Wool Service Coat, Spec. 1049 Depot Modified to Spec. 1125

[Mitter2k1]

Here's one of my recent acquisitions, a M1912 wool coat. It has rimless eagle buttons and tapered shoulder boards. The pocket flaps are pointed and the sleeves have the typical 2 rows of stitching. It is named and the tag is present and legible. Here's the tag as it was difficult to photograph.

Morris Busch

11--12--10

Philadelphia

Philadelphia Depot

QM Dept. USA

MAR 16, 1912

Hos. W. MacNeal

Examiner

Another interesting feature is the 3 hooks that help hold the front shut. They start 3" below the bottom button and are spaced approximately 3" apart and end at the bottom. Is this standard or an added feature on these coats?

Thanks for looking,

Mike

[GIl Sanow]

Interesting that it has the older 1903 era buttons -- the newer rimmed were adopted in 1912, so perhaps they used up the old stock first.

 

I think the hooks and eyes were added by the soldier.

 

G

[Mitter2k1]

Thanks for that info. I wasn't sure when the rimmed buttons were adopted. Would 1912 be the same time they switched over to the rimmed snaps on field gear as well?

The tag however is odd to me, or maybe I'm reading it wrong. But does the 11-12-10 mean Nov. 12, 1910? Or is that another number all together?

Thanks,

Mike

[Dr_rambow]

That's very nice. I love seeing the realy dated uniforms, far fewer of them out there.

[Mitter2k1]

Thank you. I've recently strayed a little from the WWI time frame and purchased a couple of earlier items. Bheskett warned me about eagle snap belts the other day and I'm starting to think my wallet is going get lighter this year the more I look at early web belts and uniforms.

Thanks,

Mike

[GIl Sanow]

The label date is for the contract. The red acceptance stamp tells when it was delivered. I suspect the specifications (patterns) for the coat changed at least once during the period of the contract -- the rimless buttons date to when the contract started. The Army had the buttons made by a different contractor, but probably required the old stock be used before the new design. You have a true transitional coat.

 

In the old spec, it called for pointed cuffs. I have a coat with the new standing collar, flat pockets, pointed cuffs and rimless buttons -- another true transitional!

 

G

[Mitter2k1]

Thank you for that info. I am aware of the pointed cuffs but I honestly don't know what they look like. Do you have a photo available that you could share?

Thanks again,

Mike

[US Victory Museum]

Gil called it correctly.

 

The lable shows the contract date of Nov. 12th 1910. Had your blouse been made closer to that date, then it would have appeared very

much different: it would have French cuffs (pointed cuffs), a stand-fall collar with two pair of grommet holes on each side for the double disks

as worn by enlisted men; moreover, the pockets would have gussets.

 

Yours is a transitional blouse having been made in 1912 and would be an excellent item to represent the Mexican Punitive Expedition era

(1916), just a few years later.

 

Kudos for your good fortune.

[US Victory Museum]

Thank you for that info. I am aware of the pointed cuffs but I honestly don't know what they look like. Do you have a photo available that you could share?

Thanks again,

Mike

 

 

Although this blose is summer cotton, the winter wool would be identical. This particular image was posted by USMF member Ludwigh1980

of an article in his collection. Further images from his post show that the contract date is from Nov. 10th, 1910 (Only two days earlier!)

Msn

 

 

[Kration]

Here's my example.. an identical jacket with the same date...

Kration

[Kration]

tag

[Mitter2k1]

Thank you guys for the info! It is cool when you can see the changes that were made during the transition.

 

Thanks again,

 

Mike

[GIl Sanow]

Well, I got back into my collection closet and found two coats similar to yours. I thought I only had the one. One, made by Busch in Philadelphia, also has a 1910 contact date tag -- unfortunately there is no legible acceptance stamp, but I suspect it too would have been 1912.

 

The second has an illegible stamp -- nothing readable at all. That's the one with the rimless buttons and pointed cuffs, as above. The speculation is that perhaps this manufacturer was way ahead in making sleeves when the sleeves, pockets and collars changed, so they used what they had rather than discarding them.

 

It needs to be understood that the seamstresses who assembled these things did not assemble the whole coat. They worked on parts only -- perhaps the body, the sleeves, the lining, etc., then someone assembled the sub-parts into the whole. In fact, many worked at home, rather than in the factory. They were paid on a piece work basis, not by the hour. (This explains the so-called "Cutters tags" sometimes found on mint condition garments. The tags came in several sections -- as each part was completed, the seamstress detached part of the tag. She turned these in for pay when the parts were completed. The person who assembled the parts also detached another part of the tag for the same reason. If it still has the tags, one can assume it was never issued.)

 

G

[Mitter2k1]

The knowledge on here will never cease to amaze me. I had envisioned a factory environment with the coats be assembled in a assembly line fashion.

I have a question about your coats and in general about the wool coats. My coat has shoulder pads built into it. Is that common with the earlier coats?

Thank you,

Mike

[GIl Sanow]

Final assembly of the sub-parts may have been done that way -- I am not sure.

 

My pointed cuff coat has none, the other has some padding inside the lining at the sleeve end. Is your padding like this or is it a separate pad sewn in the lining and visible?

 

G

[Mitter2k1]

It is visible. The part at the top of the pic is actually the armpit pad or what they used as a backer to help sew the sleeve to the body. The "blob" of whatnot below it is the shoulder padding.

Mike

[Mitter2k1]

But what it is sewn to I am not sure.

[GIl Sanow]

I suspect then that your shoulder pads were added by the soldier, or his tailor.

 

G

[Mitter2k1]

They could be. It is hard to tell since the bottom of the liner is sewn to the skirt of the coat and I didn't want to break the threads trying to force it. I was able to get it open enough to take a pic and it was sewn to the gray part at the top. I may carefully try to get another photo of it and examine it closer. But it looked like some recycled materials that were stuffed into it. All of this makes me wonder if these extras had a purpose. If the shoulder pads and flap hooks were not standard for this uniform, why did he have them? And I'm not sure if the liner was supposed to be sewn to the coat. It makes me think that maybe he was in some sort of Honor Guard or something to that effect. These all seem to be embellishments that wouldn't serve any purpose for a field uniform. If I can dig something up on the soldier, I may have an answer.

 

Thanks,

 

Mike

[19MJR91]

Mike,

 

I have a coat similar to this, at least in regards to the three hooks at the bottom. It only has one rimless eagle button though. I will take some pictures the next time I am around it so that you might compare. There is a faded tag in the collar of my coat, but unfortunately, I have no date to go off of.