WWI Doughboy display, help needed

[S1991]

Guys,

 

Not sure if this is in the correct topic to be posted. But I need a bit of help regarding a WWI display.

What would be the equipment that a WWI doughboy wore at the frontlines in France?

 

My guess would be the following:

- M-1917 helmet without any markings

- M-1917 Wool tunic

- M-1917 Wool trousers

- Puttees or leggings

- "Trench" shoes

- M-1910 Haversack

- M-1910 Entrenching tool

- M-1910 Canteenset

- Gasmaskbag and gasmask

- Cartridge belt, this belt would be used for the Springfield and Remington?

- Bayonet for the Springfield 03 or the P17 bayonet, which one was used more?

- M-1910 First Aid pouch

 

Looking forward to hear some opinions if this is correct. Tried to find some good photographs of 26th Division troops but couldn't find a good one.

If someone also can tell me how to "spot" the real deal and what the regular value is that would be great! Some reference photographs would be great as well.

 

Many thanks in advance!

[GIl Sanow]

You are on the right track, for sure. I would add the meat can (mess kit), bacon can, condiment can, silverware (with sheaths for fork and knife), a blanket and shelter half with poles and pegs.

 

The '17 Enfield (Winchester, Remington or Eddystone) was typically carried by National Army troops -- i.e. draftees in higher numbered divisions. Regular Army and National Guard were usually issued the '03 rifle (Springfield or Rock Island) Yes, the cartridge belt was interchangeable between rifles.

 

G

[S1991]

Thanks G. I wasn't really planning on filling the haversack. Perhaps just only with a blanket inside.

I've seen that the M-1905 Bayonets are pretty expensive and rare right?

 

Thanks

[RustyCanteen]

Also keep in mind the uniform would be devoid of shoulder sleeve insignia.

 

The M1917 bayonets are typically much cheaper, provided you can find a US issue and not a British P-14. Also be sure to inspect the scabbard to make certain it is a US model and not the British version.

 

RC

[Patriot]

The blanket would not have gone inside the haverack, but rather on the outside of it. Combat suspenders may, or may not be worn with the cartridge belt. Some collectors prefer them, while others contend that Doughboys did not wear them in 1917.

 

The helmet should be void of any insignia. The uniform should be void of everything except for collar discs and rank chevrons. To be complete, an issue shirt also would not be a bad idea.

[S1991]

Thanks so better keep it all US then even with the bayonet.

What did go in the haversack to fill it up a bit? Because without anything inside it just looks so flat..

 

@RC so the tunics did not have a SSI attached to the jacket like in WWII? Did they do anything for unit recognition? What about collar disks?

 

Again any reference photographs would be great as some collectors display tunics with a SSI. Some also just use a cartridge belt without suspenders or haversack. But what would be historical correct for the 26th Division?

[RustyCanteen]

@RC so the tunics did not have a SSI attached to the jacket like in WWII? Did they do anything for unit recognition? What about collar disks?

Again any reference photographs would be great as some collectors display tunics with a SSI. Some also just use a cartridge belt without suspenders or haversack. But what would be historical correct for the 26th Division?

 

Shoulder insignia is pretty much going to be extremely late/post Armistice time frame. It really came into it's own in 1919 and that is when most shoulder insignia was applied.

 

For wartime, a plain uniform with collar disks correct for the unit are fine. In fact, even a more generic combination of Infantry (crossed rifles) and a US disk would be ok.

[atb]

Suspenders maybe if the M1910 Haversack was not worn. It had integral suspenders that attached to the belt. Wearing both would seem redundant.

[Mitter2k1]

This is pretty much what you need.

10 pocket ammo belt, first-aid pouch, M1910 haversack, pack tail if you plan on carrying a shelter half and blanket. Entrenching tool and carrier, condiment can, bacon can, mess kit, bayonet (M1917 or M1905) bayonet scabbard, utensils and leather sheaths for fork & knife, spiral leggings, pants, trench boots. If you have a shelter half, you will need tent pegs, pole and a guy rope. I'm sure there's a lot I've forgotten, but just dig a little and you will find what's necessary and what isn't. Here's my display and if you have questions don't be afraid to ask me.

Mike M.

[S1991]

Thanks, if you would be able to place some photographs of the boots, bayonets and the shovel that would be great!

Also what the value is on the items needed.

If you do not add the blanket and shelter half in the haversack, what else do you put inside the haversack to "stuffen" it up.

 

Thanks

[Mitter2k1]

I do not have any boots but I can help with bayonet, scabbard and shovel.

M1905 bayonet and scabbard. The scabbard is the M1917 more commonly seen with the M1917 bayonet. But don't worry, it was used as a suitable replacement for the M1910 scabbard. Unfortunately I am missing a M1910 which I think looks better.

