Jump to content

M2 helmet General Robert Frederick


doyler
 Share

Recommended Posts

General Robert Frederick is of often reffered to as the "Last Fighting General".He was the Commanding officer and driving force behinde the legendary First Special Service Forces.The combined American and Candian unit which saw sevice in the Aluetians and extensive combat in Italy.He is often seen and was well known for being in the mix right next to his men.Many photos exist of him wearing his nelmet at various stages of his career from his days with the Force,Commander of the First Airborne Task Force for Southern France and then as Commnader of the 45th Division.Through all these assignments he wears the M2 helmet from what I have observed.The photo I have posted is of General Frederick recieveng the Bronze Star for his divisions capture of a well known german city.This was in 1945 as Commander of the 45th Division.Even at this late date in the war he retains his M2 helmet.The D-rings are plainly visible

 

 

post-342-0-49995500-1387691587.jpg

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Actually, the general had several helmets. He had a fixed loop when he was still a Brigadier(Shown below) The D-loop followed him through most of the war. Both helmets still exist and are in private collections today. As a matter of fact, I had the chance to examine his Brigadier helmet a couple years ago.

 

Gen Frederick FSSF.JPG

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I recently re-read the Liberator by Alex Kershaw. It gave me a whole new insight about Frederick. He was not so popular among the 157th Infantry and after having studied Frederick's adventures with the SSF, it was interesting to read about him as seen from an Infantry Battalion Commander's view i.e. Felix Sparks.

Nice helmets; I would love to see a current photo of his DBale one day.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 1 month later...

I recently finished the book "The Last Fighting General" by Anne Hicks, following up to the "The Devils Brigade". General Frederick was definitely a unique man, one who got results from his men. His leadership skills were exemplary. One of my favorite quotes of his is, "I wonder is someone has written about peoples' responses to discipline. From the little experience I get, I am convinced if a person's self esteem is constantly bashed, he does only what it takes to avoid more of that. But if treated decently, he works hard to do his best to get more of that treatment."

 

He was also one of he first, if not THE first to de-segregate the troops as commander at Ft. Ord. This made him unpopular with the brass and was radical at the time. It wasn't because of ideology, but rather practicality..."It is ridiculous to try arranging adequate number of segregated barracks, mess halls, units and training troops."

 

I guess the point of my ramblings is to say the Robert Frederick is one of my favorite historical military figures.

 

I will have to read Mr. Kershaw's book as well to see the other perspective.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I recently re-read the Liberator by Alex Kershaw. It gave me a whole new insight about Frederick. He was not so popular among the 157th Infantry and after having studied Frederick's adventures with the SSF, it was interesting to read about him as seen from an Infantry Battalion Commander's view i.e. Felix Sparks.

Nice helmets; I would love to see a current photo of his DBale one day.

 

Same here.Would love to see the M2

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I recently finished the book "The Last Fighting General" by Anne Hicks, following up to the "The Devils Brigade". General Frederick was definitely a unique man, one who got results from his men. His leadership skills were exemplary. One of my favorite quotes of his is, "I wonder is someone has written about peoples' responses to discipline. From the little experience I get, I am convinced if a person's self esteem is constantly bashed, he does only what it takes to avoid more of that. But if treated decently, he works hard to do his best to get more of that treatment."

 

He was also one of he first, if not THE first to de-segregate the troops as commander at Ft. Ord. This made him unpopular with the brass and was radical at the time. It wasn't because of ideology, but rather practicality..."It is ridiculous to try arranging adequate number of segregated barracks, mess halls, units and training troops."

 

I guess the point of my ramblings is to say the Robert Frederick is one of my favorite historical military figures.

 

I will have to read Mr. Kershaw's book as well to see the other perspective.

 

Frederick is a facsinating military figure and man.His war time association as a commander to a unconventional unit won him no favors or respect with many of the main line senior ranking army officers or heirarchy and cost him promotions in the process.He wasnt a political motivated person and post war army politics didnt fit his nature.He had a difficult time (I think) adjusting to post war assignments and the politics of it all.I read a quoate from his daughter in one book how he often came to tears when asked about his men during the war.He took the loss very personal and very deeply.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

He was wounded 8 times right, does these books list them? While not saying he's not entitled or earned every 8 PHs, I was always curious about the extent of the wounds he recieved, they all must of be superficial, I mean all it takes is a well place bullet or piece of shapnel to render a soldier hors de combat for months, but as we see Frederick was in every operation, even afterwards with the 45th Div, alltogether with no real gaps in service where one might see someone who was even moderately wounded and need rest and convalescence before returning for duty.The Wiki on him states from what I gather, without going into real detail, that most of his wounds were recieved at Anzio, again these must of been superficial for him to remain in the field and in command,

Link to comment
Share on other sites

For the most part, they were not superficial. Keep in mind that he was a "front line" general. I will have to go back to find them individually, but the ones that stick out were being shot multiple times on one mission. His worst injury, one to his leg, hampered him the rest of his life.

