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VISOR OFFICER - HELP ID BRANCH COLOR -


Jamecharles
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Jamecharles

Hi all, i've a question , wich branch is this visor cap??

 

bvjg129.th.jpg
bvjg130.th.jpg
bvjg131.th.jpg

Can you help me??
those colors remind me the tank destroyer branch but colors are inverted... is that another ''post ww2'' branch color?

thank you all

Best

Giancarlo

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Jamecharles

Well after few research i spotted the branch and colors:

 

this is a rare example of tank destroyer campaign hat cord

fdfps.jpg

Uploaded with No_outside_hosting.us

 

 

dsffsdj.jpg
as you can see in the upper part of the acorn there is Always the main color of the branch, as per engineer and medical dep. cord reported down here, that explain the colors of the blue dress visor posted up.

 

GS

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Jamecharles

LOL i'm happy too Matt i'll try to get a photo of the lot complete, i think that the officer pins are scarce and expansive :(

anyone have one??
GS

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AAF_Collection

I for one will be looking forward to seeing the lot!. I'm afraid I don't have the pins,but good luck in the search. As you focus on Blue Dress uniforms,did you see the Air Corps cape I recently posted in this section?.

 

Matt.

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Jamecharles

Yeah it's Amazing i've seen it on epay great catch Matt!!!
Did you get any other BD uniforms in your collections??
GS

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Justin B.

I'd be very surprised if it's Tank Destroyer. The TD insignia weren't authorized till 1943, when dress blues weren't much used, obviously, and the units were disbanded after the war. Also, orange was definitely the "first named" color. Most of all, TD was never a branch for officers, they were assigned to TD Force but retained their original basic branch (likewise for armor till 1950).

 

As to what it is, I'm not great with colors but I'm stumped. Something from a state, maybe?

 

Justin B.

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Would not this type be a 1920s type?Yes by the late 30s, early part of the 40s this type with multi colored twist cord and acorns were superceded by the solid color cord in the primary branch color, with the slide keeper and the acorns in the secondery branch color in solid color too. If a TD campaign hat cord was introduced it would be in this style.

 

Example, the pre WWII just prior too and on 7 December 1941 Campaign Hat Cord for the Ordnance Corps.

post-34986-0-47473800-1367641883.jpg post-34986-0-67031600-1367641871.jpg

 

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Jamecharles

Understood "Patches", Now question is wich branch is the BD uniform and wich branch is the cord of the campagna hat?

Thank you all

GS

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Jamecharles

TD was never a branch for officers, they were assigned to TD Force but retained their original basic branch (likewise for armor till 1950).

 

Hi Justin , i've look around to spot some officer's uniforms of TD and i've seen that branch insigna exist, I would not be so drastic in saying that the officers did not have a uniform with collar pins for TD, otherwise we should not find any of them.

 

some officers pins:

http://www.usmilitariaforum.com/forums/index.php?/topic/56185-tank-destroyer-ssi-and-insignia/page-4

http://www.usmilitariaforum.com/forums/index.php?/topic/56185-tank-destroyer-ssi-and-insignia/page-11

http://www.usmilitariaforum.com/forums/index.php?/topic/56185-tank-destroyer-ssi-and-insignia/page-14

OFFICERS with Tank destroyer collar pins:

http://www.usmilitariaforum.com/forums/index.php?app=core&module=attach&section=attach&attach_rel_module=post&attach_id=71605

http://www.usmilitariaforum.com/forums/index.php?app=core&module=attach&section=attach&attach_rel_module=post&attach_id=71608

http://www.usmilitariaforum.com/forums/index.php?app=core&module=attach&section=attach&attach_rel_module=post&attach_id=109836

http://www.usmilitariaforum.com/forums/index.php?app=core&module=attach&section=attach&attach_rel_module=post&attach_id=197832

http://i160.photobucket.com/albums/t188/TD-soldier/TDLieutenanttakeninBrussels.jpg

 

I'm not so sure that orange was main color, i'm try to find some original document where was specified the main color but i can't get out anything, for example in an ''osprey'' book for each army branches there are specified the main color and piping, for TD is not specified.

