Nkomo Posted May 1, 2013 Share #26 Posted May 1, 2013 In general, the new media-sensitive military is wary of souvenirs because sometimes the line between "souvenir" and "loot" can be pretty fine. But insurgent flags in particular they want turned in because they are important military intelligence. They may be the only physical link identifying a particular insurgent unit or it's affiliations. To Private Joe Snuffy, it's just a wierd flag he picked up, maybe he'll show it off to his friends back home. But to Military Intelligence, Pvt Snuffy's flag (reading Ordinance Co, Islamic Army of Iraq, or bearing the Seal of Muhammad as per an AQ banner) might provide an important link to another case they are working on. Perhaps they are tracking a bomb maker who they know to be associated with IAI; if this flag turns up in an unrelated raid on an insurgent compound, it means they may have their bomb maker in custody right now, or perhaps someone who knows him, and they wouldn't have even known it if it weren't for this crucial piece of evidence being handed in. So IMO that's why you won't see many in private hands. They're more along the lines of documents rather than typical military equipment, and they need to be turned over to folks who are putting the puzzles together. Great explanation! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRR Posted May 1, 2013 Share #27 Posted May 1, 2013 Yes, flags were also commonly used as back drops while they were video taping messages and executions. Being most were hand made it allows it to be identified and having that flag with a location helps build a case. Once a government was established, the insurgents were put on trial in an Iraqi court just like a criminal here. So evidence had to be collected and handled much in the way it would be in the US or the charges could be thrown out. I suspect the ones you will find will be from earlier in the war when trials and evidence were not as emphasized. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timberwolf Posted May 1, 2013 Share #28 Posted May 1, 2013 Thanks for the answers guys. Very informative! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mercenary25 Posted May 1, 2013 Share #29 Posted May 1, 2013 Here is an Al Qaeda flag that was captured in Baghdad, being displayed as evidence. Those look like Iraqi soldiers in the background, so who knows what happened to it. But they did apparently fall into coalition hands from time to time. Al-Qaeda-Flag.jpg They looks like Afghan Partner Unit (APU) due to their helmets but I may be wrong. Neat picture either ways. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedLegGI Posted May 2, 2013 Author Share #30 Posted May 2, 2013 Woman who picks up stuff and offers it to me around Campbell shot me a mail today asking what I'm looking for since there is a post-wide garage sale coming up. So I sent a nice list and then told her if she ran across any captured flags, I'd be very interested... her reply? "Oh really? My husband just burnt one. Looked like it had blood on it." *sigh* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRR Posted May 2, 2013 Share #31 Posted May 2, 2013 Woman who picks up stuff and offers it to me around Campbell shot me a mail today asking what I'm looking for since there is a post-wide garage sale coming up. So I sent a nice list and then told her if she ran across any captured flags, I'd be very interested... her reply? "Oh really? My husband just burnt one. Looked like it had blood on it." *sigh* Amazing! But comes as no surprise. I do miss living near base, it was very lucrative. There is never a lack of military collector retirees as well. I am hoping to make a trip to Bragg in the next month or so and planning to advertise hard before I go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedLegGI Posted May 2, 2013 Author Share #32 Posted May 2, 2013 Amazing! But comes as no surprise. I do miss living near base, it was very lucrative. There is never a lack of military collector retirees as well. I am hoping to make a trip to Bragg in the next month or so and planning to advertise hard before I go. I'll be down in Bragg soon as well, buddy just go back from 3rd group and I'm going to hang out end of June/July timeframe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRR Posted May 2, 2013 Share #33 Posted May 2, 2013 Yeah, I am about 4hrs from there but have to go get my blue ID and no one wants to go to Jackson Hopefully I score something to make the trip great. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedLegGI Posted May 2, 2013 Author Share #34 Posted May 2, 2013 Yeah, I am about 4hrs from there but have to go get my blue ID and no one wants to go to Jackson Hopefully I score something to make the trip great. Me too, just have to figure out if I'm going to drive myself or fly down and have my buddy pick me up. Option two would entail me trying to catch a ride to surplus stores lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRR Posted May 2, 2013 Share #35 Posted May 2, 2013 If you are within a day, I would drive and take two so you could stop along the way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedLegGI Posted May 2, 2013 Author Share #36 Posted May 2, 2013 If you are within a day, I would drive and take two so you could stop along the way. Google says its a 9 hour trip so probably 7-8 in reality Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kammo-man Posted May 2, 2013 Share #37 Posted May 2, 2013 I have seen a bunch of hand made flags from this conflict. Like hand made with glue guns and womens bright blouses ....... mad looking for last ditch units on the rampage. one way ticket to meet the big sky daddy type of stuff . I think its serious folk art that one day will be analyzed correctly by provence . owen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sabrejet Posted May 2, 2013 Share #38 Posted May 2, 2013 If I had some of these flags I would burn them, video the process and then post it on YouTube. Why? Because it's what these b******* do to ours!