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M1892 USMC Span-Am Spiked Helmet


BelligerentBlue
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BelligerentBlue

Well, this was today's pickup. I was at a local show, saw it last night, went home and studied and pondered it. Went back again today and pondered it more, then decided to heck with it and bought it.

 

I know you don't see many of these, and went based off a members fairly recent sale of one on their website to determine if I thought I was getting a fair deal and if it was a real one. All in all, I made an offer, and since this is changing hands from one Marine to another, he accepted. (or maybe I was just the sucker) Now I don't know too much about these, I do know that the chin strap or belt is missing. But everything else is there.

 

I'm curious to know:

1) What everyone thinks, good, bad or indifferent on quality/ originality. I do believe the EGA and cover are original based on the homework I was able to do.

2) What the actual "going" rate for these are. Curious to know if I paid too little/ just right/ or too dang much.

3) Where I MIGHT be able to track down the strap.

 

I think that's it. So other than that. Enjoy.

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BelligerentBlue

Stamp. (sorry, I tried to shrink them, but still too big to add more than one per post.)

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Blue, I commented earlier on your post the other day. You are probably referencing the same one I saw for sale and mentioned in that post. Can you show a pic of the stitching of the buttons under the sweatband? You might be check Turner-Laughlin sales for the strap and button. They sell both repro and original parts. Kevin

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BelligerentBlue

A view of the prongs... I'll be honest. These made me nervous. I know nothing about them and what they should be or how they should look.

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BelligerentBlue

Kevin... I'm kind of concerned now. I know that the one I referenced had sewn buttons. This one does not. The one was loose. So I took it off. You can see where something was sewn there at one time. Here is a picture of the button that is on it.

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From the front, the emblem looks right as rain. Can't speak on the prongs without seeing the actual rear of the bird, but at worst I'd say it is a modified/repaired original. I'd like to see the rear of the spike baseplate and how it's attached internally (prongs in addition to the screw?), also you have two of the same buttons on there, one should be more of a closed loop

 

Sadly, original chinstraps are the hardest part to find of these

 

The pristineness of the sweatband and stamp (lack of stains, etc) puzzles me. I'd also like to see how the buttons are attached. They were generally screwed into a type of washer and the washer was stitched into the helmet, so if that's what you referred to by stitched in then right you are!

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Is that the only QM mark in there? Mine is also a Horstmann, but a 190? contract date (can't read the last number anymore). It has a different QM mark, and also a marking by the Inspector of the helmet under the sweatband. The brass looks awfully beat up for the condition of the helmet being practically unissued...highly polished down details on the EGA, the globe actually dented, screwposts bent. Then the helmet looks unbattered and unsweat in. Makes me wonder if this is a put together helmet with original parts, not an uncommon practice

 

Is there a ghost behind the EGA or is that the camera flash?

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BelligerentBlue

That's the only QM mark. At the show I thought it was a ghost, but then my brain is finally coming back to me. It's probably just dust around the edges since it's felt. I feel okay about the EGA. but not feeling good about anything else right now.

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the buttons look fine, just two of the same unless one's closed loop was twisted open. The Horstmann stamp looks good, too. All the tarnish looks honest. Lack of QM marks don't mean anything necessarily, the one sold by the other forum member had no markings according to the description. It's hard to go off images of these, being so dark and all, hands-on is really the way to go

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Blue I agree with all said by Brig, I know full offs book makes a big deal out of the pentagon shape stitching on the button washer which was supposedly specific to these as opposed the army ones. Like Brig says, real answers probably come from inspecting it in hand. Nice 1/6 helmet you picked up by the way. My avatar reveals I am a bit partial. Kevin

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The button washers in this particular piece are missing, so no way to see stitching on them. Very likely the side buttons were replaced over the years since the originals probably disappeared around the time of the washers, or the washers were intentionally removed as they appear to be in mine to make way for custom replacement sidebuttons crafted from actual uniform buttons, which stick out further and look more detailed/sharper. May have been a practice back in the day, or with a certain detachment, etc (I'm sure I likely kicked the hornets nest with that idea)

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Leatherneck72

If you show the top view of the spike assembly, unscrew the EGA and show the back, it will reveal more to those in the know.

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The helmet body itself is identical to the mint condition originals that the old Philadelphia military supplier, Stokes-Kirk had in stock as late as the very early 1970's. They primarily made them up as Army Cavalry Helmets. I would guess someone took one of those and applied USMC hardware. Did the USMC use this exact style helmet body? If yes and if the front EGA is good, it would be a nice example.

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BelligerentBlue

Sorry all, I had to run out for a little. In a couple PM talks with people and on here. I guess the consensus is that the buttons are right. The EGA itself is a 3 prong and never had a stud. In the PM messages, I was informed on the ways to tell from the front on these, some of which I knew, and those all check out. I have no clue on the solder, though in my non expert eye, it looks newer? But it honestly looks 50/50. I have no clue on if I caught one that slipped through the cracks. I'll supply whatever pictures are needed for those that know more than me. I'll start by adding the back of the EGA and the front of the helmet without EGA. If you need better pictures, please let me know.

 

Kevin, as far as the 1/6 helmet. I've been trying to track one down for a little while now. Though not to be greedy, I'd like more and eventually a uniform when it comes around. Having served with them on my two tours, they hold a special place in my heart.

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BelligerentBlue

Last of the back. Top view. Fairly certain the top is original. That being said, I can tell you the back loop WAS there at one time. Also, let me know if a different picture of the top is needed.

Thanks for all the help guys. Hopefully this will not only help me, but others too.

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Solder looks fairly newer in those images, the top looks like it may have been soldered over an old stabilizing post or some such

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I think it's an AWESOME helmet. But, I am a novice. It's the one thing in my collection that I don't have. Mr. Manifor had one for sale a few months ago that I missed. If you ever want to sell it or know someone who has one for sale, please let me know. Again, I am a NOVICE and know nothing about anything old (or new lately)

SF
Chuck

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