 

Just one question the main color of this flag means nothing?

http://www.usmilitariaforum.com/forums/index.php?app=core&module=attach&section=attach&attach_rel_module=post&attach_id=44059

 

 

And I do not exclude that an officer has decided to make himself a Blue dress with color of tank destroyer, with my little experience in the field of BD uniforms I have learned to never take anything for granted especially the extravagances.

This is demonstrated by the fact that I found BD uniforms of General Staff, Military Police and Military Intelligence (and you know they was a small reserve corp: http://www.usmilitariaforum.com/forums/index.php?/topic/137154-rare-unique-uniform/ ), all of 1938 or 40.

 

now i'm really curious to know wich other branch it could be, anyone can help us? any original / period

 

GS

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Jeeper704

There was a Tank Destroyer School, so I think it is very possible this cap is indeed of a TD officer.

You had the piping for the overseas cap as well, which some officers used.

 

There is a difference of an officer being assigned to a TD unit (mostly keeping his original branch collar insignia) and an officer that graduated from the TD School (wearing TD collar insignia).

 

On the other hand ... the piping reminds me of General Staff Corps too.

Maybe it is this branch?

 

Erwin

 

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Justin B.

Hi Justin , i've look around to spot some officer's uniforms of TD and i've seen that branch insigna exist, I would not be so drastic in saying that the officers did not have a uniform with collar pins for TD, otherwise we should not find any of them.

 

 

Right, like I said the lapel/collar insignia were authorized in March 1943. What I mean is, officer personnel had/have a "basic branch" in which they were commissioned and through which their career progresses. Tank Destroyer was not a "basic branch." Armor was a similar situation. If you look at the 1945 Army Register you'll see there is no listing for TD as an officer branch.

 

It was April 1, 1943, BTW, when orders suspended wear of blue dress uniforms for the duration of the war plus six months.

 

I'm not so sure that orange was main color, i'm try to find some original document where was specified the main color but i can't get out anything, for example in an ''osprey'' book for each army branches there are specified the main color and piping, for TD is not specified.

From the 1945 Officer's Guide:

post-3982-0-99600400-1367686751.jpg

 

And I do not exclude that an officer has decided to make himself a Blue dress with color of tank destroyer, with my little experience in the field of BD uniforms I have learned to never take anything for granted especially the extravagances.

This is demonstrated by the fact that I found BD uniforms of General Staff, Military Police and Military Intelligence (and you know they was a small reserve corp: http://www.usmilitariaforum.com/forums/index.php?/topic/137154-rare-unique-uniform/ ), all of 1938 or 40.

You're quite right, anything's possible, I'm just saying I would be very surprised. I'd sure like to know for certain what it is!

 

Justin B.

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Maybe Jeepers is right, as of 1921 per

AR 600-35 War Department, Wash. DC, October 11, 1921.
General Staff Corps, gold piped with black.

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Jamecharles
On the other hand ... the piping reminds me of General Staff Corps too.

Maybe it is this branch?

 

Erwin

 

 

Maybe Jeepers is right, as of 1921 per

AR 600-35 War Department, Wash. DC, October 11, 1921.

General Staff Corps, gold piped with black.

 

Yes, it could be but color still inverted too, main color Gold piped black and vice versa.

 

http://img24.No_outside_hosting.us/img24/7419/hjkju.jpg

 

 

 

From the 1945 Officer's Guide:

attachicon.gif1945_og_bos.jpg

 

You're quite right, anything's possible, I'm just saying I would be very surprised. I'd sure like to know for certain what it is!

 

Justin B.

That's a good find, i was not able to get a copy after 1943 so that's great :D thank you alot Justin!

i'm still in doubt about this BD lot we will see when it 'll arrive in my hand :) many thanks to all and any other comment will be really appreciated

 

GS

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  • 6 months later...

I've finally discovered the reason of those 2 colors, officer army band director.
ASAP i'll post an original photo of one of them in their army band blue uniform, totally different type of dress from the army BD

 

ciao
GS

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