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BLUE BACKED A/C WINGS


BEAST
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Picked these up from an antique mall today. The dealer told me the name of the vet whose estate he bought them from. When I looked up the vet's obit, it stated that he had served as a tailgunner during the war. I found his name on another website and it said that he served overseas from 1944-1945.

 

The wings are on a blue background and they have been "enhanced" to puff out from the uniform. If you look on the back, you will notice a piece of material has been glued on to make them stand out.

 

I picked up some of the vet's other items, such as his ribbons and SSI. Unfortunely, the dealer also had his collar disks, but wanted $15 a piece for the US and the USAAF disks. Can't justify $30 for a pair of EM disks. Maybe I can talk him down later.

 

post-203-1208040129.jpg

 

post-203-1208040136.jpg

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Beast,

 

I am no expert on WW2 wings, but they kind of strike me as looking British made. Any thoughts from the WW2 experts?

 

Thanks!

 

Chris

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If they were on brown wool felt I would peg them as Aussie made. As they are they definately have that Commonwealth feel.

 

Gary

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These are brit made.I have a set with bullion on blue and also a set like those posted.The Blue wool is a spin on the blue wool used on the back of the Sterling wings worn to designate combat crew.One 8th AF man said the men who had the blue behind the wings were the oned who were among the first to fly missions early in the war.The blue backer was a type of status symbol for the early men.

 

The Brit embroidered wings I have came from an Army nurse who collected them in England,

 

RON

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BOB K. RKSS

The cloth blue back Wings were made in England during WWII (don't believe thay were officially authorized), but were worn by flyers on the chest of Leather flying jackets (A-2; etc.).

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BOB K. RKSS

$15.00 for a WWII Air Corps EM disk is Not over priced. It's nice to find WWII made items for next to no money, but U.S. collectors should "get real" with values, & always trying to "get something for nothing": all WWII items are over 62 years old, & have extra value.

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$15.00 for a WWII Air Corps EM disk is Not over priced. It's nice to find WWII made items for next to no money, but U.S. collectors should "get real" with values, & always trying to "get something for nothing": all WWII items are over 62 years old, & have extra value.

 

 

Bob,

Thanks for your input. One of the reasons I posted the information about the price of the disks is that I wanted feedback. I don't like to break up veteran groupings and unfortunetely this grouping has been broken up twice already; once by the family and then by the antique dealer. This is where my dilemma occurs. At what price do you keep what's left of a grouping together?

 

The going price for a WWII USAAF disk, even on EBay, is about $5. As the disk for sale is ID'd and part of a group, that adds additional value, but not 3X going rate. So do I spend $30.00 for $10.00 worth of items, knowing that the grouping will never be complete or put the money into something else? In my rules of collecting (rules differ for all), I set a value to an item and try to stay to it. Do I ever overpay? Of course I do. But my rules allow me, for the most part, to stay within my collecting budget. My rules will in some cases result in buyers remorse, when I miss an item, but I rarely have buyers remorse for overpaying.

 

Each one of us has our own rules or guidelines that we try to follow and so far mine have worked well for me.

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CNY Militaria

I have to agree with Beast here, I would argue that most colectors would shun paying $15 for a single AAF collar disc unless it was made by a scarce maker or had some other unique feature about it. I just ran a quick completed ebay item search and found original WWII AAF single collar discs selling for $2, $3, and pair of two for $4. None of the standard ones peaked past $3. The highest priced one was for $12.06 because it was screwback, domed, and made by an often unseen maker. Therefore, I would not consider the rate to $15 each, since we are working with an online global marketplace. If however, someone needed one quick for whatever reason, and ebay is not an option, they could certainly pay any price (I have seen it done before). Additionally, most can still go to military and gun shows and flea markets and get these rather cheap. I most often see them in military dealer junk boxes for $1-2 each because they are so common. Perhaps one day they will reach $15 or so each, but that time has not yet come in my opinion. I hate having to make the decision what to keep and not keep in a grouping, but there comes a time when paying too much for lesser valued items in the group makes it more difficult to bear financially. I agree with Beast that the $30 for the two collar discs could be spent on other items.

 

Just my $.02

 

Respectfully,

Justin

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I look at it a little differently.

 

I consider that sometimes I will pay a lot for an item, and other times I will get a bargain. Over time, you can amortize the value. In other words, you can think of it as "What do I have in it?"

 

For example; You have a hundred collar disks that you have paid an average of $2.00 for, you buy two more for 30 dollars, since previously the average price you paid for each collar disk was $2.00, then by adding two additional for 30, you come out with the following equation:

 

[(100 X 2.00)+(2 X 15)] / 102 = $2.25 average per disk.

 

Granted, you are paying far over market value for the individual disk, but the net sunk cost per disk only raises by .25 per disk. Thus it is still a good buy.

 

Add to this the "emotional" value of keeping the group together. It may be true, that you can get replacement disks for less on ebay, but if you let these go, and someone else buys them, you wont ever be be able to get this vets disks, to go with the rest of his group, at any price.

 

Chris

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Get TWO sets of identical disks, go back to the antique dealer and make a trade for his ONE set. He may understand your explanation that you want THIS vet's disks.

