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S McKibben

Nice Storage Unit find**AIRBORNE RANGER**

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Yes...I understand that. I was referring to those "grunts" who were air-transported directly into combat. If that was the case then many would be eligible for multiple awards?

How is that not a ride from point to point in a combat zone????

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Yes,, if the grunts were attacked while in flight and their actions warranted the award they would be eligible. Maybe someone could produce some paperwork for an individual that would fit the bill.


Looking for items from the 38th Infantry Regiment

Feel free to read/leave For Sale section feedback: CLICK HERE

ASMIC: 5218

"Live for something rather than die for nothing."

-General George S. Patton Jr.

 

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How is that not a ride from point to point in a combat zone????

 

Pedantic? Being transported directly into battle is slightly different from being transported from fire-base A to fire-base B (for example) The former would be inherently more dangerous, would it not?


"We shall defend our island, whatever the cost may be. We shall fight on the beaches, we shall fight on the landing grounds, we shall fight in the fields and in the streets, we shall fight in the hills; we shall never surrender!"

 

Winston Churchill

" Life is what happens to you when you're busy making other plans."

John Winston Lennon

 

 

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The Air Medal is awarded to a person serving with the Army that has set himself/herself apart from his/her comrades by meritorious achievement while involved in aerial flight. The award may be made upon the acknowledgment of single acts of merit or heroism, or for meritorious service. The award of Air Medal is chiefly meant to acknowledge either current crew member or non-crew member flying status that demands the individual to be involved in aerial fight as a consistent part of their principal duties, though it is also awarded to personnel whose combat duties demand consistent flying in that which is not a passenger status or the performance of an especially remarkable act while in the position of a crew member but not on flying status. To be awarded the medal, an evident contribution to the operational land combat mission or to the mission of the aircraft in flight must have been made. Individuals whose combat activities demand them to fly include those in attack elements of units engaged in air-land assaults against an armed enemy and those directly engaged in airborne command and run of combat operations. The aforementioned activities, usually at the brigade/group level and below, ascertain eligibility for the award, but the measure of heroism, meritorious accomplishment or commendable service will verify who will be awarded the Air Medal. It will not be awarded to persons that use air transportation only for the means of traveling from place to place in a combat zone.

 


"We shall defend our island, whatever the cost may be. We shall fight on the beaches, we shall fight on the landing grounds, we shall fight in the fields and in the streets, we shall fight in the hills; we shall never surrender!"

 

Winston Churchill

" Life is what happens to you when you're busy making other plans."

John Winston Lennon

 

 

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..I don't know why you are beating this dead horse. Air Medals were frequently awarded to ground personnel in Vietnam, largely because helicopters were integrated so thoroughly in to ground combat operations. There is nothing unusual about this at all. Much depended on the unit. The 101st and Air Cav for example were air mobile combat units, meaning the infantrymen riding in the helo were part of an air/ground combat maneuver element. This is different than, say, a grunt hitching a ride to a fire base. No AM for him. I believe Air Medals were awarded at the Division level, or perhaps even lower during Vietnam...and the rules changed throughout the war.


I will pay top dollar for original WWII items pertaining to:

 

OSS

OSS Maritime Unit

NCDU

UDT

Scouts and Raiders

FSSF

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Not beating a dead horse at all. Just seeking clarification of the criteria. ;)


"We shall defend our island, whatever the cost may be. We shall fight on the beaches, we shall fight on the landing grounds, we shall fight in the fields and in the streets, we shall fight in the hills; we shall never surrender!"

 

Winston Churchill

" Life is what happens to you when you're busy making other plans."

John Winston Lennon

 

 

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There have been other discussions about this. During Vietnam, the criteria varied by unit and time period. Modern criteria cannot be used. Here is one of the discussions...

 

http://www.usmilitariaforum.com/forums/index.php?/topic/62508-vietnam-soldier-help-sfc-orgen-walter/?hl=%2Borgen+%2Bwalter


I will pay top dollar for original WWII items pertaining to:

 

OSS

OSS Maritime Unit

NCDU

UDT

Scouts and Raiders

FSSF

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Very nice find a keeper for sure my friend. What are you thinking about restoring the jacket? Once you find out what all is missing do you plan on putting it back together?

