IS THIS WING GOOD? Post your requests here!

[rathbonemuseum.com]

18 minutes ago, Based Captain Steve said:

I'm trying to figure out the authenticity of these wings. I've tried looking online at forums for 318thw wings and the front part between the 318th and W7 is see through in their examples where here it appears to be mounted on a flat surface. I think they may have taken authentic pilot wings grinded off the front and attached the 318th Shield? Was this something that was done or is this someone trying to scam people? Would love to hear other people's opinions

 

It was discussed here

 

 

[pfrost]

"Was this something that was done or is this someone trying to scam people?"

 

The old saying that the French fight for the Republic, the British fight for the empire, the Germans fight because they enjoy it, and the Americans fight for souvenirs is probably true.

 

I suspect that a few days after the Battle of the Little Bighorn, two Indians, Fat Elk who Sits At Table and his buddy, Honest Bear Story Teller, were selling knock-off 7th Cal spurs and leather skivies with GAC initials at their Teepee in Fort Asmic North Deckota.

 

If someone can theoretically hump a buck out of an item, and there are bright-eyed rube with more cash than sense in the room... fakes will be made.

[pfrost]

On 9/13/2024 at 4:17 PM, Threewood said:

Thanks Patrick! I'll post better pictures once I receive it. Is this considered a Robbins pattern?

 

I have never been a big fan of the "Robbins pattern" meme, myself.  I think it is more accurate to call this an "issue" or "graduation" pattern.  But no matter what, its a nice wing.  The Liaison rating is relatively rare so its always nice to have a good one in the collection.  Good for you.

P

[Manky bandage]

Well, after getting lost in the post, redirected across the other side of the country then being delivered to a house not even on my street; these wings have landed. I like them, but here are some better images than previously posted just in case. 

 

Hopefully I can tick these off of the list of wings, and go after the smaller shirt version next. These are addictive.....

[bschwartz]

I think you can rest easy with that one. Looks exactly like it should.

[Manky bandage]

Many thanks Bob, its a minefield of crud out there. Glad my eyes are getting clearer and starting to be able to see through the hidden turds that the UK is awash with. 

[B-17Guy]

You’ll get to a point where you will be able to easily distinguish good from bad Meyer wings at the drop of a hat. It just takes time and exposure.

John

[Threewood]

On 9/13/2024 at 5:17 PM, Threewood said:

Thanks Patrick! I'll post better pictures once I receive it. Is this considered a Robbins pattern?

[cwnorma]

On 9/19/2024 at 9:32 PM, B-17Guy said:

You’ll get to a point where you will be able to easily distinguish good from bad Meyer wings at the drop of a hat. It just takes time and exposure.

This is really important.  N.S. Meyer made some very good quality badges, but Meyer wings are unfairly maligned due to all the re-strikes.  While not super-rare overall, some Meyer patterns can be quite scarce and make great additions to any collection!  And as John points out, after a bit of careful study it is not too difficult to tell good from bad.

 

Chris

[Manky bandage]

My eyes are saying these are good, how about yours? 
 

 

[pfrost]

No worries there. 

[Manky bandage]

I managed to get them,

 

And with a real stroke of luck; I managed to get his bracelet. It would of been a real shame knowing that they got parted after so many years. 

[Threewood]

I need eyes on this Meyer wing please. It looks good to me. But with Meyer restrikes everywhere, I want to be sure. If legit, this would be WW2 period, correct?

[bschwartz]

Looks good to me. Small sterling mark in the correct font, textured back, correct pin and the hallmark looks right. Meyers are always a hot topic of discussion but I don't have a problem with the authenticity of this one.

[pconrad02]

12 minutes ago, bschwartz said:

Looks good to me. Small sterling mark in the correct font, textured back, correct pin and the hallmark looks right. Meyers are always a hot topic of discussion but I don't have a problem with the authenticity of this one.

 I second that

[Threewood]

Thank you both!🙂

[pfrost]

Ditto to the above.  It could be into the KW period as well. The USAAF did make the alphabet wings obsolete shortly after WWII.  However, you still see them worn during the transition from USAAF to USAF and beyond.

[Threewood]

Here's another on the auction site. Unmarked, snowflake back. Looks like an Amcraft pattern? The Opinions?

[pfrost]

It’s hard to tell from the pictures 

[rathbonemuseum.com]

The findings, the off-center die strike at the interior of the balloon, especially at the bottom of the basket, the wear patterns on the front indicate to me this is a good example.

 

[Threewood]

These are on ebay if anyone is interested. I'll bid on these if the price stays reasonable. Approximately what year were these wings phased out? 

[pfrost]

I took the liberty of looking at these wings a bit more.  I am not the wing police and this is just my opinion (so take it with a grain of salt), but I would avoid these myself.  As I like to say, they give me heartburn.

 

First and foremost, there are some pretty good castings of snowflake wings.  The deal is that the snowflakes (when cast) usually lose most of their definition, which can generally be seen under a 40x loupe.  Also, while SOME of the snowflakes may pass muster, not all of them do well, especially those towards the end of the wings.  In contrast, vintage DIE STRUCK wings will have sharp and near-identical snowflakes across the whole wing.

 

Be sure to carefully compare the snowflakes on two or three vintage wings (the airship wings are courtesy of Russ's previous postings). They often form a clear, regular line of snowflakes in alternating rows, have a distinct central dot, and a more or less uniform number of rays radiating out from the center.  Importantly, rays are not missing or absent from each of these snowflakes.  The pattern is NOT PERFECT, because they were carved into the dies by hand (probably), but they are relatively crisp and uniform.

 

 

 

Now, compare this to the eBay auction wing.  The front looks ok, but the back.  Look at the snowflakes.  They are not uniform, regular or clean.  Some of the rays are missing,

 

They show all the classic signs of being cast.

 

 

Now, the front looks ok to me, and at first glance, I don't see much to get upset about.  OTHER THAN... why so worn and damaged? Many wings indeed get "salty" over time, but that wear is usually balanced.  This isn't such a big deal, but why is the back so grubby and worn?  Even under areas where you would not get wear.  Also, this is the classic "spray on patina in a can" finish. Too artificially dark and splotchy.  It makes no sense.

 

Finally, the fittings seem okay, but these are perhaps the easiest to fix.

 

So, overall, I would not buy these unless I could get them absolutely dirt cheap and with an iron-clad return policy.

 

Finally, an example of a balloon wing with all the correct features as a comparison (fair use of images for educational purposes -- borrowed from Flying Tiger's Antique site). If the owner (Ron Burkey) has any concerns, I apologize and will remove the images).

 

 

 

 

[Threewood]

Very insightful and I can see the difference in the pictures. Of course the wing up for bid isn't very clear. Thanks Patrick!

[rathbonemuseum.com]

Gotta love a good Dr. Frost take down!

[pfrost]

LOL.   Sorry if I seem especially pompous with that last post.  Maybe someone on the forum will grab it and prove me wrong.

 

"ACTSULLY, Patrick, this is a perfectly fine wing, as you can clearly see here, here and here!"

 

Check out this auction (hat tip to Mike!).  One of my forum posts was "absconded with" and used in his write-up.  Please always remember that I am just a knucklehead with time on his hands, access to a keypad, and semi-opposable thumbs (like most primates), so you get what you get.

 

https://www.ebay.com/itm/186786037947?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-127632-2357-0&ssspo=E5WB8DamTMu&sssrc=4429486&ssuid=d5ECHqUgSUq&var=&widget_ver=artemis&media=COPY