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auggie

WWII AAF question

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My father died in 1961.

He and my mother were seperated in 1959 when I was 5 so I don't know much about him.

During WWII he was a corporal in the AAF.

My late grandfather left me my father's crewman's wings.

I would like to make a shadow box with his wings and purchase the appropriate rank insignia.

In all likelyhood which insignia (see below) would my father have worn on his uniform?

His headstone reads : 463 Base Unit AAF - World War II

Any info is mch appreciated

Thanks

Auggie

 

 

Chevron%20Enlisted%20AAF%20White%20Cpl-b.jpgChevron%20Enlisted%20WW2%20White%20Smooth%20Cpl.gif

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Hi Auggie,

 

He could in theory have worn either,but the lower one is the more common so would probably be more representative.

 

Have you requested your fathers service records?.

 

Regards,

 

Matt.


Collecting WWII and pre-war Air Corps items-Unit Histories,Uniforms,Medals and Groupings.

*Seeking Pre-WWII Air Corps Officers and Enlisted Dress Uniform items!*

donation2012.gifdonation2013.gif

 

 

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Matt,

Thank you for your reply.

Hope all is well in Wales.

My grandfather's ancestors are from Wales thus it is quite a coincidence that you replied.

Be well.

Auggie

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Glad to help!. Which part of Wales were your grandfather's ancestors from?.

 

Matt.


Collecting WWII and pre-war Air Corps items-Unit Histories,Uniforms,Medals and Groupings.

*Seeking Pre-WWII Air Corps Officers and Enlisted Dress Uniform items!*

donation2012.gifdonation2013.gif

 

 

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Wales calling again! Do you know which theatre your dad served in? This would determine the ribbons he was entitled to and the patch he wore. There would be generic ribbons common to every GI such as WW2 Victory and Good Conduct, added to which would be their theatre/campaign ribbon, plus any ribbons for valor or wounds etc., as necessary. If you don't know which numbered Air Force he was attached to then the generic AAF patch would suffice, as below.

post-8022-0-05435300-1354969544.jpg


"We shall defend our island, whatever the cost may be. We shall fight on the beaches, we shall fight on the landing grounds, we shall fight in the fields and in the streets, we shall fight in the hills; we shall never surrender!"

 

Winston Churchill

" Life is what happens to you when you're busy making other plans."

John Winston Lennon

 

 

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Some Base Units did, I believe, have patches/insignia of some kind but for the life of me cannot recall. Something in my memory says that Base Units are not easy to find information about either, for some reason, but that they were essentially training organizations.

 

I never put a study to those units myself as yet, but USMF member "Wailuna" may be able to give you some guidance or direction to do more searching about Base Units or specifically your Dad's 463rd Air Base Unit (Base Unit).


HONORING FAMILY LtCol Wm Russell (1679-1757) VA Mil; Pvt Zachariah McKay (1714-97) Frederick VA Mil; BrigGen Evan Shelby, Jr (1719-94) VA Mil; Pvt Vincent Hobbs (1722-1808) Wythe VA Mil; Pvt Hugh Alexander (1724-77); Lt John R. Litton (1726-1804); Bvt BrigGen/Col Wm W. Russell (1735-93) 5th VA Rgmt; Lt James Scott (1736-1817); Capt John Murray, Sr (1747-1833); Capt John Sehorn, Sr (1748-1831) VA Mil; Pvt Corbin Lane (1750-1816) Franklin/TN Mil; Cpl Jesse D. Reynolds (1750-1836) 5th VA Rgmt; Capt. Solomon C. Litton (1751-1844); 1Lt Christopher Casey (1754-1840) SC Mil; Pvt Mark Adams (1755-1828); Pvt Randolph White (1755-1831) Bailey's Co. VA Rgmt; Capt. John R. Russell (1758-1838); Pvt Joseph T. Cooley (1767-1826) Fort Hempstead Mil; Pvt Thomas Barron (1776-1863) 1812; Capt. John Baumgardner (1787-1853) VA Mil; Pvt Joel Estep (1828-1864) Co B 5th KY Inf CSA & US; Pvt George B. Bell (1833-1910) Co C 47th IL Inf US; Cpl Daniel H. Barron (1838-1910) Co B 19th TN Rgmt Inf CSA; Capt Richard K. Kaufman (1908-1946) 7th PRG/3rd AF CCU; T-5 Vernon L. Bell (1926-95) 1802nd Spec Rgmt; PO2 Murray J. Heichman (1932-2019) HQSB/MCRD; PFC Jess Long (1934-2017) US Army; PFC Donald W. Johnson (1931-) 43rd ID HQ; A1C Keith W. Bell (1931-2011) 314th TCW; A3C Michael S. Bell (1946-) 3346th CMS; A1C Sam W. Lee (1954-2017) 2d BW; AW3 Keith J. Price (1975-) VP-10; 1Lt Matthew Wm Bell (1985-) 82nd Abn/SOC








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Bluehawk,

Thanks for that info and for taking the time to respond.

