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g-1 jacket question


VenitHora
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hello, thanks for the reply,

 

I was doing some searching online and found this on Wikepedia:

 

"The military specifications under which the naval flight jackets were made, in the order of latest to earliest, are

MIL-J-7823E(AS) 1971,

MIL-J-7823D(WP) 1966,

MIL-J-7823C (WEP) 1962,

MIL-J-7823B(WEP)1960,

MIL-J-7823A(AER) 1961,

MIL-J-7823(AER) 1951,

55J14 (AER) 1947,

AN-J3A 1943,

AN 6552 1943,

M-422A 1940,

M-422 1940

The first Navy designation of "G-1" came under the 55J14 specification.

The earlier jackets were constructed of goatskin and had a real mouton collar. Current model issue jackets (although there are exceptions) are constructed of cowhide and have a synthetic collar."

 

Here is a G1 jacket currently on ebay that if the wikepedia information is correct would date the jacket to 1951. The Jacket has the USN punched into the tab. Assuming the info on contract tags is correct they might have had the USN in them in the early 50's?

 

http://www.ebay.com/itm/321189797316?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649

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I would say from the 7823A version (1958, not 1961) or even perhaps from the last 7823. But I don't remember to have seen personally a jacket from the spéc. 7823 with this feature. Only read somewhere.

For the 7823A I'm sure.

Franck

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Hi,

I concur with Franck in part. I have a Cagleco 7823, that has both the USN paint stamp on the reverse of the collar and punched through the wind flap. I will double check to see if I have any 7823's with just the USN punched in the flap and report back.

 

Thanks,

Paul

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Hello again,

Ok.... so I've just taken a look and I have two other 7823's with just the USN punched through the flap.

 

A Ralph Edwards QM (CTM) 2313 and a California Sportswear QM (CTM) 4771-E-60. The Cagleco with both the collar and punch marks is from the N383s-39321A contract.

So I would say the date for the transition is late 50's.

 

Cheers,

Paul

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Hi Franck,

 

That's interesting.... I'll post a couple of photos later. The USN stamp is a lot smaller than those you see on later jackets.

 

Thanks for the info.

 

Paul

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The punched G-1s are from the late 50s per some replies to this thread. However, there are some that have both the punched and painted USN and are quite rare from my experience. I just sent my "expert" an email and will report back when I have a definative answer.

 

Cheers,

 

Stony

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To All,

 

I have a Brill Bros, G-1 Flyers Jacket, Brown Leather with USN on the flap, size 42. Laynard on zipper..

 

Label inscription: Jacket, Flyer

Intermediate, Type G-1

SIZE 42

MiL-J7823E (AS)

Brill Bros.,Inc.

8415-268-7800

DSA100-73-C-0035

 

Jacket #22

 

Some people call these Bomber Jackets, but it is not a Bomber's Jacket... if it was, it would be properly called a Bombier's Jacket. My Dad was Navy... WW2, Korea and Viet Nam.

 

Michael Newton

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I have a Brill Bros, G-1 Flyers Jacket, Brown Leather with USN on the flap, size 42. Laynard on zipper..

 

Label inscription: Jacket, Flyer

Intermediate, Type G-1

SIZE 42

MiL-J7823E (AS)

Brill Bros.,Inc.

8415-268-7800

DSA100-73-C-0035

 

Jacket #22

 

Some people call these Bomber Jackets, but it is not a Bomber's Jacket... if it was, it would be properly called a Bombier's Jacket. My Dad was Navy... WW2, Korea and Viet Nam.

 

Michael Newton

 

 

 

 

 

Your jacket is dated 1973, hence the "73" in the middle of the DSA number.

 

As for the use of the word "bomber jacket", that is something that was made up by civilian clothing manufacturers right after WWII. All of these jackets, whether AAF or USN are "flight jackets". There is no where on any flight jacket label that has the word "bomber". To serious flight jacket collectors, "bomber jacket" is like fingernails on a chalk board. Fighters, bombers, cargo, spotter....all aircraft that had pilots and aircrew wore "flight jackets". There are no "fighter" jackets, "bomber" jackets, "cargo" jackets or "spotter" jackets, etc.

