gwb123 Posted February 16, 2008 Share #1 Posted February 16, 2008 There is another ongoing thread about Airborne jackets and trousers. It made me go back and pull these from my archives. There were enough I though they deserved their own thread. These showed up in a photo album that was on a dealer's table at a Dallas, TX militaria show in the mid-1990's. A number of photos had already been removed and the vendor was selling them photo by photo. It was a crime to break all that up, but it would have cost far too much to bring home the whole book. I passed these on to another collector years ago, but I have always thought they were fascinating. For one thing, a number of the Airborne uniforms look to have been field camouflaged! At first I thought it was just shadows on the photos, but a closer look shows they have all been spray painted. There is also a distinct lack of unit insignia. Most of the troops are wearing US flags on their left shoulder. The one and only division patch is a 101st showing on the dress uniform in one of the later photos. The soldiers, while looking like they have been in recent combat, all look relaxed. I am willing to bet these were taken after the surrender of Germany. The location is somewhere in Europe. To my eye it looks like either Southern Germany, as in Bavaria, or the Austrian border. I'd of given anything for a sign in the background. There are way too many details to list out, such as two of them men appear to be in front of a medic station complete with jeep and red cross flag. I'll let the WWII buffs dig in and have some fun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gwb123 Posted February 16, 2008 Author Share #2 Posted February 16, 2008 Another... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gwb123 Posted February 16, 2008 Author Share #3 Posted February 16, 2008 This is the only photo I found with clear vehicle markings... anybody have an ID on this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gwb123 Posted February 16, 2008 Author Share #4 Posted February 16, 2008 Looks to be a couple of officers... check out the mountains in the background. Alpine region? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gwb123 Posted February 16, 2008 Author Share #5 Posted February 16, 2008 Village scene... locals look friendly so one might assume the war is over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gwb123 Posted February 17, 2008 Author Share #6 Posted February 17, 2008 Looks like a pose for a uniform reference book! Again, a complete lack of insignia. Note high mountains in the background. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gwb123 Posted February 17, 2008 Author Share #7 Posted February 17, 2008 Looks like a standard field jacket and a very well worn cap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gwb123 Posted February 17, 2008 Author Share #8 Posted February 17, 2008 This one was interesting. The white mark on the middle of the .50 cal is a skull and cross bones! I'd suspect this was a "hero" shot for the folks back home. Even with peace in the air, the machine gun still has a belt of rounds ready to go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gwb123 Posted February 17, 2008 Author Share #9 Posted February 17, 2008 Communications section. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gwb123 Posted February 17, 2008 Author Share #10 Posted February 17, 2008 Looks to be an aid station in the background. Note shoulder holster and .45. Perhaps this was one of the medics? Also notice the jeep in the background with red cross flag, and the chin cup hanging loose off his helmet. And what could he possibly have in that cargo pocket on the side of his leg? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gwb123 Posted February 17, 2008 Author Share #11 Posted February 17, 2008 Another from the aid station. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gwb123 Posted February 17, 2008 Author Share #12 Posted February 17, 2008 A couple nice views of the self camouflaged uniforms. The second photo could be a trooper on street patrol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gwb123 Posted February 17, 2008 Author Share #13 Posted February 17, 2008 Sight seeing soldier with flight jacket and camera. Second photo shows soldier in dress uniform. Quite possibly packing up to go home? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gwb123 Posted February 17, 2008 Author Share #14 Posted February 17, 2008 And last, but not least, to the Victors go the spoils! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
camopara Posted February 17, 2008 Share #15 Posted February 17, 2008 I don't think those are 101, but could be 82nd. The bumper number starts with a 5A which would indicate 5th Army. They could have been in Italy. It's great to see period pics of camo jump suits in wear! Very cool! I wonder if anyone here has any camo jumpsuites in their collections? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doyler Posted February 17, 2008 Share #16 Posted February 17, 2008 I agree with Leif.Most likely Italy.Good possibility they are 509th or 82nd.Both were under 5th Army in Italy if I remember correctly.With the bulk of the photos being paratroopers in the M42 jump suits I would guess this to be prior to September of 1944.You will see the 42 suits in use for Southern France but after that the bulk was the the M43 jacket and modified trousers.The one shot of the helmet almost appears to have the gas sensitve camo paint applied.The guy behind the .50 cal is wearing buckle boots and there are some great uniform shots over all.Thanks for posting. I agree its a shame the album got pieced out.I ran into a similiar deal a few years ago.A dealer had 9 full albums(I guessed over 3500 pics) of 9th Army Air Force pics.Was a great collection.Lots of nose art,planes,leather jackets,flight gear,battle damage and more.Would have cost $900 to buy all the albums.Proably not a bad buy,high for the time but I passed as he had already sold off about a hundred pictures. