Women Marines 65th Anniversary

[Bob Hudson]

It's the 65th anniversary of the Marine Corps Women's Reserves.

 

From the Oceanside, California NORTH COUNTY TIMES newspaper:

 

CAMP PENDLETON ---- There weren't very many female Marines when Oceanside's Ellie Judge signed up in 1949.

 

There also weren't a lot by the time she left the Marine Corps in 1980, capping her career by serving as the first female sergeant major at Camp Pendleton.

 

On Saturday, about 200 current and former female Marines will gather at Camp Pendleton to celebrate the 65th anniversary of the United States Marine Corps Women's Reserves.

 

Read the full story here:

 

http://www.nctimes.com/articles/2008/02/09...38_002_7_08.txt

 

[NOTE: This newspaper changes the URL of stories after a couple of days, so I've changed the link but the photos are no longer in the story]

 

The story has a couple of interesting photos including one of some WWI women Marines and this one of one local resident:

 

[Brig]

what is that article talking about, women in Infantry? I sure didn't see any for months on end over there

[Bob Hudson]

what is that article talking about, women in Infantry? I sure didn't see any for months on end over there

 

Well I think they keep all the really cute ones at Pendleton: there are some very nice looking lady Marines around town. I had a neighbor, a young PFC, who went off to Iraq in 2006 to drive a truck and apparently she must have sped by you too fast.

[teufelhunde.ret]

Original link lost, here is new one: http://www.nctimes.com/articles/2008/02/08...38_002_7_08.txt

 

Following comments from article...

 

The Marine Corps now has more than 11,100 women serving throughout its ranks around the world, including combat zones in Iraq. That's 6.2 percent of the force compared with the 1 percent when Judge enlisted.

 

Despite being banned from combat assignments, 94 female service members have been killed in Iraq, including six Marines.

 

Whether women belong in combat remains a subject of debate in all the services and for some active-duty female Marines.

 

At Camp Pendleton, 2nd Lt. Jaymie Sicking said she believed women had proven themselves worthy of combat assignments.

 

"We are just as capable as men in serving our country and performing heroic actions," Sicking said this week. "If it was decided that women could serve in combat, I think that would be great."

[Greg Robinson]

My original "BAM" recruiting poster dated Jan 1943.

 

 

 

 

PFC Nancy E Waggoner (my mother) who enlisted in 1943. She always said the poster shown above inspired her to enlist. She worked in the Air Wing in California.

 

[cwnorma]

WHISKEY TANGO FOXTROT!?!? 65 years?

 

Did anybody tell these Marines or do they somehow "not count"?

 

Seems more like 90 to me.

[teufelhunde.ret]

WHISKEY TANGO FOXTROT!?!? 65 years? Seems more like 90 to me.

 

Dam good point here .....?

[Bob Hudson]

It's the 65th anniversary of the start of the Women Marine Reserves which which evolved into women being part of the regular Marines. The article mentions and has a photo of the WWI WM,s.

[Brig]

Well I think they keep all the really cute ones at Pendleton: there are some very nice looking lady Marines around town. I had a neighbor, a young PFC, who went off to Iraq in 2006 to drive a truck and apparently she must have sped by you too fast.

Wait...there's TRUCKS in Iraq too?!?

[cwnorma]

It's the 65th anniversary of the start of the Women Marine Reserves which which evolved into women being part of the regular Marines. The article mentions and has a photo of the WWI WM,s.

 

 

Well, I suspect that the article is mostly a human interest "puff" piece by a likely "cub" reporter who didn't bother to really dig deep into the facts.

 

When Josephus Daniels enrolled Women into the Navy and USMC reserve during 1918, they were enrolled as USMC(Reserve)--the organized reserve component. When their service was no longer needed at the end of WW1, they were inactivated. Like any Reservist, the women had to apply for discharge although many did not, especially those working in and around USMC headquarters, and retained their status as "inactive reserve." By the time WW2 broke out, although none of the 300 USMCR(F)s had retained their reservist status, there were several former Yeomanettes still in the employ of the Department of the Navy. Joy Bright Hancock, later director of the USN Women's Reserve was one of them. Thus it can be said, that there were women reservists in the Navy Department consecutively since WW1. Since all three of the naval branches enrolled women reservists under the same regulations, it ends up being a little arbitrary to celebrate this 65th Anniversary as anything more than a modification of the (then) status quo.

 

My point is this; it is true that it is the 65th anniversary of the stand up of the Women Marine Reserves as a separate entity, and I in no way intend to diminish what these gallant women of WW2 did, but clearly, Women reservists in the Navy, Coast Guard, and the USMC can be traced to 1917. It is arguably this first contingent of naval reservists that led to the second batch, which eventually evolved into women serving in regular status.

 

Finally, in May this year, there will be a far more important anniversary; 13 May 1908 was the founding date of the Navy Nurse Corps. These were the very first women to serve the Navy in any official military capacity. I wonder if the press will even note the centennial of Women in the Navy?

 

Chris

[Bob Hudson]

Well, I suspect that the article is mostly a human interest "puff" piece by a likely "cub" reporter who didn't bother to really dig deep into the facts.

 

 

Actually he's an experienced reporter, but the spin of the story comes courtesy of the Corps. Here's an excerpt from a press release from the Corps a few years ago:

 

 

 

 

Feb. 13 (2003) Marks 60th Anniversary of Women in the Corps

by Staff Sgt. Cindy Fisher

Marine Corps News

February 12, 2003

 

Marine Corps women from all stages of history displayed their uniforms.