 

Let me see if I can find a list.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

For the most part, they were not superficial. Keep in mind that he was a "front line" general. I will have to go back to find them individually, but the ones that stick out were being shot multiple times on one mission. His worst injury, one to his leg, hampered him the rest of his life.

 

Let me see if I can find a list.

Thank's cd, perhaps this also will mention how long he was in the hospital.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Patches,

 

I couldn't find a "list", per se, on the internet for each specific PH citation, but I scanned through the book and came up with seven of the eight (I think).

 

1. Bruised Spine / Chipped Shoulder bone from Artillery on La Difensia

2. Torn Eyelid from shrapnel

3. Rock shards in right hand from mortar blast

4. Shrapnel in neck (2" scar)

5. Shot in Right Arm

6. Multiple shots to right thigh (256 stitches)

7. 10" scar on thigh from night parachuting incident behind enemy lines

 

I guess it comes down to what one's definition of "superficial" is. Keep in mind he was a general, fighting on the front line or behind enemy lines when these happened.

 

Also, there was no mention of length of time hospitalized, although they infer that it was hard to get him even to go to the hospital. He wanted to be with his men, leading them.

 

"The Last Fighting General" was a very enjoyable read. I highly recommend it, if you have an interest in Robert T. Frederick.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

He was wounded 8 times right, does these books list them? While not saying he's not entitled or earned every 8 PHs, I was always curious about the extent of the wounds he recieved, they all must of be superficial, I mean all it takes is a well place bullet or piece of shapnel to render a soldier hors de combat for months, but as we see Frederick was in every operation, even afterwards with the 45th Div, alltogether with no real gaps in service where one might see someone who was even moderately wounded and need rest and convalescence before returning for duty.The Wiki on him states from what I gather, without going into real detail, that most of his wounds were recieved at Anzio, again these must of been superficial for him to remain in the field and in command,

 

Yes,8 times.He was out front with "His Men".Patton got a lot of press and glory but he was more gas than go.More of a little spoiled Napolean.Personally most vets that knew Patton dont have to many favorable comments about the "little general".Ask any Forceman who was elbow to elbow with Frederick and the response is unamamous.He was a soldiers soldier.He didnt ask his men to do anything he wouldnt do.I know one Forceman who was a T/5 in Italy and carring stretchers.It was near dusk.THey needed to get the wounded down.He hollered at a shadow standing in the shadows to "get off his azz and grab a handle".When they got to the aid station and a bit of light he saw it was Gen.Frederick.He apologized and Frederick told him he could holler at him anytime he needed help and not to apologize.

 

As for superficial there are pictures of him wearing an eye patch from a wounding in Italy.Could have lost an eye and he was still in the field.Once in Italy he was nearly asphixiated in his own quarters from a defective/faulty stove.Poor ventilation.Its said this plauged him for the rest of his life.He had an enlarged heart due to the near asphixiation.

 

I have a group to a 508th surgeon.He was wounded at normandy.Shrapnel to his upper arm.He never mentioned it but I found it mentioned in an article about him by another trooper.So one day I asked.He was a bit embarresed.I said why dont you have a Purple Heart on your discharge??He said it was nothing and he pulled it out and later sewed it shut himself.He said seeing all the traumatic head wounds an amputations he rendered aid to all those young boys he didnt feel right about getting a medal for a shrapnel; scratch.I saw the scar.Didnt look like a scratch at over 8 inches long.Men like these are a different calibur.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Patches,

 

I couldn't find a "list", per se, on the internet for each specific PH citation, but I scanned through the book and came up with seven of the eight (I think).

