thetrenchman1918 Posted June 2, 2013 Author Share #26 Posted June 2, 2013 I am well aware that each m1 doesn't have its own number, but would a lot of prototypes have had a heat stamp- I do not think so as it would have been a very limited run, and yes I realize the absence of a stamp does not prove it is a prototype, even slightly, but if it was stamped It would be more likely it was a regular helmet that had been modified, all I ment was would a prototype be marked as being a prototype. Again thank you for any help or input Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anton67 Posted June 2, 2013 Share #27 Posted June 2, 2013 The bails/bales/loops are not mounted as a typical US FB helmet. On the US WWII FB, the bails/bales/loops were mounted above the rim, not on it like your helmet. If I had to guess I would say euro helmet but who knows. You can use some steel wool and try to remove the paint where the heat lot number is located (under the brim). I have found true US helmets where the heat lot number is not visible due to bad stamping and or erosion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anton67 Posted June 2, 2013 Share #28 Posted June 2, 2013 Here is a lid I just posted. Notice where the bales are mounted (one broke off). Also here is a pic of where the heat lot number should be located. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anton67 Posted June 2, 2013 Share #29 Posted June 2, 2013 Heat lot - not visible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thetrenchman1918 Posted June 2, 2013 Author Share #30 Posted June 2, 2013 Thanks for the input, I am hesitant to scrape the paint in case this does turn out to be a prototype, if you go back and look at my photos yo will see how the rim is very different as is the bails, but the one remaining chin strap leads me to believe this helmet is American in origin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WWII_GI Posted June 2, 2013 Share #31 Posted June 2, 2013 This is a picture of the experimental TS-3 helmet the prototype of the m1 helmets. Notice how the fixed loop has bent feet at each end that is welded to the helmet. Also it has riveted on chinstraps that were later changed to be sewn on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WWII_GI Posted June 2, 2013 Share #32 Posted June 2, 2013 I forgot the picture Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thetrenchman1918 Posted June 2, 2013 Author Share #33 Posted June 2, 2013 from you photo it looks like this has a rim, and unfortunately for me there is very little in common, someone mentioned that the us did experiment with rolled over rims during the prototype stage, is any info available on these helmets? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thetrenchman1918 Posted June 3, 2013 Author Share #34 Posted June 3, 2013 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thetrenchman1918 Posted June 3, 2013 Author Share #35 Posted June 3, 2013 The chinstrap looks very American to me, but I would appreciate the input of others Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WWII_GI Posted June 3, 2013 Share #36 Posted June 3, 2013 Are the tips sharp and pointed? If so it would be early straps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thetrenchman1918 Posted June 3, 2013 Author Share #37 Posted June 3, 2013 yes, is that the same type that the Kelly helmet (1917a1) would have? I do not currently have a Kelly helmet but if I remember correctly that is the same type which would again lead me to believe this could possibly be a prototype Also the strap has defiantly not been re attached ie it is the original, as put on by the factory Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WWII_GI Posted June 4, 2013 Share #38 Posted June 4, 2013 Ok sounds plausible. I would look for any problem or mark or anything on the helmet. Other than that I have no idea. I would think they would stamp some experimental marking on it or something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thetrenchman1918 Posted June 4, 2013 Author Share #39 Posted June 4, 2013 I have looked in the helmet, in the usual spots and others and have not seen any marks, I was wondering if the TS-3 had any markings, I realize there are not many around but does anyone know? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thetrenchman1918 Posted June 4, 2013 Author Share #40 Posted June 4, 2013 Also, how does the welding of the bails compare to an early war standard helmet? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben@HI Posted June 4, 2013 Share #41 Posted June 4, 2013 i saw a prototype once. the straps were not like an M1917A1, they were the same as an M1917A1. it had that X in a box stitching like they have. not a bar tack like on most M1 helmets. thats about all i can remember about it, hope that was some help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WWII_GI Posted June 4, 2013 Share #42 Posted June 4, 2013 On yea I forgot the 1917A1 helmets have the X stitching on the straps. Now I have no idea on this. It could be a prototype that they later put straps on it and sent it into combat, I really don't know. Does it fit a liner correctly? If it was a prototype it would be made to fit a hawley fibre liner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BOLO Posted June 4, 2013 Share #43 Posted June 4, 2013 On yea I forgot the 1917A1 helmets have the X stitching on the straps. Now I have no idea on this. It could be a prototype that they later put straps on it and sent it into combat, I really don't know. Does it fit a liner correctly? If it was a prototype it would be made to fit a hawley fibre liner. here's a photo of how the straps look on the M1917A1 w/ box stitching Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thetrenchman1918 Posted June 4, 2013 Author Share #44 Posted June 4, 2013 a regular line fight roughly, with a small lip protruding however it is relatively close pics to come later Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thetrenchman1918 Posted June 8, 2013 Author Share #45 Posted June 8, 2013 Since no one seems to know, are there any dealers that I should try to get in contact with to possibly find more information? Thank you for any help Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bugme Posted June 8, 2013 Share #46 Posted June 8, 2013 Since little to nothing is known about the prototypical M-1's, it is highly unlikely that you're going to get an answer from a dealer if you have not gotten one here among some of the most experienced helmet collectors around. You act incredulous that no one seems to know for sure but, what you're asking is not like pulling a rabbit out of a hat. Unfortunately, the military didn't take excessive amounts of photo's of the prototypes and then save them for future collectors. When the helmet didn't meet their needs, they trashed it all. Right now, all you have is a definite maybe that it might be a possible prototype... or not. Since no one seems to know, are there any dealers that I should try to get in contact with to possibly find more information? Thank you for any help Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thetrenchman1918 Posted June 13, 2013 Author Share #47 Posted June 13, 2013 so most likely it will always just be a neat conversation piece with minimal value as it cant be proven one way or the other? thank you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BOLO Posted June 13, 2013 Share #48 Posted June 13, 2013 is the shell magnetic? some foreign shells use a different type of steel US shells shouldnt be magnetic is the weight the same as a US M1 shell? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sgtdorango Posted June 13, 2013 Share #49 Posted June 13, 2013 It might help to post more detailed and better photos, rim details top and underside of the rim edging, bail details, like bolo said weght etc... Maybe some of the guys here with experimentals will see similarities in rim production.....better pics will surely help here......mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thetrenchman1918 Posted June 13, 2013 Author Share #50 Posted June 13, 2013 I put a magnet to what is displayed on my shelf, all my 1917's are magnetic, the helmet in question IS magnetic and my Schlueter is not like BOLO said. I will try to get better quality pictures tonight Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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