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr-X Posted February 17, 2008 Share #17 Posted February 17, 2008 IMHO I would say that they are 509th.(They could even be 517th) I wouldn't worry too much about the Vehicle. They get "borrowed" or even lent. The cammo uniforms and flags etc were very widely seen in the 1ABTF in southern France. I would date these pics to some time after on the way to Germany if not in Germany. I would discount 505th or 504th as they were in Northern Europe by the time of Operation Dragoon. The 101st Trooper may be a snap shot from a friend or a transfer or anything. Just some casual observations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr-X Posted February 17, 2008 Share #18 Posted February 17, 2008 oh BTW thanks very much Gil for posting them Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeeper704 Posted February 17, 2008 Share #19 Posted February 17, 2008 The markings are: 5th Army - 2nd Field Artillery Observation Battalion. Truck is named Blackjack. I agree with the rest as the troopers being either 82nd or a separate Parachute Infantry Regiment/Battalion in Italy. Great photos! Erwin This is the only photo I found with clear vehicle markings... anybody have an ID on this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrei Posted February 17, 2008 Share #20 Posted February 17, 2008 Waow Gil ! For a Vietnam collector you have displayed one of the best selection of USWW2 Abn pictures ! Thank you Sir ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gwb123 Posted February 17, 2008 Author Share #21 Posted February 17, 2008 Thanks to everyone for the comments! I really wish there had been more information with the album. I think the best clues here are those large US flags on the left shoulders. The key question to ask might be when and where they would have been worn. As far as the vehicle, it could very well have been "obtained" from another unit. The 101st photo, while included in the same album, may very well have been a "buddy" shot or a relative. Or the owner of the album may have transferred there later or after the war. It's unfortunate that we don't have a better context in which to place these. But I always thought the added camouflage was fascinating. NOTE to Andrei: Once upon a time, I thought I was going to collect everything, WWII included! These were lucky pick up that were just too good to pass up at the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baker502 Posted February 17, 2008 Share #22 Posted February 17, 2008 I would say 509er or 517th, could be 551st. As for the 101st photo after Battle of the Bulge most of the 509'er were folded into the 101st. So I would lean that way. Paul Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie Flick Posted February 17, 2008 Share #23 Posted February 17, 2008 Gil: Excellent pics. Thanks for sharing them with the rest of us. The pic of the guy in the flight jacket and camera is of interest to me. The holster he is wearing on his right hip looks a lot like the flapped holsters used primarily by the Navy and Marines for the .38 Special S&W Victory Model revolvers. The only time I have seen this holster in a period pic in use by the Army was with the 1st Cavalry in the PTO. If that is indeed a Victory holster its use in the ETO by a soldier would be highly unusual. It is sitting low enough to appear that it is attached with a M1910 double hook to the pistol belt. My initial impression was that it was simply a captured German holster. Late war pics often show German holsters carried by GIs. It may be a German holster but I am leaning towards the unlikely in this instance, ie, that it is a Victory holster. If the original shows any better details perhaps you could fill us in. (Maybe a mag pouch sewn on the holster might help ID it as German, but I can not detect that on my screen.) Thanks again. Charlie Flick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salvage Sailor Posted February 17, 2008 Share #24 Posted February 17, 2008 At first glance, I also thought the holster was German. Now that I look more closely at it, it's a dead ringer for the British .455 holster I have for my Colt New Service. This type of holster was also used for the Colt .45 revolver. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doyler Posted February 17, 2008 Share #25 Posted February 17, 2008 Thanks to everyone for the comments! I really wish there had been more information with the album. I think the best clues here are those large US flags on the left shoulders. The key question to ask might be when and where they would have been worn. As far as the vehicle, it could very well have been "obtained" from another unit. The 101st photo, while included in the same album, may very well have been a "buddy" shot or a relative. Or the owner of the album may have transferred there later or after the war. It's unfortunate that we don't have a better context in which to place these. But I always thought the added camouflage was fascinating. NOTE to Andrei: Once upon a time, I thought I was going to collect everything, WWII included! These were lucky pick up that were just too good to pass up at the time. In my obsevations of the arm flags you tend to see the flag on the left sleeve earlier in the war.I dont know if it was standardized by the Normandy invasion to wear on the right opposed to the left.Pictures from Operation Torch and ones from Sicily and Italy show the flag more on the left than right.Would like to hear other members thoughts on the flags. The camoed suits are also a good clue.Not to many units did this as a whole or on a wide basis.Pathfinders come to mind but also you can see some of this done for the Southern France Operation Dragoon 509th-551st-517th??The mystery continues Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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