Kurt

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Chris, Your point about averaging the price is well taken and I have done that before when I purchased an entire grouping. This time, I won't be purchasing the entire group as it is impossible for me to do that. As I mentioned, the family kept some, and the dealer not only has broken the remainder up, but he has mixed it in with other groups. He has about 20 collar disks, mostly US, but some Infantry, one USAAF, one Officer's USAAF, etc.

 

As the dealer hasn't been around for a week, I can't even ask him to pick out the pieces that came with this group. The best I can do is pick out the pieces that appear to be correct, and make a display with them. I left an offer at the mall which was more than their worth. We will see what happens.

 

101combatvet, If the entire group existed and hadn't been messed with, I probably would not quibble as I would get enough of a good price overall to justify the cost. However, the entire group no longer exists. It ceased to be a complete group the day of the estate sale. It became even further watered down when the dealer mixed it in with his other military pins. So for me to pay 3X more than the value of the item, and not know that they are 100% the vets, is more than I am willing to do.

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Erick

 

GREAT Brit made aircrew wings! I have never seem these on an A-2 but I have seen and owned some on Ike jackets. Let me know if you ever get tired of them!! I agree with your logic on the collar discs completely!

 

Paul

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Nice wings!

 

These were made in England for members of the 8th Air Force. The blue backing came about as a prevention against "ground" crew wearing unauthorized wings while out on liberty and other places of duty. Thus, this backing became known as "combat aircew" backing. These were worn on the service uniform as well as flight jackets, though rarely on the latter (since they weren't a piece of normal liberty attire). Usually, one will find a uniform with a rectangular piece of fabric that the sterling wing was pinned on (or clutchback wing was pinned through). However, enterprising officers and enlisted personnel had the English tailors directly embroider bullion wings onto the blue cloth, and more uncommonly, cotton thread wings onto the blue cloth. I have personally seen everything from bullion wings, sterling wings and these cotton embroidered wings on the blue backings sewn on service uniforms.

 

An interesting note is that the blue fabric was typically blue wool felt. However, I have owned uniforms that include other locally-obtained blue fabric, to include a piece of one former-RCAF pilot's RCAF blue uniform!

 

Hope that helps.

 

Dave

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Picked these up from an antique mall today. The dealer told me the name of the vet whose estate he bought them from. When I looked up the vet's obit, it stated that he had served as a tailgunner during the war. I found his name on another website and it said that he served overseas from 1944-1945.

 

The wings are on a blue background and they have been "enhanced" to puff out from the uniform. If you look on the back, you will notice a piece of material has been glued on to make them stand out.

 

I picked up some of the vet's other items, such as his ribbons and SSI. Unfortunely, the dealer also had his collar disks, but wanted $15 a piece for the US and the USAAF disks. Can't justify $30 for a pair of EM disks. Maybe I can talk him down later.

 

post-203-1208040129.jpg

 

post-203-1208040136.jpg

 

Here are mine, from my inhereted collection ( they have been posted here before)

 

post-2527-1208194675.jpg post-2527-1208194690.jpg

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Ditto to those how said you have an English-made aircrew wing Classic pattern and comes in almost all the different ratings. It is missing its backing cloth, and so you see the padding, but still a nice wing. Here is mine.

post-1519-1208237055.jpg

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Here are two loose Blue-backed wings in my collection, the aircrew is from a gunner who served in the 453rd BG, the navigator was in the 390th BG, enjoy, Mark

post-527-1208282932.jpgpost-527-1208282942.jpg

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Here are two examples of the wings being worn on tunics. These men flew in the 100th Troop Carrier Squadron, 441st TCG, 9th AF. As you can see both styles were used, enjoy, Mark

post-527-1208283068.jpgpost-527-1208283080.jpg

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  • 5 years later...
doinworkinvans

Can we have some more "good" examples of these??? I really like these type wings but am always hesitant to pull the trigger. I am trying to learn.

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Hi,

 

Nice set of English made crew member wing on blue wool. Also has the little extra piece to make the center of the wing stand out on the uniform. The men used these on their Ike jackets or the earlier 4 pocket uniform or even the A2 jacket. It's always nice to find a grouping at a local Antique mall that you can trace with the mans name but you have to remember that they own the pieces and they dicate the price. What we see on eBay or at shows are a different matter as Antique dealers are notorious for high prices but that is the way it goes. Plus, we don't know what the Antique dealer paid for the items to start with. But what you can do is replace the other items accordingly as you'll still have a nice grouping. If you really wanted everything the dealer had to offer, then it would have been good to start with a counter offer and go from there. They usually will work with you as that is the case I have found. If they don't, you have other options.

 

Bill

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I hit the antique malls quite a bit because I need the exercise and once in a while I make a decent score. I think a lot of stuff ends up in antique malls because the seller paid too much at auction and can't get rid of it at a profit on ebay. I've seen stuff languish for years in antique malls. I've made serious and decent offers on stuff that has been there quite some time and many times the dealer comes back with "I've got more than that in it". A lot of them are generalists and they don't know enough about military collectibles and they pay too much at auction. They don't understand that just because they once saw a Luxenberg wing bring $400 in an auction, that doesn't mean their sterling marked graduation wing is worth $400 as well.

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