned it because two and two came together and i figured out it was fake... he sold THREE fake helmet covers at the show to unsuspecting buyers. not a single one under $400... a real shame Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kabar44 Posted April 8, 2014 Share #10 Posted April 8, 2014 I received a message today from Steve1987 regarding the pouch that he purchased from me. I have offered to refund his money in full minus shipping. I'm not fully convinced that the pouch is fake for two reasons. First reason, the snaps are marked inside Carr 13 which predates i believe, the United Carr merger. Second reason, I purchased the pouch back in 1994 or 1995. I'm not sure that anyone was making these back in that part of the '90s. On the known fakes, are any known to be marked on the inside of the female snaps ? if so, what marking ? I'm having a hard time believing this piece was a fake. Maybe it is, if so I apologize to the community and to Steve1987. For what it's worth, I bought the pouch( at a gun show) from a guy named Jake Hunley from Arizona who was visiting the Richmond area where he originally came from before retiring and removing to Arizona. There are some pics of the pouch here http://www.usmilitariaforum.com/forums/index.php?/topic/102236-usmc-phila-depot-first-aid-pouches-final-types/page-3 that I sold to Steve1987. Scott Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve1987 Posted April 8, 2014 Share #11 Posted April 8, 2014 Hi Scott, It's very kind of you to stop by and offer to refund that pouch -- thanks!! I never thought there was any foul play involved when I bought it from you, and I think it's really nice of you to make that offer. I was just referencing above that many advanced USMC collectors bought these, including myself, with no idea at the time. I will work on a more in depth and deserved reply to this topic. I have enough originals here to show the many differences between the above pouches are original examples. I noticed this is a touchy subject lately, and a very interesting topic. Unfortunately it deserves a more in depth explanation than I can provide this evening. -Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kabar44 Posted April 9, 2014 Share #12 Posted April 9, 2014 Note, his name was Jess Hundley, not Jake Hundley, and he was last known to be in New Mexico about 4-5 years ago. This comes from a friend who was in a SF reserve group here in Va. with Hundly back in the 80's Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GIJive Posted April 9, 2014 Share #13 Posted April 9, 2014 I'd be careful about labeling something a fake just because the snaps don't have United Carr on the male portion. The USMC camouflage uniforms that used the snaps as fasteners for the blouse and the trousers fly are quite often unmarked. Several contractors made the snaps, they were not exclusively made by United Carr. United Carr seems to show up more often later in the war, but many early snaps were unmarked on the depot made items such as the early canteen covers. Fasteners marked Scovill are also commonly found on uniform items. IMHO, the photo of the first aid pouch doesn't look at all like a fake. Could someone explain what is the dead giveaway on the shovel cover being fake? Of course, I would reserve judgement on the shovel cover until seeing it in person, but I don't see any obvious red flags from the examples shown. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
etienne Posted April 10, 2014 Share #14 Posted April 10, 2014 Well, a few recent posts on different threads make me feel there is much questioning about Depot made FA pouches and shovel covers. So if new informations have to be released, in order to make the difference between legit and fake items, I think USMF is the best place to do that. Sorry if I'm might be rude, but saying items are fakes without further explanation is totally irrelevant ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uplandmod Posted April 10, 2014 Share #15 Posted April 10, 2014 Jackconaway who started this thread was banned for a second time today. I questioned much what he was saying and it turns out he was the one trying to sell fake items all along! Leonardo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve1987 Posted April 10, 2014 Share #16 Posted April 10, 2014 Jackconaway who started this thread was banned for a second time today. I questioned much what he was saying and it turns out he was the one trying to sell fake items all along! Leonardo Hi Leonardo, I do not know Jack other than a few private messages and a small trade a few weeks ago. Can you please explain to us what fake items he was selling? I did notice his fake shovel cover was listed on e-bay at one point. I think he's a younger collector and perhaps rushing some things and making some mistakes along the way in how he posts and deals with fakes. Now, I disagree with how Jack brought up the issue, but I absolutely feel he was correct about the pouches in question in this thread and yours. This is based on my own long standing opinion and I'm not entirely sure how he also discovered they were fake. I've been spending the last couple days putting together in depth article on the questionable pouches, including the ones shown above. I've been corresponding with a lot of other collectors on this topic as well including other members who own multiple originals and I'm not the only advanced DQP collector who feels this way. I will try to get my article posted tonight. There are many reasons why the pouches in question were not made at the Philadelphia Depot. I am almost 100% certain these are not authentic. More to follow shortly.... Regards, -Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uplandmod Posted April 10, 2014 Share #17 Posted April 10, 2014 It's explained here when he was banned the first time around: http://www.usmilitariaforum.com/forums/index.php?/topic/182282-very-strange-usmc-helmet-cover/page-2&do=findComment&comment=1618195 Steve, I really am intrested in reading about your research concerning these pouches but because of Jackconways way of approaching this subject it sort of set the subject off on the wrong tone. I believe both of us agree going onto a thread and declaring everything a fake without anything to back their statement is the wrong way to discuss the subject ( this is NOT directed towards you but how Con Way approached mine and others pouches here on USMF). The very thought of declaring items fake while trying to sell a faked helmet is unacceptable. I hope you can understand why I'm somewhat hot about the subject right now. I am looking forward to reading your research. I do believe there is a unknown history to these pouches but I don't believe they are fakes either. Hopefully you will shed some light on the subject. Leonardo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve1987 Posted April 10, 2014 Share #18 Posted April 10, 2014 Hi Leonardo, Thanks for the update on the Con Way situation. I wasn't exactly sure what was going on with him, but knew something was up. Since he's been banned, I don't think we'll have any more potential problems. To avoid the drama surrounding this member I'll start a new thread when my article is complete and we can have a serious discussion on the pouches in question at that point. I know some members are patiently waiting for my post on this topic but I don't want to take any shortcuts with the photography. Perhaps at that point the mods can lock all these old threads by Jack and we can consolidate all the information into one thread. Cheers, -Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
etienne Posted April 10, 2014 Share #19 Posted April 10, 2014 I'll start a new thread when my article is complete and we can have a serious discussion on the pouches in question at that point. I know some members are patiently waiting for my post on this topic but I don't want to take any shortcuts with the photography. Great, I'm looking forward to reading your review ... and I hope I won't have bad news about my pouches Regards, E Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kabar44 Posted April 12, 2014 Share #20 Posted April 12, 2014 I'm scheduling an appointment with one of the curators at Quantico to look at the pouches held in storage. Will be between May 5-9. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeleliuMarine1944 Posted March 23, 2016 Share #21 Posted March 23, 2016 Damn thats an excellent fake! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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