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedLegGI Posted May 2, 2013 Author Share #39 Posted May 2, 2013 If I had some of these flags I would burn them, video the process and then post it on YouTube. Why? Because it's what these b******* do to ours!! Are you implying you'd burn a vet bring back piece of militaria? lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pjm Posted May 2, 2013 Share #40 Posted May 2, 2013 There were a couple of flags at the SOS in Louisville but not for sale. Unfortunately, the owner could only relate what he was told the flags were. One was a hand painted Arabic script on black and attributed to Republican Guard. Seeing this thread, I get impression it probably was. I think the idea behind keeping the flags for evidence is legit. As mentioned, unlike national flags or military unit flags, those of Al Queda and other insurgent groups are important documents for intelligence gathering, tracking etc. I should follow up on the ones from SOS. The guys were at the tables right behind me. Of course, the question is "What are they worth?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRR Posted May 2, 2013 Share #41 Posted May 2, 2013 Value as of now I would suspect is going to be lower than say TR flags. Reason is the supply is low, but also the demand. I am sure most are being traded amongst dealers and a few collectors knowing their value will increase once the wars are over and the fakes start hitting the market. Myself, I would pay up to $200 for one and $300-400 if you had the bringback memo and a photo of it in country. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedLegGI Posted May 2, 2013 Author Share #42 Posted May 2, 2013 There were a couple of flags at the SOS in Louisville but not for sale. I missed those Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedLegGI Posted May 2, 2013 Author Share #43 Posted May 2, 2013 Value as of now I would suspect is going to be lower than say TR flags. Reason is the supply is low, but also the demand. I am sure most are being traded amongst dealers and a few collectors knowing their value will increase once the wars are over and the fakes start hitting the market. Myself, I would pay up to $200 for one and $300-400 if you had the bringback memo and a photo of it in country. I feel the same way about the pricing on them, but I also think you'll see them in the $50-$100 range possibly less. currently. When she told me that her husband burnt one, its a real signal that the value is not known yet. I have an Iraqi pre-2003 flag that I picked up in a surplus store. It was the only international flag there, and he buys from vets and immediately puts it on his shelves. Sadly I have no way of knowing who this came from, but a month later a set of green and tan Iraqi uniforms showed up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Scratch Posted May 2, 2013 Share #44 Posted May 2, 2013 Oops. Looks like the pic I submitted before might be the back of the flag. I'll post the front here for accuracy sake and future reference for others who come looking for an image of one of these. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Scratch Posted May 2, 2013 Share #45 Posted May 2, 2013 Detail pic of the fringe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Scratch Posted May 2, 2013 Share #46 Posted May 2, 2013 I feel the same way about the pricing on them, but I also think you'll see them in the $50-$100 range possibly less. currently. When she told me that her husband burnt one, its a real signal that the value is not known yet. For a typical Iraqi flag, maybe. There are loads of them out there. The one the lady's husband burned was probably one of these. For an insurgent flag, it's a whole different kettle of fish. However, there is no mature market for this stuff now. Like any kind of militaria in the beginning, not enough "nostalgia" time has passed, and not enough scholarly research has been done to establish meaning and rarity. In the days after WWII, you could probably pick up a camo US paratrooper helmet for peanuts, not much more than you'd spend on a regular M1. Post-war, TR stuff was traded back and forth without a care as to what it was, and it was lucky to not just end up in the trash. My father and uncles destroyed all the stuff my grandfather brought back (some of it quite incredible and valuable today), and nobody gave a damn, including my grandfather. In time, when people have an opportunity to reflect on and study the history of the Iraq war, the importance and rarity of insurgent flags and banners like this might be appreciated. But it ain't going to be today, and thus a true value can't be established. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedLegGI Posted May 2, 2013 Author Share #47 Posted May 2, 2013 In the days after WWII, you could probably pick up a camo US paratrooper helmet for peanuts This statement is what I was getting at be it standard Iraqi or insurgent flags. Right now most guys just have things they grabbed and kept which at the time had meaning, but now maybe not so much because of later deployments or whatever x reason might be. Right now its really up to the collectors to find these flags, secure them and make sure they're around in 20 years or more. We all make that statement "Oh I wish I were alive just after X ended for the surplus" well, right now is that time for us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RANDALL 1953 Posted May 7, 2013 Share #48 Posted May 7, 2013 This statement is what I was getting at be it standard Iraqi or insurgent flags. Right now most guys just have things they grabbed and kept which at the time had meaning, but now maybe not so much because of later deployments or whatever x reason might be. Right now its really up to the collectors to find these flags, secure them and make sure they're around in 20 years or more. We all make that statement "Oh I wish I were alive just after X ended for the surplus" well, right now is that time for us. Same with the Vietnam items. The collector interest was far & few back then. I remember seeing ads in the Shotgun News for all kinds of items and at very cheap prices. Tiger stripe uniforms, Berets, Patches, VC items. Some of them now if original bring in a pretty good price. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedLegGI Posted July 17, 2013 Author Share #49 Posted July 17, 2013 Anyone have any luck? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nuts Posted July 17, 2013 Share #50 Posted July 17, 2013 Flag captured in 2003 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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