[Mitter2k1]

Here is some info on how it all went together. It's confusing at first, but I figured it out. So I don't think you will have any issues.

This last pic has instructions on how to do it minus certain articles. It may help you out depending on what your setup will be.

Thanks,

Mike M.

[S1991]

Okay thanks for the help. So this set would be okay for the display?

Except for the fact of the blanket which might be packed wrong? Also note that the shovel cover is a fake.

The M-1905? Bayonet scabbard would be correct?

 

https://db.tt/toUNC4Y4

 

Again thanks!

[Mitter2k1]

You are off to a good start. The flap that looks like Molle would be brought up and 3 straps would go through the loops. The shovel carrier would actually be under the meat can pouch and you will be set. And yes, the bayonet and scabbard are good

Mike M.

[S1991]

Thanks it was just a example I found online. Now off to find a somewhat more used set or use this one for a replacement.

[solcarlus]

Bonjour.

 

 

 

It is best to draw a picture of time. The most difficult to find here, are the shoes. The rest of the equipment is the price depending on the degree of scarcity.

 

solcarlus.

 

An example of mannequin:

 

 

[Marchville1918]

One thing to consider is whether you are talking about what he looked like moving up to the trenches or what he looked like once he got there. The blanket and shelter half roll would be left in a dugout where he slept not carried around. They did NOT use the 1907 suspenders AND the haversack. The haversack had suspenders and if you needed suspenders to keep your belt up you wore the haversack. When they talk about "dropping packs" I think they are talking about the blanket haversack roll part of the pack which comes off when you pull out the leather strap.

[aef1917]

 

@RC so the tunics did not have a SSI attached to the jacket like in WWII? Did they do anything for unit recognition? What about collar disks?

 

But what would be historical correct for the 26th Division?

 

It all depends on what period you're trying to represent.

 

Helmet painting began among some units of the 26th as early as March, 1918. Wearing of the YD patch began in September, 1918.

[RustyCanteen]

 

It all depends on what period you're trying to represent.

 

Helmet painting began among some units of the 26th as early as March, 1918. Wearing of the YD patch began in September, 1918.

 

Exactly. Painting came before patches in most units I am familar with.

 

RC

[S1991]

Again thank you all for the help. I was planning on doing a display of a 104th Regiment doughboy during either the battle of Aisne-Marne, St. Mihiel or Meuse-Argonne.

I would want to represent the doughboy as being a front line soldier already.

So all by all the following would be correct for a WWI doughboy:

- M-1917 helmet

- M-1917 wool tunic without wounded chevron, overseas stripes AND a Division SSI. But you can add a US collar disk and Infantry collar disk with unit designation.

- M-1917 wool trousers

- "Trench" shoes

- Wool puttees or leggings

- M-1910 Haversack with meat can pouch

- M-1910 Entrenching shovel

- M-1910 First Aid Pouch

- M-1910 Canteen set

- M-1905 Springfield bayonet with the leather scabbard

- M-1910 Cartridge belt

- Gasmask bag + mask

 

Would it also be possible NOT to use a Haversack? As on some photographs it appears they are not wearing the pack.

 

Again thank you all!

[Marchville1918]

I'm sure that they didn't need to wear their haversacks when they reached the trench position they were to hold and live in, but on an attack I suspect that the haversack with mess gear, rations , bayonet , entrenching tool (or whatever tool the man was assigned to carry) was worn and carried forward to the new position while the heavy pack rolls with blankets etc were brought up later probably by wagons once the new forward position was established. It probably varied a great deal with all the circumstances which might develop.

[solcarlus]

Bonjour.

 

Take into account the season for holding:

- Champagne-Marne July.

- Aisne-Marne July.

- Saint-Mihiel: September (rain).

- Meuse-Argonne: Sep. Nov.

 

Photos of assault are posed photos. But they reflect the mood and outfits are those of occupation sector.

Units into the top positions are equipped "lightweight". Priority is given to ammunition. I think the fighters certainly have haversac and pocket mess tins. The haversac containing only the tent, the overcoat and / or raincoat and emergency rations.

The wool puttees are generally observed.

This division stabling in my area (Toul)

 

solcarlus.

 

 

 

[talontree14]

WW1 displays can really turn out good. I've made several for my own collection and when I was in school. As said before it depends if you want to represent the doughboy in the front trenches or on the march. You can alway assemble the pack, and just set it aside while your doughboy has the belt on. Another thing if you are displaying a rifle you may want to have the M1917 instead of an Springfield. Most US troops were outfitted with the enfield due to them already being produced for England before our entry into the war. Good luck on your project, WW1 doughboy gear is my all time favorite and always love to see what others come up with for their displays!!

[solcarlus]

 

...and always love to see what others come up with for their displays!!

PVT for Cable-laying Detail. Out post Co. Field signal.

 

[solcarlus]

Using the "pouch squad leader" in pocket "tote".