 

Yes I will restore whats missing. Hope they come up with it when the storage unit is finished being cleaned out.

 

Shawn


Facebook Militaria Trading Post https://www.facebook.com/groups/466700773358049/

Looking for WW-2,

88th Inf Div,

99th/394th inf,

1st Cav Groupings/Items

Also Looking For Headgear ALL Countrys.

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There have been other discussions about this. During Vietnam, the criteria varied by unit and time period. Modern criteria cannot be used. Here is one of the discussions...

 

http://www.usmilitariaforum.com/forums/index.php?/topic/62508-vietnam-soldier-help-sfc-orgen-walter/?hl=%2Borgen+%2Bwalter

 

Thanks for that link.


"We shall defend our island, whatever the cost may be. We shall fight on the beaches, we shall fight on the landing grounds, we shall fight in the fields and in the streets, we shall fight in the hills; we shall never surrender!"

 

Winston Churchill

" Life is what happens to you when you're busy making other plans."

John Winston Lennon

 

 

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As far as the wear of Branch Immaterial is concerned- years ago (when I was in) soldiers wore the BOS of thier unit, not necessarily of their own MOS. My MOS was an Engineer and later a Signal Corps one, but for my assignments I wore variously MP, Artillery, Engineer, Signal Corps and at one time Branch Immaterial when I was with Recruiting Command until the 1976 change and then we all switched over to our indivdual MOS BOS collar insignia.

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When researching criteria for an award it is best to look at the source. AR 600-8-22 from apd.army.mil rather than a website interpretation which usually drops important details. The criteria has not changed since 1942, but regulations have always been up to interpretation of the approval authority. Though the oak leaf is no longer used, instead numeral devices denote subsequent awards.

 

3–16. Air Medal
a.The Air Medal was established by Executive Order 9158, 11 May 1942 as amended by Executive Order 9242–A, 11 September 1942.
b.The Air Medal is awarded to any person who, while serving in any capacity in or with the U.S. Army, will have distinguished himself or herself by meritorious achievement while participating in aerial flight. Awards may be made to recognize single acts of merit or heroism, or for meritorious service as described below.
c.Awards may be made for acts of heroism in connection with military operations against an armed enemy or while engaged in military operations involving conflict with an opposing armed force in which the United States is not a belligerent party, which are of a lesser degree than required for award of the Distinguished Flying Cross.
d.Awards may be made for single acts of meritorious achievement, involving superior airmanship, which are of a lesser degree than required for award of the Distinguished Flying Cross, but nevertheless were accomplished with distinction beyond that normally expected.
e.Awards for meritorious service may be made for sustained distinction in the performance of duties involving regular and frequent participation in aerial flight for a period of at least 6 months. In this regard, accumulation of a specified number of hours and missions will not serve as the basis for award of the Air Medal. Criteria in paragraph c above, concerning conditions of conflict are applicable to award of the Air Medal for meritorious service.
f. Award of the Air Medal is primarily intended to recognize those personnel who are on current crewmember or noncrewmember flying status which requires them to participate in aerial flight on a regular and frequent basis in the performance of their primary duties. However, it may also be awarded to certain other individuals whose combat duties require regular and frequent flying in other than a passenger status, or individuals who perform a particularly noteworthy act while performing the function of a crewmember, but who are not on flying status as prescribed in AR 600–106. These individuals must make a discernible contribution to the operational land combat mission or to the mission of the aircraft in flight. Examples of personnel whose combat duties require them to fly include those in the attack elements of units involved in air-land assaults against an armed enemy and those directly involved in airborne command and control of combat operations. Involvement in such activities, normally at the brigade/group level and below, serves only to establish eligibility for award of the Air Medal; the degree of heroism, meritorious achievement or exemplary service determines who should receive the award. Awards will not be made to individuals who use air transportation solely for the purpose of moving from point to point in a combat zone.
g.Numerals, starting with 2 will be used to denote second and subsequent awards of the Air Medal. (See para 6–4.