 

Sorry, rant over.

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Now to get back on tract about the first use of the perforated USN on G-1 flight jackets. From the person most flight jacket collectors consider the "expert" in this field.

 

"I know of a number of Cagleco contracts that have both the painted USN and perf'ed wind flaps, and they're a higher number on the contract scale than earlier models that didn't have the perf. Then, I know that the L.W. Foster 7823 (AER) Amend. #2 jackets also have both, rather than just the painted collar. My guess is that the first time this was done is 1957, and I'm pretty sure that this is right.

 

As an example, the Cacleco contract with 39321A has both the paint and the perf. Note that the box with a jacket in it has the ship date of Feb-1957. I don't know if this jacket is a later end of the contract, and some were made in 1956, or if the Foster jackets may have been made in 1956, but we do know that some jackets with both were shipped in 1957."

 

This is about when I thought the change occured, so he just confirmed that.

 

Cheers,

 

Stony

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Your jacket is dated 1973, hence the "73" in the middle of the DSA number.

 

As for the use of the word "bomber jacket", that is something that was made up by civilian clothing manufacturers right after WWII. All of these jackets, whether AAF or USN are "flight jackets". There is no where on any flight jacket label that has the word "bomber". To serious flight jacket collectors, "bomber jacket" is like fingernails on a chalk board. Fighters, bombers, cargo, spotter....all aircraft that had pilots and aircrew wore "flight jackets". There are no "fighter" jackets, "bomber" jackets, "cargo" jackets or "spotter" jackets, etc.

 

Sorry, rant over.

 

I didn't know you were ranting. I know that my Flyer's Jacket is 1973. I never said otherwise. I also get tire of all the misnomer for these jackets.

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Hi again,

 

Sorry for the delay, but here are the pics for the Cagleco I mentioned earlier.....

Thanks for confirming what I thought Stony, and pretty sure I know who you are referring to.

 

 

post-104881-0-09655900-1380272309.jpg

 

 

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Lynxman, can we see more of the jackets from your avatar? There's a thread of Navy Flight jackets on here with lots of plain jackets (zzzz...) but we don't get to see many patched up ones like yours. Jeffro

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Now to get back on tract about the first use of the perforated USN on G-1 flight jackets. From the person most flight jacket collectors consider the "expert" in this field.

 

"I know of a number of Cagleco contracts that have both the painted USN and perf'ed wind flaps, and they're a higher number on the contract scale than earlier models that didn't have the perf. Then, I know that the L.W. Foster 7823 (AER) Amend. #2 jackets also have both, rather than just the painted collar. My guess is that the first time this was done is 1957, and I'm pretty sure that this is right.

 

As an example, the Cacleco contract with 39321A has both the paint and the perf. Note that the box with a jacket in it has the ship date of Feb-1957. I don't know if this jacket is a later end of the contract, and some were made in 1956, or if the Foster jackets may have been made in 1956, but we do know that some jackets with both were shipped in 1957."

 

This is about when I thought the change occured, so he just confirmed that.

 

Cheers,

 

Stony

 

One of my J-7823(AER) G-1s is a L.W. FOSTER SPORTSWEAR CO. INC. contract DA-36-243-QM(CTM)2134 and has only the puyched flap. No collar paint. I assume that this one is a later contract (1958 or 59) from the #Amend.2 version.

 

Paul,

Thank you for photos. As Jeffro asked, could you show us your fabulous patched jackets please?

 

Franck

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  • 5 years later...
jorgeaguilera

Hello again,

Ok.... so I've just taken a look and I have two other 7823's with just the USN punched through the flap.

 

A Ralph Edwards QM (CTM) 2313 and a California Sportswear QM (CTM) 4771-E-60. The Cagleco with both the collar and punch marks is from the N383s-39321A contract.

So I would say the date for the transition is late 50's.

 

Cheers,

Paul

Hi lynxman, could you tell me more about that Ralph Edwards 7823 (CTM) 2313, if you have pics that would be awesome too!!

 

Jorge

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