CW4AFB Posted May 14, 2008 Share #1 Posted May 14, 2008 Gents---once again looking for a little help: trying to identify this blue stripe underneath the OS stripe on this 27th ID uniform---the Brass is US and MG/A and there is a Mexican border service, a WW1 victory ribbon with Star and what I think is either a Phillipine or China service ribbon---thoughts or good guesses? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shenkursk Posted May 14, 2008 Share #2 Posted May 14, 2008 Not an answer, but perhaps a lead for you: The Chicago Daily News War Book (some outstanding info, also some period printed misconceptions) lists some of the AEF Brassards that were used in the trenches. The BLUE brassard indicated "Agents and Signalmen." Now when I think of a brassard I think of a separate piece of cloth that is worn higher on the arm, but I have also had one or two uniforms with this interesting cuff detail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cwnorma Posted May 14, 2008 Share #3 Posted May 14, 2008 Gents---once again looking for a little help: trying to identify this blue stripe underneath the OS stripe on this 27th ID uniform---the Brass is US and MG/A and there is a Mexican border service, a WW1 victory ribbon with Star and what I think is either a Phillipine or China service ribbon---thoughts or good guesses? Arm Bands: General Orders HEADQUARTERS. A. E. F. No. 59 France, November 11, 1917. I. The following distinguishing marks for specialists, and individuals detailed for special duties which, on occasion, separate them from their organizations, are hereby prescribed: Guides and Scouts ----------------------------Green Arm Band Orderlies and Messenger (Runners)--------Red Arm band Agents and Signalmen-------------------------Blue Arm Band Carrying Parties (Munitions. Material, Food, Water)------------------------------------Yellow Arm Band Trench Cleaners--------------------------------White Arm Band Salvage Parties---------------------------------Khaki Arm Band with “Salvage”in red letters These bands will be one and one-half inches wide and, with the exception of orderlies to different headquarters, will be worn around the left fore-arm. Headquarters orderlies will wear the red band around the left upper arm. Men equipped with wire cutters will wear a piece of white tape tied to the right shoulder strap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CW4AFB Posted May 15, 2008 Author Share #4 Posted May 15, 2008 Arm Bands: General Orders HEADQUARTERS. A. E. F. No. 59 France, November 11, 1917. I. The following distinguishing marks for specialists, and individuals detailed for special duties which, on occasion, separate them from their organizations, are hereby prescribed: Agents and Signalmen-------------------------Blue Arm Band These bands will be one and one-half inches wide and, with the exception of orderlies to different headquarters, will be worn around the left fore-arm. Wow---nice work and fast......it certainly seems to meet the criteria and would make sense that an older trooper would make a good signalman---but it raises another question: What is an "agent" and what do they do? thanks again.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
QED4 Posted May 15, 2008 Share #5 Posted May 15, 2008 The only thing is, these were all jobs that people were detailed to rather then permanent jobs which is why they used arm bands and not patches or something permanently affixed to the uniform. This band appears to be embroidered or sewn to the uniform this seems like a lot of trouble and expensive to go to for something that may need to be removed at any time. I first thought it might be his going home uniform and had it done to impress the folks back home but there is no Discharge Stripe. This may well be Signalman's Band but I would still be opened to other ideas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CW4AFB Posted May 15, 2008 Author Share #6 Posted May 15, 2008 The only thing is, these were all jobs that people were detailed to rather then permanent jobs which is why they used arm bands and not patches or something permanently affixed to the uniform. This band appears to be embroidered or sewn to the uniform this seems like a lot of trouble and expensive to go to for something that may need to be removed at any time. I first thought it might be his going home uniform and had it done to impress the folks back home but there is no Discharge Stripe. This may well be Signalman's Band but I would still be opened to other ideas. Gee thanks...here I was all set and you have to throw logic into it....as you noted, this stripe is heavily sewn onto the coat and the OS is sewn right directly on it---maybe he was so proud to be agent/signalman that he decided to keep it forever---I still think he must have been an older gentleman to have the foreign service ribbon (China/PI) and the Mex border service ribbon so maybe he was the "head" signalman for Company A of the Machine gun BN...but if so, why no chevrons? What was that song back in the 60s: "Like a circle in a spiral, like a wheel within a wheel..." and still not sure what an "agent" did... