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Battleship Maine Salvage Relic ID Tags


Wharfmaster
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This is sort of a head scratcher. It is a pair of name tags that I assume were made from salvaged steel from the sunken Battleship Maine in Cuba, 1905. The tags are found on a Navy Key Ring. I believe the men on the tags were brothers. I can't find any connection with them and the Navy. The Maine was not completely salvaged until 1910. Perhaps the tags were made by the locals to sell to tourists when they visited the wreck, who knows.

 

Any ideas ?

 

 

W

post-525-0-19826800-1391562166.jpg

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My guess is that they may have been employed in the salvage operation. Or possibly acquired it as a souvenir given the specific date.

 

RC

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My guess is that they may have been employed in the salvage operation. Or possibly acquired it as a souvenir given the specific date.

 

RC

Agreed. I could be wrong but they look authentic to a period dated dog tag and I couldn't see them as a tourist item.

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I think it is more likely these tags are from the USS Maine that was commissioned after the one that exploded. Look up BB-10. I suspect you could track the fellows name to the ship's roster to confirm it.

 

http://www.history.navy.mil/photos/sh-usn/usnsh-m/bb10.htm

 

These are probably not dog tags either. More likely tags used to indicate tools or weapons (or parts of them) that where checked out or to mark personal items like ditty boxes.....or personal spaces....like the hooks for their hammocks or "billets".

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I think it is more likely these tags are from the USS Maine that was commissioned after the one that exploded. Look up BB-10. I suspect you could track the fellows name to the ship's roster to confirm it.

 

That is certainly possible. With 'Maine' items provenance is the key to unlocking the history.

 

RC

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Both tags are very heavily and deeply pitted and that would lead one to believe the metal was salvaged. The side that is stamped has been smoothed. Note that the tags are not the same size and appear handmade. If they were tool or gear tags, the size would probably be identical and both sides should be in about the same condition. Both tags have the same date to two men that were brothers. One was born in 1860 and the other 1866 so they were not young men in 1905 and probably not sailors.

 

I think a sailor would stamp the tags USS, not USBS. A person making tags to sell tourists might.

 

 

W

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I agree the tags were made from used scrap material, probably on board or maybe in a ship yard. However, after a quick search, and it looks like the salvage operations for the Spanish American War Maine did not start until 1910:

 

http://www.spanamwar.com/mainsalv.htm

 

I agree the "USBS" is a bit odd. However, the Navy was still using the "USFS" (United States Fighting Ship) designation after the war, and the second Maine was using that designation in 1905.

 

The Navy used "USFS"during and before the war as well, but I have never researched the Navy's exact rules for using it. It is often seen used on capital ship naval correspondence from this period, but much less so on things like Naval Cap Ribbons. Both USFS and USS were used at the same time for the same ship.

 

I also don't think the shape of these are random. My feeble brain is not coming up with the exact usage, but I think these are "keys".....or were originally keys for holding something in place. Meaning, it is hard to know if they were last used for their original function or not.

 

If I were to make a guess, these were used keys, which would explain the rough surface on one side. What is hard to know is if the marking was to indicate the fellow that installed the key in the first place or if they were salvaged after a repair, and then marked and reused. My suspicion is marked and reused for another function.

 

Given you have researched the age of these fellows, it would be interesting to research the names further, and sort out exactly where they and the second Maine were on that date. You may well be right, maybe these are souvenirs from a ship board tour.

 

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Much of the Maine was above water after it sank in Havana Harbor. It would have been very easy for locals or anyone with a boat to remove pieces of wreckage.

 

The US Government "dragged their feet" removing the wreck until the Cubans practically forced them to do it in 1910.

 

 

W

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At this point your best course of action is to find out the particulars of the men the tags are named to, and where they lived in 1905.

 

For what it is worth, the stamped tags could be from some salvaged metal of the Maine, but I am not convinced the armory tag is. The ship sat underwater for a long time. The condition of the Lee-Navy rifles and Colt revolvers was not too great if I recall. The rifles were sold off by Bannerman's. I would have expected the tag to have exhibited some sign of corrosion if it had sat in the ship between 1898 and 1905.

 

What is the armory tag made of?

 

RC

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Both men were from Iowa and were in business together, living in Seattle, WA in 1910. William C. was still in Iowa in 1900. Do not know where George C. was in 1900.

Tags were found in an antique shop during a visit to Seattle.

 

The middle initials of both men look like Os in the photo but they are Cs.

 

The armory tag looks like it is made of zinc or aluminum and is almost certainly later, probably WW1 vintage or later. It is probably unrelated to the steel tags.

 

 

W

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It is a little hard to tell if the month in the date is for March or August, but from what I can tell, it looks like the second USS Maine was in the Atlantic, mostly along the southern coast of the US in 1905. With the Spanish American War Maine in Havana harbor, I am not sure how two forty something guys living in Seattle fit into the picture....either picture.

 

Moran Brothers Shipyard was in Seattle, and working on the USS Nebraska at the time. I wonder if these guys might have worked there, or at the Navy Yard in Bremerton. Am not exactly sure how that connection would relate to the tags, but it might at least provide some sort of tie.

 

I think this is going to be a tough mystery to crack.

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After my last post it dawned on me that we might not be looking at something correctly. I am starting to think that these tags are from the first Maine, but the numbers are not a date. If we assume that, then things possibly fall into place.

 

USBS is a designation sometimes used for the first Maine. If we back these tags up ten years, say to around 1895 or about when the ship was built, then that opens up some new possibilities. Maybe these guys were early crew members or worked on building it....or at least a part of it.

 

Maybe the numbers represent a setting, a part number, or are dates, but a future date....like a service reminder. To me, it makes sense that these might be associated with the Maine that sunk, but were not on it when it went down.....your guys already had them in their pockets.

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Grump my friend, your guess is as good as mine. I'm stumped.

 

Sadly, I think that may be where we are at. Sometimes, it can take years to figure these things out.

 

Question: Have you done any research to see if these guys were ever in the Navy?

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Both men are found in the 1930 Census and does not indicate they were veterans.

 

Perhaps they sailed for Seattle in 1905 via the east coast and stopped to visit Havana on the way. Just a guess.

 

 

W

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Could also be the home state of the person named on the tag, and nothing else. Back then, what state you were from was a huge deal as people rarely ever moved then...

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Monkey wrench time-----

U S Barrier Surveying * United States Beaufort Sea * United States Building Services * * U S Biological Survey * US Bureau of Standards * United States Benchmark Stations * United States Biological Survey *
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Can't find any connection with the State of Maine, concerning the two men. Note also that both tags have been made in the shape of a tombstone.

 

 

W

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........ Note also that both tags have been made in the shape of a tombstone.

W

This is starting to get scary, Wharf! When does the ancient cures get introduced?? :o

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  • 11 months later...
  • 4 weeks later...

Just a random thought, but perhaps what looks like a date on there is - but an expiration. Of access maybe, or of some authorization? I dunno.

 

Would a docent or curator on the current USS Olympia in Philly be worth contacting to see if they have ever seen anything like it? Different ship and all of course, but perhaps a source of current working knowledge of such old things?

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