I will message "Wailuna" as you suggested.

Mike

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Matt,

Thanks again for your responses.

You mentioned obtaining my father's military records.

How do I go about that process.

Mike

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Matt,

Thanks again for your responses.

You mentioned obtaining my father's military records.

How do I go about that process.

Mike

If I may interpose on this question, though there are many who could reply.

 

His military records are by far the best way of getting specifics of all kinds.

 

You go to this site:

http://www.archives.gov/veterans/military-service-records/

 

There you begin the process. It is extremely helpful to be accurate about the exact spelling of his first, middle and last name, his place and date of birth and death, and to have either his Social Security or Service number. Most people think they know those details, but often there are mistakes which will throw a researcher off - given the millions and millions of records there are.

 

There is a high probability that you will receive back a notice that "due to a fire at the archives" many records were lost. That is true, but there are many duplicates and other repositories - so, you must put in additional requests.

 

It may cost you some money; my search for my father cost $60 and was worth every penny. If you can afford it, there are (even here on USMF) professionals who will do this search very thoroughly for you. It won't be all that expensive, but is likely to cost more than free or $60.

 

Something to remember is that if you ask for "My father's military records", then you are not likely to get a full report, and in some cases the DD214 will not be readily available or might even contain errors.


HONORING FAMILY LtCol Wm Russell (1679-1757) VA Mil; Pvt Zachariah McKay (1714-97) Frederick VA Mil; BrigGen Evan Shelby, Jr (1719-94) VA Mil; Pvt Vincent Hobbs (1722-1808) Wythe VA Mil; Pvt Hugh Alexander (1724-77); Lt John R. Litton (1726-1804); Bvt BrigGen/Col Wm W. Russell (1735-93) 5th VA Rgmt; Lt James Scott (1736-1817); Capt John Murray, Sr (1747-1833); Capt John Sehorn, Sr (1748-1831) VA Mil; Pvt Corbin Lane (1750-1816) Franklin/TN Mil; Cpl Jesse D. Reynolds (1750-1836) 5th VA Rgmt; Capt. Solomon C. Litton (1751-1844); 1Lt Christopher Casey (1754-1840) SC Mil; Pvt Mark Adams (1755-1828); Pvt Randolph White (1755-1831) Bailey's Co. VA Rgmt; Capt. John R. Russell (1758-1838); Pvt Joseph T. Cooley (1767-1826) Fort Hempstead Mil; Pvt Thomas Barron (1776-1863) 1812; Capt. John Baumgardner (1787-1853) VA Mil; Pvt Joel Estep (1828-1864) Co B 5th KY Inf CSA & US; Pvt George B. Bell (1833-1910) Co C 47th IL Inf US; Cpl Daniel H. Barron (1838-1910) Co B 19th TN Rgmt Inf CSA; Capt Richard K. Kaufman (1908-1946) 7th PRG/3rd AF CCU; T-5 Vernon L. Bell (1926-95) 1802nd Spec Rgmt; PO2 Murray J. Heichman (1932-2019) HQSB/MCRD; PFC Jess Long (1934-2017) US Army; PFC Donald W. Johnson (1931-) 43rd ID HQ; A1C Keith W. Bell (1931-2011) 314th TCW; A3C Michael S. Bell (1946-) 3346th CMS; A1C Sam W. Lee (1954-2017) 2d BW; AW3 Keith J. Price (1975-) VP-10; 1Lt Matthew Wm Bell (1985-) 82nd Abn/SOC








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Bluehawk,

Thanks I submitted an application on line today requesting his records.

I just have to FAX a signature form.

Auggie

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Bluehawk,

Thanks I submitted an application on line today requesting his records.

I just have to FAX a signature form.

Auggie

Hang in there, Auggie. Stick with it.

 

Trust me. You will discover more than you ever imagined possible, plus maybe few surprises, about your Dad.

 

One day you will receive a big envelope of stuff, and probably a notice that medals due to him are on their way.

 

Be patient.


