Jump to content

Can anyone tell what type of unit this man was from?


Recommended Posts

I am posting this for a friend of mine in New Zealand. The uniform and or headgear may be an indication to the type of unit. The beret type headgear might lead me to believe an Irish Unit . Is the upright collar indicative of Cavalry? He has an NCO belt plate. His name is John Speiden. The photographer name and locations is shown on reverse. All opinions and input is appreciated.

 

post-9906-0-77644300-1401822097.jpg post-9906-0-11010100-1401822121.jpg

Link to comment
Share on other sites

double canister

Cav seems logical, though he could be arty.

You run into some odd-ball headgear. I've an Iowan wearing a furry fez of some sort. I've seen several (and own one) CDVs of 2nd Iowa Cav troopers sporting what look like Scottish tams. I believe all to be unauthorized.

Sometimes you'll see images of men wearing smoking hats. I think such was more popular back East.

I can't help you much with this guy. I do love the jaunty appearance, though.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

There looks to be some sort of strap hanging off his left side... sword hanger?

 

I don't think this is a cavalry uniform. I can't imagine riding a horse with that closed collar, although I suppose someone will have an example to the contrary.

 

Here are examples of shell jackets typical of the cavalry. Of course there dozens if not hundreds of uniform variations during the Civil War.

 

http://www.cowanauctions.com/auctions/item.aspx?ItemId=94014

 

http://www.makinghistorycomealive.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/Civil-War-Cavalry-001.jpg

 

Civil War Cavalry Jacket.jpg

Civil-War-Cavalry-001.jpg

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Could also just be a photographers prop. Those guys carried a lot of krap with them to adorn the soldiers when they sat for photos. Looks like a cover-up for a receding hair line to me. Cheers!

 

Mark

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Great photo. M1855 Shell Jacket, mounted trousers (with re-enforced inner thigh area), M1851 Saber belt, M1860 Colt .44 Revolver, and a TAM (Tam-O-Shanter).

Looks like a rough and ready Scot ready to fight for his new home country.

 

My Great Great Grandfather was a Scot fighting as an officer in one of the Missouri home guard units (Union). Sadly he was waylaid while joining his unit and was killed. Only way he was identified was by his tartan as his body was found nearly a year later.

 

I can't quite make out where in Tennessee the photographer was located, Might be able to pin point what regiments he may have come from.

Terence

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thanks to everyone for their great input. As I look at the image a little closer I can see similarities to the jacket posted by Gil. While the piping is not as vibrant it does look very close.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It should be pointed out that Cavalry yellow often photographed dark in the old photos. I am thinking Cav because of the revolver.

 

G

Link to comment
Share on other sites

LIGHT Arty also often wore shell jackets, usually with scarlet braid, but sometimes they could not get that and wore Cav yellow OR removed the braid. Within LIGHT Arty, there were HORSE Arty units, which had access to and used many Cav items. Like a revolkver per man and as many as one carbine per man, and lt arty sabres. HORSE Arty batteries had every man mounted on an animal, either horse or mule; no one had to ride on the limbers.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

double canister

The first image shows Sgt. Alexander Cooper Brice of 1st Iowa Cavalry wearing (what seems to be) a Scottish tam.

 

post-75788-0-09299300-1383687621.jpg

 

Next image shows Pvt. Noah Ward of Co. E, 2nd Iowa Infantry in a winter fur hat.

 

post-75788-0-87649500-1383687638.jpg

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It should be pointed out that Cavalry yellow often photographed dark in the old photos. I am thinking Cav because of the revolver.

 

G

 

The M1860 Army revolver is merely suggestive. He could just as easily have been mounted or heavy artillery. What we do know is that he is an NCO (courtesy of his M1851 NCO belt plate), with an artillery or cavalry shell jacket. The sword hangers could have just as easily have held a M1840/1860 cavalry saber, or a M1840 artillery saber.

 

These army revolvers were basically available to anyone who wanted to acquire one. They were not branch specific, and it was not at all uncommon for army revolvers to be used by the navy, and navy revolvers to be used to the army. Police revolvers were used by all branches as well.

 

Very nice image, and I agree - probably a soldier who wished to preserved his Scottish heritage.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I agree with much of what has been said, but to clarify what I see.....it is just a traditional Scottish Tam....not a unit specific piece of headgear.

 

The jacket is likely an artillery jacket....usually the red piping appears darker than the cavalry yellow.

 

The equipment in this case fits the uniform....so the belt rig and revolver are probably his; not studio props. He looks like he knows what he's doing.

 

The term "shell jacket" is a more modern nomenclature.....now more commonly used because of its repeated use in reenacting circles for decades.

 

Nice image.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Agree with most previous posters-- an artillery or cavalry shell jacket. The hat doesn't designate a specific unit.

 

Coincidently, I have a war era CDV of a soldier wearing a similar scottish tam (like SGT Brice of the 1st Iowa Cav). The image is by JH Phillips of ST Louis MO and is tax stamp cancelled in NOV 1864.

 

Scott

 

post-124583-0-15717100-1383797128.jpg

Link to comment
Share on other sites

dogfacedsoldier

The belt plate has an applied wreath, usually found on officer's sword belt plates, the braid on the collar is very dark, could be an old mounted rifles shell jacket. It lacks the full blown lace/trim of a regular shell jacket, the cuff buttons are closer spaced. The sam browne style strap for the belt is absent or unhooked, no sword, but it appears that the straps for the sword are present. It could easily be an artillery shell, minus the removed lace/trim. Very possibly a state coat. The throat lace/trim is present, but gives no clues.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

double canister

Scott,

I just did a really quick search, but it looks like the 1st Cav was in St. Louis area in Nov.64. Your man could easily be 1st Cav. I'm betting the tam was more than just an individual's taste. It could well be a company (or smaller group within such) sported these. Cav is such a pain to research, as they were so often detached for temporary odd jobs.

It's helpful when a CDV has tax stamp with cancellation date.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

daniel griffin

The belt plate has an applied wreath, usually found on officer's sword belt plates, the braid on the collar is very dark, could be an old mounted rifles shell jacket. It lacks the full blown lace/trim of a regular shell jacket, the cuff buttons are closer spaced. The sam browne style strap for the belt is absent or unhooked, no sword, but it appears that the straps for the sword are present. It could easily be an artillery shell, minus the removed lace/trim. Very possibly a state coat. The throat lace/trim is present, but gives no clues.

 

No, the applied wreath Model 1851 belt plates were worn by infantry NCOs, enlisted light artillery and mounted troops. Officers wore cast brass plates with no silver wreath.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Scott,

I just did a really quick search, but it looks like the 1st Cav was in St. Louis area in Nov.64. Your man could easily be 1st Cav. I'm betting the tam was more than just an individual's taste. It could well be a company (or smaller group within such) sported these. Cav is such a pain to research, as they were so often detached for temporary odd jobs.

It's helpful when a CDV has tax stamp with cancellation date.

 

 

Could be but I couldn't find anything to supporting documentation.

 

I checked the online photos for the unit (65 images) on the HDS site and didn't see anyone with a tam.

 

Scott

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 4 weeks later...

According to the NPS CWSS, there is a Sgt John McSpadden with the 9th TN Cavalry (US), C Troop. The regiment was raised in Aug 1863, operated mainly in Eastern TN, but operated also in SW VA and W NC during the last two months of the war. This assumes that McSpadden was a variant of Speiden.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

USCapturephotos

Maclilus. You stole my fire...I was just going to look him up. Nice job. Dan Griffen is correct about the applied wreath on the eagle sword belt plate being for NCO's.

Paul

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
 Share

×
×
  • Create New...