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted May 16, 2008 Share #7 Posted May 16, 2008 Gee thanks...here I was all set and you have to throw logic into it....as you noted, this stripe is heavily sewn onto the coat and the OS is sewn right directly on it---maybe he was so proud to be agent/signalman that he decided to keep it forever---I still think he must have been an older gentleman to have the foreign service ribbon (China/PI) and the Mex border service ribbon so maybe he was the "head" signalman for Company A of the Machine gun BN...but if so, why no chevrons? What was that song back in the 60s: "Like a circle in a spiral, like a wheel within a wheel..." and still not sure what an "agent" did... I've owned one jacket that had the green stripe permanently sewn to the cuff like this one. I believe it was fairly common if the person were permanently detailed to that position in the unit. As far as an "agent", I believe it was someone to who relayed telegrams between two points. Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
316th FS 324th FG Posted May 16, 2008 Share #8 Posted May 16, 2008 Just thinkin' out loud here - wouldnt it be pretty hard to keep the stripe on the forearm if it wasnt sewed on? Tying it on wouldnt seem to work to well, as it would with a brassard on the upper arm, since the forearm narrows and it would tend to slip. Pinning it might work, but would look messy. So I would make sense to me that they would sew it on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAW Posted May 16, 2008 Share #9 Posted May 16, 2008 Fully concur with the above posts.......it's for a guy on signal detail. I have seen these sewn on to the uniforms, and I had one in a trunk group that was just "loose".....like the soldier might have tied it onto his arm when he wanted to, or he just never took the time to sew it on. I have several views of variations of these armbands in photo-postcards, and they seem to be sewn-on more often than not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CW4AFB Posted May 18, 2008 Author Share #10 Posted May 18, 2008 Gents---the jury is in and I am glad to accept their verdict---Thanks again to all who chimed in--I'm in your debt: Stay in the treeline and I'll meet you on the objective with hot chow and dry socks....S/F Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TLHSS Posted May 19, 2008 Share #11 Posted May 19, 2008 As a comparison, here's a 33rd division scout uniform (green band) from my collection. I've also added some pictures of the banding detail in my next reply. Tim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TLHSS Posted May 19, 2008 Share #12 Posted May 19, 2008 Banding details .... Tim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CW4AFB Posted May 19, 2008 Author Share #13 Posted May 19, 2008 Banding details .... Tim Tim---that is a great uniform---wow---just super...do you have any closeups of the 33rd ID patch? to the moderators---any chance of running a section on AEF WW1 patch variations where guys could load up their pictures by divsions or organizations and show all the different versions? Sort of like a Keller book but not limited by time and page count? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TLHSS Posted May 20, 2008 Share #14 Posted May 20, 2008 Tim---that is a great uniform---wow---just super...do you have any closeups of the 33rd ID patch? to the moderators---any chance of running a section on AEF WW1 patch variations where guys could load up their pictures by divsions or organizations and show all the different versions? Sort of like a Keller book but not limited by time and page count? Here's a photo of the 33rd division patch on this uniform. I like the idea of starting a section on WWI patches. I'd be happy to contribute photos of all my examples. Tim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CW4AFB Posted May 24, 2008 Author Share #15 Posted May 24, 2008 Here's a photo of the 33rd division patch on this uniform. I like the idea of starting a section on WWI patches. I'd be happy to contribute photos of all my examples. Tim Tim--nice patch---as a potential contribution to a WW1 patch section heres some of my 29th ID patches and their associated collar disks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CW4AFB Posted May 24, 2008 Author Share #16 Posted May 24, 2008 and some more 29th patches Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BEAST Posted May 24, 2008 Share #17 Posted May 24, 2008 Banding details .... Tim I noticed Bay State Militaria has a EM uniform with a band sewn on it. I belive he wrote that it was for a runner. Here is the link. http://baystatemilitaria.com/WWI/WWIuniforms.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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