HONORING FAMILY LtCol Wm Russell (1679-1757) VA Mil; Pvt Zachariah McKay (1714-97) Frederick VA Mil; BrigGen Evan Shelby, Jr (1719-94) VA Mil; Pvt Vincent Hobbs (1722-1808) Wythe VA Mil; Pvt Hugh Alexander (1724-77); Lt John R. Litton (1726-1804); Bvt BrigGen/Col Wm W. Russell (1735-93) 5th VA Rgmt; Lt James Scott (1736-1817); Capt John Murray, Sr (1747-1833); Capt John Sehorn, Sr (1748-1831) VA Mil; Pvt Corbin Lane (1750-1816) Franklin/TN Mil; Cpl Jesse D. Reynolds (1750-1836) 5th VA Rgmt; Capt. Solomon C. Litton (1751-1844); 1Lt Christopher Casey (1754-1840) SC Mil; Pvt Mark Adams (1755-1828); Pvt Randolph White (1755-1831) Bailey's Co. VA Rgmt; Capt. John R. Russell (1758-1838); Pvt Joseph T. Cooley (1767-1826) Fort Hempstead Mil; Pvt Thomas Barron (1776-1863) 1812; Capt. John Baumgardner (1787-1853) VA Mil; Pvt Joel Estep (1828-1864) Co B 5th KY Inf CSA & US; Pvt George B. Bell (1833-1910) Co C 47th IL Inf US; Cpl Daniel H. Barron (1838-1910) Co B 19th TN Rgmt Inf CSA; Capt Richard K. Kaufman (1908-1946) 7th PRG/3rd AF CCU; T-5 Vernon L. Bell (1926-95) 1802nd Spec Rgmt; PO2 Murray J. Heichman (1932-2019) HQSB/MCRD; PFC Jess Long (1934-2017) US Army; PFC Donald W. Johnson (1931-) 43rd ID HQ; A1C Keith W. Bell (1931-2011) 314th TCW; A3C Michael S. Bell (1946-) 3346th CMS; A1C Sam W. Lee (1954-2017) 2d BW; AW3 Keith J. Price (1975-) VP-10; 1Lt Matthew Wm Bell (1985-) 82nd Abn/SOC








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Bluehawk,

Thanks.

That is something to look forward to.

I will let you know what I find out.

Auggie

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Bluehawk,

Thanks.

That is something to look forward to.

I will let you know what I find out.

Auggie

And, we all will want to see that final shadow box too!

 

Many here will be happy to help you obtain whatever is needed to complete it, as accurately as you deem necessary.

 

Good going, and Godspeed.


HONORING FAMILY LtCol Wm Russell (1679-1757) VA Mil; Pvt Zachariah McKay (1714-97) Frederick VA Mil; BrigGen Evan Shelby, Jr (1719-94) VA Mil; Pvt Vincent Hobbs (1722-1808) Wythe VA Mil; Pvt Hugh Alexander (1724-77); Lt John R. Litton (1726-1804); Bvt BrigGen/Col Wm W. Russell (1735-93) 5th VA Rgmt; Lt James Scott (1736-1817); Capt John Murray, Sr (1747-1833); Capt John Sehorn, Sr (1748-1831) VA Mil; Pvt Corbin Lane (1750-1816) Franklin/TN Mil; Cpl Jesse D. Reynolds (1750-1836) 5th VA Rgmt; Capt. Solomon C. Litton (1751-1844); 1Lt Christopher Casey (1754-1840) SC Mil; Pvt Mark Adams (1755-1828); Pvt Randolph White (1755-1831) Bailey's Co. VA Rgmt; Capt. John R. Russell (1758-1838); Pvt Joseph T. Cooley (1767-1826) Fort Hempstead Mil; Pvt Thomas Barron (1776-1863) 1812; Capt. John Baumgardner (1787-1853) VA Mil; Pvt Joel Estep (1828-1864) Co B 5th KY Inf CSA & US; Pvt George B. Bell (1833-1910) Co C 47th IL Inf US; Cpl Daniel H. Barron (1838-1910) Co B 19th TN Rgmt Inf CSA; Capt Richard K. Kaufman (1908-1946) 7th PRG/3rd AF CCU; T-5 Vernon L. Bell (1926-95) 1802nd Spec Rgmt; PO2 Murray J. Heichman (1932-2019) HQSB/MCRD; PFC Jess Long (1934-2017) US Army; PFC Donald W. Johnson (1931-) 43rd ID HQ; A1C Keith W. Bell (1931-2011) 314th TCW; A3C Michael S. Bell (1946-) 3346th CMS; A1C Sam W. Lee (1954-2017) 2d BW; AW3 Keith J. Price (1975-) VP-10; 1Lt Matthew Wm Bell (1985-) 82nd Abn/SOC








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Matt,

Thanks again for your responses.

