Fake Dewey Medal on eBay - A fool and his money....

[Adam R]

Adam...is the color/tone of the obverse too light in your experience?? Or maybe a result of the lighting/flash? Doesn't seem as dark or rich as the ones I have seen.

Yes, often the color of the metal on the copies is a bit light. Real Dewey Medals have a nice dark finish. Often harsh lighting or a flash can make a dark medal look might lighter in color.

[Military-Memorabilia]

Just an observation and question; I notice both fakes are attributed to the USS Baltimore. If the medal is currently being stamped out, this may be another "red flag" to look for. Are any of the current fakes not attributed to a seaman aboard the USS Baltimore?

[Javelin4life]

The stamping is definitely off. However, I noticed this in the description which allows one to possibly play devil's advocate:

 

"I have reason to be believe this medal is a high quality reproduction and not a period original. Accordingly it is priced as such."

 

So I guess he's at least throwing it out there that medal MAY be a reproduction. At least these guys may not have to have a $2000 lesson. Just my two cents though.

 

 

Alex

[Jack's Son]

"I have reason to be believe this medal is a high quality reproduction and not a period original. Accordingly it is priced as such."

Alex

With such a disclaimer in his ad, he's off the hook as far as I'm concerned. Tough to be hard on him.

[All Things Polar]

The fakes seem to be getting better and better.

 

Glenn

[kanemono]

Here is the information on the machine used to produce the Dewy medal "engraving" You can easily tell the difference between "hand engraving", "stamped letters" (original to the Dewy Medal) and machine cut letters. You need to educate yourself!

Dick

 

PANTOGRAPH ENGRAVING MACHINE – An instrument for copying a plane figure to a desired scale, consisting of styluses for tracing and copying mounted on four jointed rods in the form of a parallelogram with extended sides. The portion of the pantograph that does the engraving is either a diamond point stylus or a rotating cutter or “mill.”
For items of jewelry the diamond point is used. The diamond does not actually engrave the metal as does a graver, rather it scratches the metal and is for that reason commonly known as “diamond drag” engraving. The milling head is used for engraving plastic signs and name badges as well as for making dies and hobs.
In the jewelry and sign business, the New Hermes brand of pantograph engraving machine (under the trade name of Engravograph) once dominated the field whereas among die makers, the names Alexander, Cornite, Gorton and Deckel predominate with more robust and precise equipment.
While the tracing arm and stylus or cutter contact of a pantograph is operated by hand, such work is known as “machine engraving” and not “hand engraving” within the traditional meaning of the term. Hand engraving is done with a graver that is controlled in a freehand manner.
Manual pantograph engraving machines have largely been displaced in the jewelry; sign and award businesses by computer programmed and operated systems. These systems continue to use the diamond stylus and rotating cutter except in the case of laser engraving systems.

Pictured is a "diamond drag" pantograph by Pepe Tools and four milling pantographs by Alexander, Gorton, New Hermes, and Deckel.

[dskjl]

Guys,, I’m not a master engraver but I was in the jewelry business for and the engraving doesn't look like a paragraph as much as a dull belly graver to me. I have used both hand engravers and paragraph for years and although I am not an expert but the lines are too deep, wavy, and you can see differences in depth with each hand stroke or push of the graver. There are also crossover cuts and wiggle lines that suggest a dull belly graver. Frankly it looks rushed and done with a dull graver by a less experienced person. Or maybe stamped then gone over with a graver to try and tighten it up.

 

On the medal that is posted as a known original the graving is crooked (the letters are no in a straight line), and they are either well worn or the medal has been burnished over time. Frankly this medal also looks like a less experienced engraver or even stamped rather than graved.

Just my 2 cents

[ROY222]

On that first photo on page one that shows the engraving, could this be a genuine medal that has had the engraving privately done? One sees private engraving on many medals. Why not this one too?

Also the copper in the medal and in the devices of the engraved letters show aging/corrosion as it has turned green. This looks like it was done many years ago.

 

I consider myself someone that is still learning and not a fool. Part of the learning process, unfortunetely, is that one is going to buy some questionable/fake items at times.
The way an item looks in a scan can look very different than when you have that item in hand.

[Thor996]

well, the "powers that be" won this one apparently-

 

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=281112606227

[Adam R]

On that first photo on page one that shows the engraving, could this be a genuine medal that has had the engraving privately done? One sees private engraving on many medals. Why not this one too?

Also the copper in the medal and in the devices of the engraved letters show aging/corrosion as it has turned green. This looks like it was done many years ago.

 

No. The naming on this medal is completely wrong, regardless of any aging it shows (which can be faked). It should have impressed (stamped) naming in all capital letters, as shown in post #6 on the previous page. When the Dewey Medal was originally issued in 1899 all of them were officially named in this way. Since all of them were already named there was no need for private engraving.

 

I would strongly recommend against buying any Dewey Medal that doesn't have the proper style of naming. While there's always a very small chance that it's some sort of later replacement, the odds are much greater that it's a fake that was made to deceive collectors. If you have any doubts it's far safer to walk away from a purchase rather than risk throwing your money away.

 

[Teamski]

Thanks for this thread. I would have been suckered big time by these medals.

 

-Ski