 

In a nut shell, you can go from passenger to "crew" if you become involved in defending, landing, aiding, ect...the aircraft. It would be awarded for a single act and not meritorious service. Where that would not be true, is say the aircraft comes under fire and the crew defends it and makes it to the LZ. The crew would qualify for an air medal but the passengers would not.

 

 

 

Just to add to the interpretation of regulations, research how the CIB was awarded from the beginning of GWOT to now. In the beginning, as soon as one element of a unit took fire and returned fire the entire company's 11B and 11C were blanket awarded the CIB despite most having not engaged in combat yet. When I got mine in 2007, it was individual orders and only by each individual being engaged in combat. It all had to do with the approval authority's interpretation of the same regulation.


Looking for items from the 38th Infantry Regiment

Feel free to read/leave For Sale section feedback: CLICK HERE

ASMIC: 5218

"Live for something rather than die for nothing."

-General George S. Patton Jr.

 

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Excellent....thanks TRR! ;)


"We shall defend our island, whatever the cost may be. We shall fight on the beaches, we shall fight on the landing grounds, we shall fight in the fields and in the streets, we shall fight in the hills; we shall never surrender!"

 

Winston Churchill

" Life is what happens to you when you're busy making other plans."

John Winston Lennon

 

 

donation2010.gif

donation2011.gifdonation2012.gifdonation2013.gif

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A grouping of photos of the returning GIs at the Oakland Army Terminal of the 1st Battalion 327th Infantry (Airmobile) 101st Airborne Division (Airmobile) upon their issuance of new Class A uniforms in January 1972, it does show every Swinging Richard with an Air Medal along with the usual ribbons for VN service, more over they wear the 327th Inf DI's on their Garrison Caps, and not the Para Glider cap patches, and their trousers are unbloused with Low Quarters. It would seem to me in Vietnam that any men of any unit or MOS really not just Infantry, say like Combat Engineers etc, would have to make a set number of CAs, that's Combat Assaults, whether into a Hot LZ or otherwise, as long as it was classified as a CA, though just how many, I have no idea.

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Well she came thru on some more stuff. GREAT Stuff and still digging. His name was Larry Gordon Fout US51646789. I got his bronze star with the V on it. Lots of pics. A honorable discharge from 1968 and then relisted.

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Facebook Militaria Trading Post https://www.facebook.com/groups/466700773358049/

Looking for WW-2,

88th Inf Div,

99th/394th inf,

1st Cav Groupings/Items

Also Looking For Headgear ALL Countrys.

donation2010.gifdonation2011.gif

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Very nice, should be easy to restore now!


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Good deal.Glad she came through.

 

Great group.


In Memoriam:
Lieutenant J.Kostelec 1-3 First Special Service Force MIA/PD 4 March 1944 Italy
I HAVE SEEN THE ENEMY AND IT IS DAYLIGHT
Forget about the tips..We'll get hell to pay (AC/DC)
"If you cant get out and run with the big dogs then sit on the porch and bark at the cars going by.."

Have you Hugged a Clown Today?

You Cant Get A Sun Tan On The Moon..





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this ties him to the Co L 75th Rangers

 

 

The uniform is an awesome find on its own....The added photos, Bronze Star and paperwork turns this into a killer grouping!

 

I tried looking Fout up on Ancestry and only found a few directory listings (white pages) matching his name. It's quite possible he is still living as there is nothing for him in BIRLS or SSDI.

 

With that said, you may want to remove the paperwork that lists his SSN. That, or at least block it out on the paperwork.


Eric

ASMIC #5492

 

Are you a militaria collector in PA, NJ or DE? If so, please feel free to join my "Delaware Valley Militaria Collectors" page on Facebook:

https://www.facebook.com/MilitariaCollectorsOfDelawareValley#!/groups/DELVALMILITARIA/

 

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Judging by what I see in those pics/docs it appears that Fouts was in SFTG before he served in Co L (Ranger)

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