 

1. Bruised Spine / Chipped Shoulder bone from Artillery on La Difensia

2. Torn Eyelid from shrapnel

3. Rock shards in right hand from mortar blast

4. Shrapnel in neck (2" scar)

5. Shot in Right Arm

6. Multiple shots to right thigh (256 stitches)

7. 10" scar on thigh from night parachuting incident behind enemy lines

 

I guess it comes down to what one's definition of "superficial" is. Keep in mind he was a general, fighting on the front line or behind enemy lines when these happened.

 

Also, there was no mention of length of time hospitalized, although they infer that it was hard to get him even to go to the hospital. He wanted to be with his men, leading them.

 

"The Last Fighting General" was a very enjoyable read. I highly recommend it, if you have an interest in Robert T. Frederick.

 

Thanks for posting.I have the book and its a all time favorite.I would have checked for the refferances to his woumds but have loaned the book to a friend.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

 

Yes,8 times.He was out front with "His Men".Patton got a lot of press and glory but he was more gas than go.More of a little spoiled Napolean.Personally most vets that knew Patton dont have to many favorable comments about the "little general".Ask any Forceman who was elbow to elbow with Frederick and the response is unamamous.He was a soldiers soldier.He didnt ask his men to do anything he wouldnt do.I know one Forceman who was a T/5 in Italy and carring stretchers.It was near dusk.THey needed to get the wounded down.He hollered at a shadow standing in the shadows to "get off his azz and grab a handle".When they got to the aid station and a bit of light he saw it was Gen.Frederick.He apologized and Frederick told him he could holler at him anytime he needed help and not to apologize.

 

As for superficial there are pictures of him wearing an eye patch from a wounding in Italy.Could have lost an eye and he was still in the field.Once in Italy he was nearly asphixiated in his own quarters from a defective/faulty stove.Poor ventilation.Its said this plauged him for the rest of his life.He had an enlarged heart due to the near asphixiation.

 

I have a group to a 508th surgeon.He was wounded at normandy.Shrapnel to his upper arm.He never mentioned it but I found it mentioned in an article about him by another trooper.So one day I asked.He was a bit embarresed.I said why dont you have a Purple Heart on your discharge??He said it was nothing and he pulled it out and later sewed it shut himself.He said seeing all the traumatic head wounds an amputations he rendered aid to all those young boys he didnt feel right about getting a medal for a shrapnel; scratch.I saw the scar.Didnt look like a scratch at over 8 inches long.Men like these are a different calibur.

 

Very well put...these men are simply a different breed.

 

While I don't know what General Frederick was thinking, I would like to believe the reason he did not spend much time in a hospital bed was his sense of duty to his men. While many would jump at the chance to get off the front line for some R&R, he seems to have felt guilty for not being with them.

 

The stories I heard are that well after the war, when talking about the men that died under his command, his eyes would well up with tears.

 

I like your reference to Patton, as well. While Patton and Clark were orchestrating their personal camera crews, men like Frederick were helping with supplies, taking care of the wounded and encouraging his command.

 

It's just a shame he died so young (63).

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

 

The stories I heard are that well after the war, when talking about the men that died under his command, his eyes would well up with tears.

 

CD

 

your totally correct.His daughter made that staement as I recall.I may have read it first in the book A PERFECT HELL by John Nadler.

 

There are some great accounts of Sgt.Tommy Prince in this book.Prince was a Native Indian from Manitoba(Saulteaux/

Ojibway?).As a Forceman he was a legend and highly decorated by the Americans,Canadians and British.One of only three Canadians to hold the Military Medal and the Silver Star.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Here's a side view of Frederick's Brig. Gen. fixed loop. You can see the white blotch that ran toward the front. This is the blotch you also see in the period photo. I'm trying to find some better photo's of this helmet. It's in a private collection. It had been donated to Stanford University, Frederick's alma mater. They returned it to the FSSF trooper who had it since WWII. He got it when Frederick was promoted and tossed this helmet to get a new one with 2 Stars(likely his D-loop shown above). Anyhow, the trooper, Johnny Hill, passed it along where it's been in a private collection since 1969.

Frederick.JPG

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Here's the initials from the inside of Frederick's helmet.

 

Thats intresting.I thought he normally used the T with his name or initials...Robert Tyron Frederick.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

 

Thats intresting.I thought he normally used the T with his name or initials...Robert Tyron Frederick.

I couldn't tell you Ron, I've only got these few photo's I had from several years ago. I don't own it but, there was quite a bit of provenance with it including a 1969 dated letter concerning the helmet from Stanford University and one from the former FSSF trooper who had donated it and then got it back.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
 Share

×
×
  • Create New...