You mentioned obtaining my father's military records.

How do I go about that process.

Mike

Hi Mike,

 

Bluehawk has given you a comprehensive answer,I will just add that if you decide to hire a researcher I have found Geoff at Golden Arrow to be a great guy to work with http://www.goldenarrowresearch.com/

 

If you haven't already seen it there is some info on the 463rd AF Base Unit here http://forum.armyairforces.com/463rd-AAF-BU-Geiger-Field-Wash-m168708.aspx

 

Matt.


Collecting WWII and pre-war Air Corps items-Unit Histories,Uniforms,Medals and Groupings.

*Seeking Pre-WWII Air Corps Officers and Enlisted Dress Uniform items!*

donation2012.gifdonation2013.gif

 

 

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Matt's link indicates that your father's unit came under the Fourth Air Force, which was CONUS based. The patch is illustrated below. A typical USAAF EM's medal bar "trio" would therefore comprise, l to r, of Good Conduct...American Campaign...WW2 Victory.

post-8022-0-13730800-1354986935.jpg


"We shall defend our island, whatever the cost may be. We shall fight on the beaches, we shall fight on the landing grounds, we shall fight in the fields and in the streets, we shall fight in the hills; we shall never surrender!"

 

Winston Churchill

" Life is what happens to you when you're busy making other plans."

John Winston Lennon

 

 

donation2010.gif

donation2011.gifdonation2012.gifdonation2013.gif

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Ian, might his Dad have qualified for a shooting badge of some sort?

 

Then, too, a duck at least?

 

Wondering also about his branch of service or possible DUI?


HONORING FAMILY LtCol Wm Russell (1679-1757) VA Mil; Pvt Zachariah McKay (1714-97) Frederick VA Mil; BrigGen Evan Shelby, Jr (1719-94) VA Mil; Pvt Vincent Hobbs (1722-1808) Wythe VA Mil; Pvt Hugh Alexander (1724-77); Lt John R. Litton (1726-1804); Bvt BrigGen/Col Wm W. Russell (1735-93) 5th VA Rgmt; Lt James Scott (1736-1817); Capt John Murray, Sr (1747-1833); Capt John Sehorn, Sr (1748-1831) VA Mil; Pvt Corbin Lane (1750-1816) Franklin/TN Mil; Cpl Jesse D. Reynolds (1750-1836) 5th VA Rgmt; Capt. Solomon C. Litton (1751-1844); 1Lt Christopher Casey (1754-1840) SC Mil; Pvt Mark Adams (1755-1828); Pvt Randolph White (1755-1831) Bailey's Co. VA Rgmt; Capt. John R. Russell (1758-1838); Pvt Joseph T. Cooley (1767-1826) Fort Hempstead Mil; Pvt Thomas Barron (1776-1863) 1812; Capt. John Baumgardner (1787-1853) VA Mil; Pvt Joel Estep (1828-1864) Co B 5th KY Inf CSA & US; Pvt George B. Bell (1833-1910) Co C 47th IL Inf US; Cpl Daniel H. Barron (1838-1910) Co B 19th TN Rgmt Inf CSA; Capt Richard K. Kaufman (1908-1946) 7th PRG/3rd AF CCU; T-5 Vernon L. Bell (1926-95) 1802nd Spec Rgmt; PO2 Murray J. Heichman (1932-2019) HQSB/MCRD; PFC Jess Long (1934-2017) US Army; PFC Donald W. Johnson (1931-) 43rd ID HQ; A1C Keith W. Bell (1931-2011) 314th TCW; A3C Michael S. Bell (1946-) 3346th CMS; A1C Sam W. Lee (1954-2017) 2d BW; AW3 Keith J. Price (1975-) VP-10; 1Lt Matthew Wm Bell (1985-) 82nd Abn/SOC








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Sabrejet,

Thank you.

I appreciate very much seeing that patch and learning of the medal bar trio.

Auggie

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Yes indeed Mike...all of the "hidden extras" which Auggie won't know about until, hopefully, he obtains his father's records. Until then we can only hypothesize!


"We shall defend our island, whatever the cost may be. We shall fight on the beaches, we shall fight on the landing grounds, we shall fight in the fields and in the streets, we shall fight in the hills; we shall never surrender!"

