usmedalman Posted March 24, 2013 Share #1 Posted March 24, 2013 I bought this USMC officer group years ago hoping to research it. The USMC China Service is numbered, 943 (which I know is not traceable) but there were a number of clues with the group that I hope would not make it impossible to trace, but I have never had the opportunity to really dig in and research it. My collecting interests are taking a different direction now, but before I put the group up for sale I was wondering what other members on this Forum think of the group. Can we speculate on if the LoM is WW2 or Korea, etc. I look forward to hearing opinions. Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KurtA Posted March 24, 2013 Share #2 Posted March 24, 2013 I would say too common a medal combo to trace. Very strange there is a UN Korea Medal, but no National Defense or US Korean Service Medal. I don't think it's a put-together, as what profit-seeking put-together artist would use a $500 #'d China Service rather than a $15 un-numbered lug suspension China Service to "create" a group? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wharfmaster Posted March 24, 2013 Share #3 Posted March 24, 2013 Because your Marine was in the service prior to Dec.7, the single battle star on the A-P was probably for Guadalcanal. Many of those men did not see another battle in WW2. Regards, W Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teamski Posted March 24, 2013 Share #4 Posted March 24, 2013 Can we see the back? -Ski Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KASTAUFFER Posted March 24, 2013 Share #5 Posted March 24, 2013 Nice bar. I can tell the LOM is a Navy contract medal too. It could be for WWII or Korea. I dont think you will be able to trace this however. Not enough clues and thousands of officers records to dig through. If somehow records turn up on the Marine China, you could get lucky. Adam Rohloff is who I would ask. Kurt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
usmedalman Posted March 24, 2013 Author Share #6 Posted March 24, 2013 Can we see the back? -Ski Here is a pic of the back. Obviously hand done by the vet, not real pretty, but cool. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aerialbridge Posted March 24, 2013 Share #7 Posted March 24, 2013 Here is a pic of the back. Obviously hand done by the vet, not real pretty, but cool. Very neat group, thanks for posting. I like how he was short of ribbon for his China Service and spliced a piece in! P.S.-- I'd second the suggestion to consider retaining Adam to try to track down your recipient if you really want to ID it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigJohn#3RD Posted March 24, 2013 Share #8 Posted March 24, 2013 usmedalman, Great medal group but I have to agree that it is a needle in the hay stack kind of search but being an officer grouping (no good conduct medal) it does neck down the possibilities but not by very much. Did the group come from an area near you or can you get more information on where it came from Antique Store, Estate Auction, yard sale, etc? That may help as well. It is a nice representative group for a Marine Officer who was in the Corp from the 30s thru 50's. Regards, John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kadet Posted March 24, 2013 Share #9 Posted March 24, 2013 The Lom with a combat v is your best clue. This would have been awarded to a senior officer...probably an 06, either for service in WWII or Korea Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirk Posted March 24, 2013 Share #10 Posted March 24, 2013 Also with a star in the China ribbon would have been over in 37 and again post war....maybe with the first or sixth divisions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kadet Posted March 24, 2013 Share #11 Posted March 24, 2013 So, this man was potentially a career Marine officer that would have entered service in the early 20s, and retired in between late 1950 and 1953 because there is no NDSM. He was probably a Colonel, because a General officer was likely to have received a DSM. He would have served in China before the war, then potentially as a Colonel in combat during WWII, where he was wounded. He also had post war service in China. I believe it was possible to receive the UN medal for Korea by serving in support of combat operations elsewhere, perhaps in Japan (not sure on this). First MARDIV perhaps? According to Blakeney, there were approx 550 USMC LOM recipients in WWII. Deleting the aviators would shorten the list. refining it to to PH recipients would make it even smaller, as would the years of service. Also, what makes this definitively a USMC group? it could be Navy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DakotaDave Posted March 24, 2013 Share #12 Posted March 24, 2013 Also, what makes this definitively a USMC group? it could be Navy The China Service medal is a Marine Corps issue per the reverse. DakotaDave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