 

Winston Churchill

" Life is what happens to you when you're busy making other plans."

John Winston Lennon

 

 

donation2010.gif

donation2011.gifdonation2012.gifdonation2013.gif

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Sabrejet,

Thank you.

I appreciate very much seeing that patch and learning of the medal bar trio.

Auggie

 

You're welcome! Fortunately, all of the ribbons/insignia we've discussed thus far are quite inexpensive and quite readily available...even original WW2 examples. Check the various "For Sale" categories on this forum, or alternatively, when you know what you want or need, just post a "Wants" ad. I'm sure you'll be pleasantly surprised at the responses. Good luck with your quest!


"We shall defend our island, whatever the cost may be. We shall fight on the beaches, we shall fight on the landing grounds, we shall fight in the fields and in the streets, we shall fight in the hills; we shall never surrender!"

 

Winston Churchill

" Life is what happens to you when you're busy making other plans."

John Winston Lennon

 

 

donation2010.gif

donation2011.gifdonation2012.gifdonation2013.gif

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You're welcome! Fortunately, all of the ribbons/insignia we've discussed thus far are quite inexpensive and quite readily available...even original WW2 examples. Check the various "For Sale" categories on this forum, or alternatively, when you know what you want or need, just post a "Wants" ad. I'm sure you'll be pleasantly surprised at the responses. Good luck with your quest!

As Ian says, Auggie, all the fruit salad is readily available.

 

Based on some experience, allow me to suggest that you take the time and allocate the funds to get period artifacts, i.e. jangley stuff that is old and exactly appropriate to your Dad's service tenure for that shadow box.

 

It will mean more historically to your family, to do so. There are plenty of cheap repros, but...

 

It takes more time and money to obtain the McCoy, yes.

 

You might find a couple or few things harder to get. So, just wait and be persistent.


HONORING FAMILY LtCol Wm Russell (1679-1757) VA Mil; Pvt Zachariah McKay (1714-97) Frederick VA Mil; BrigGen Evan Shelby, Jr (1719-94) VA Mil; Pvt Vincent Hobbs (1722-1808) Wythe VA Mil; Pvt Hugh Alexander (1724-77); Lt John R. Litton (1726-1804); Bvt BrigGen/Col Wm W. Russell (1735-93) 5th VA Rgmt; Lt James Scott (1736-1817); Capt John Murray, Sr (1747-1833); Capt John Sehorn, Sr (1748-1831) VA Mil; Pvt Corbin Lane (1750-1816) Franklin/TN Mil; Cpl Jesse D. Reynolds (1750-1836) 5th VA Rgmt; Capt. Solomon C. Litton (1751-1844); 1Lt Christopher Casey (1754-1840) SC Mil; Pvt Mark Adams (1755-1828); Pvt Randolph White (1755-1831) Bailey's Co. VA Rgmt; Capt. John R. Russell (1758-1838); Pvt Joseph T. Cooley (1767-1826) Fort Hempstead Mil; Pvt Thomas Barron (1776-1863) 1812; Capt. John Baumgardner (1787-1853) VA Mil; Pvt Joel Estep (1828-1864) Co B 5th KY Inf CSA & US; Pvt George B. Bell (1833-1910) Co C 47th IL Inf US; Cpl Daniel H. Barron (1838-1910) Co B 19th TN Rgmt Inf CSA; Capt Richard K. Kaufman (1908-1946) 7th PRG/3rd AF CCU; T-5 Vernon L. Bell (1926-95) 1802nd Spec Rgmt; PO2 Murray J. Heichman (1932-2019) HQSB/MCRD; PFC Jess Long (1934-2017) US Army; PFC Donald W. Johnson (1931-) 43rd ID HQ; A1C Keith W. Bell (1931-2011) 314th TCW; A3C Michael S. Bell (1946-) 3346th CMS; A1C Sam W. Lee (1954-2017) 2d BW; AW3 Keith J. Price (1975-) VP-10; 1Lt Matthew Wm Bell (1985-) 82nd Abn/SOC








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Sounds like great advice all-around and I do appreciate the time and interest you gentlemen have shown.

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I have been doing more research on the service of my family members.

Found my uncle on the list of Silver Star recipients.Sexton, Floyd L. HQ, 44th Infantry Division, G.O. No. 132 (1945)

I remember hearing family members whisper stories when I was a kid.

Anyone have any info about the 44th infantry division?

Thanks

Auggie

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