USMCR79 Posted March 24, 2013 Share #13 Posted March 24, 2013 Regarding the China Service Medal - The Marines would issue their version of the campaign medals to Navy Doctors, Dentists, Chaplains, and Corpsman assigned to Marine Units - So, this could be to a Navy Officer. Bill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kadet Posted March 24, 2013 Share #14 Posted March 24, 2013 Yes, sorry...He said that in the first post and I missed it. As a point of departure, I would look for senior Marine officers wounded on Guadalcanal. Some of the USMC division histories list PH recipients if I remember correctly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
firefighter Posted March 25, 2013 Share #15 Posted March 25, 2013 I too thought the U.N. Service medal without the Korean Service medal was strange.Also the STAR is un-authorized for that medal. The ultimate award authority of the United Nations Service Medal is United Nations Commander-in-Chief of military forces in Korea.[1] United Nations Medal for Korea The United Nations Korea Medal is awarded to those members who were posted for any period with the United Nations (UN) forces in Korea between 27 June 1950 and 27 July 1954, both dates inclusive. The medal is also awarded to personnel who served in adjacent areas like Japan and Okinawa operating under UN command or sent to support UN operations in Korea in the relevant period from 1950 to 1954. Official visitors require 30 days, continuous or aggregate to qualify. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kadet Posted March 25, 2013 Share #16 Posted March 25, 2013 To me, this means he served in Japan or Okinawa during the KW, but never actually went to Korea....hence no service medal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wolfman Posted March 25, 2013 Share #17 Posted March 25, 2013 It is also possible he choose not to add the NDSM and KWSM. As for the star on the UN medal maybe its along the same lines as the stars often seen on WW2 VIC's ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brig Posted March 25, 2013 Share #18 Posted March 25, 2013 I'm inclined to agree with Kurt about the China medal, mounted medals tend to fetch a decent amount less than unmounted. I bought a WWII mounted set of Marines Medals with a Bronze Star that can attest to that, everyone wants the broach Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wharfmaster Posted March 25, 2013 Share #19 Posted March 25, 2013 Not unusual for Sailors and Marines to wear only one Korean service medal, rather than the usual 3. With a battle star on his UN Korea, he no doubt qualified for the US Korea and Nat. Def. too. W Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0811gysgt Posted March 25, 2013 Share #20 Posted March 25, 2013 Is it possible that this Officer was captured in China at the beginning of the War and was also re-patrioted in China after the wars end? That may explain two awards for the China Service Medal, a Purple Heart, and even the LOM. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wharfmaster Posted March 25, 2013 Share #21 Posted March 25, 2013 Is it possible that this Officer was captured in China at the beginning of the War and was also re-patrioted in China after the wars end? That may explain two awards for the China Service Medal, a Purple Heart, and even the LOM. His American Defense Medal does not have a Fleet or Base Bar, so he was probably in the States when the War broke out. W Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KASTAUFFER Posted March 25, 2013 Share #22 Posted March 25, 2013 The Purple Heart appears to be an Army contract medal. Not unusual though. Kurt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam R Posted March 25, 2013 Share #23 Posted March 25, 2013 Nice bar. I can tell the LOM is a Navy contract medal too. It could be for WWII or Korea. I dont think you will be able to trace this however. Not enough clues and thousands of officers records to dig through. If somehow records turn up on the Marine China, you could get lucky. Adam Rohloff is who I would ask. Kurt Sorry, I don't know of a good way to ID the recipient short of reviewing dozens of personnel files in St. Louis. It could possibly be done but would take many days or weeks of work. It's a shame that there's no known recipient roster for the China Service Medal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
teufelhunde.ret Posted March 25, 2013 Share #24 Posted March 25, 2013 I would say too common a medal combo to trace. Very strange there is a UN Korea Medal, but no National Defense or US Korean Service Medal. I don't think it's a put-together, as what profit-seeking put-together artist would use a $500 #'d China Service rather than a $15 un-numbered lug suspension China Service to "create" a group? Quite agree, sadly we may never know whom this belonged to... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Nier Posted March 25, 2013 Share #25 Posted March 25, 2013 This group might well be researched via its LOM award. Assuming it's a WW2 LOM award, take Blakeney's list of about 550 recipients. Subtract the recipients who received multiple LOMs and/or other decorations listed there. Subtract the recipients that were deceased or MIA by 1945, and the aviators as suggested above. Subtract those who had no pre-WW2 service, and no Korean War service. You might end up with a much smaller list with which to search the Archives. Adam & Kurt, what do you think of this approach?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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