 

WASHINGTON -- Lt. Gen. Thomas Holcomb, the 17th Commandant of the Marine Corps, announced the formation of the Marine Corps Women's Reserve Feb. 13, 1943. This announcement paved the way for the continuous service of women in the Marine Corps for the past 60 years.

[cwnorma]

Forum Support,

 

Exactly my point. The Feb 13 1943 date is the anniversary of the Marine Corps Women's Reserve--not the beginning of Women in the Corps. The Marine Reserve (F)s of WW1 earned that particular distinction. I contend that if the Marines should want to celebrate the anniversary of Women in the Corps, they need to have a big party on the 13th of August 2008. On that date 90 years ago, the very first woman to join the USMC, Opha Mae Johnson enlisted.

 

Though I must say I find it interesting that the Marines, who are usually the best of all the services at remembering their own history, would forget the important role played by 300 daring women nearly a century ago.

 

Chris

 

WASHINGTON -- Lt. Gen. Thomas Holcomb, the 17th Commandant of the Marine Corps, announced the formation of the Marine Corps Women's Reserve Feb. 13, 1943. This announcement paved the way for the continuous service of women in the Marine Corps for the past 60 years.

[Bob Hudson]

Forum Support,

 

Exactly my point. The Feb 13 1943 date is the anniversary of the Marine Corps Women's Reserve--not the beginning of Women in the Corps. The Marine Reserve (F)s of WW1 earned that particular distinction. I contend that if the Marines should want to celebrate the anniversary of Women in the Corps, they need to have a big party on the 13th of August 2008. On that date 90 years ago, the very first woman to join the USMC, Opha Mae Johnson enlisted.

 

Though I must say I find it interesting that the Marines, who are usually the best of all the services at remembering their own history, would forget the important role played by 300 daring women nearly a century ago.

 

Chris

 

Well, until 1921 the Marine Corps marked its beginning as being 11 July 1798 instead of the now accepted 11 Nov 1775: it took 123 years for that change tp happen so maybe in another 58 years the Women Marines anniversary will catch up with history

[gunbarrel]

For more info...

 

http://www.defenselink.mil/specials/womenh...02/marines.html

[Brian Keith]

WW II US Marine Corps Women’s Reserve Summer Service Uniform and Utility Uniform Issued to Technical Sergeant Norma G. (Platt) Barger

Donated by Norma Barger, Museum of the Soldier Collection

 

 

The USMCWR Utilities are really hard to find, and they are not HBT material as some have reported.

 

For more photo's of this exhibit see in the "Displays and Preservation" forum, "Memories of WW II, Ft. Wayne Indiana".

 

BKW

[Bob Hudson]

The USMCWR Utilities are really hard to find, and they are not HBT material as some have reported.

 

I picked a USMCWR grouping today and it has wool and cotton uniform items plus the utilities including a few pairs of USMCWR pants. It looks like she also was issued a pair of Navy contract pants, and possibly a man's coat and pants. I'll try to get some photos up later today and start a USMCWR clothing thread since I don't think we have one.

[Bob Hudson]

The USMCWR Utilities are really hard to find, and they are not HBT material as some have reported.

 

I've posted a pair of USMCWR HBT utility pants at http://www.usmilitariaforum.com/forums/ind...showtopic=47586

[fortworthgal]

The USMCWR utilities were made of HBT material. They did have a work overall made of plain green cotton fabric, but their work utilities were HBT. The ones pictured above look like HBT to me, although without seeing a close-up of the fabric it is tough to tell. They are the same pattern as all the USMCWR HBTs I've seen. I have seen a very few examples of work utilities made in plain cotton non-HBT fabric, but they were most definitely not the norm.

 

The ladies also frequently wore the men's USMC HBT work utilities.

[MollyMarine1943]

The only HBT material that the WWII USMCWR's had was their utility overseas cap. The overalls (strapped) and utility jacket was not HBT, but a cotton twill (almost a sateen). Someone posted pictures of a WWII WR grouping that he (Bob Hudson? ) purchased......very nice, BTW. Pictures were posted of utility trousers that were indeed HBT's. The USMCWR most likely got them after WWII. Yes, she was a WWII vet, but she re enlisted, got them post WWII & saved them all together.

[Bob Hudson]

The only HBT material that the WWII USMCWR's had was their utility overseas cap.

 

The WWII women Marines did have HBT trousrs: you see a pair at http://www.usmilitariaforum.com/forums/index.php?/topic/47586-wwii-usmc-womens-reserve-usmcwr-uniforms/

 

 

And early on they were issued mens HBT shirts, but trousers shown at the link have a USMCWR label which dates them WWII, as does the service dates of the woman who owned them.

[bobgee]

Seems a good place to share this WM's medal group.

 

 

As awarded to GySgt ANN M. KOPP USMC. Her group of four medals, bar-mounted for wear: GCM w/ 3 stars, impressed Ann M./ Kopp 1952"; American Camp; WWII Victory, NDSM . Gunny Kopp entered the MCR in July 1943. Released from active duty in Nov 1945, she re-enlisted in Sept 1947 and served until her retirement in 1965. She earned 5 Good Conduct badges and was among the first group of Women Reservists to be sworn in as members of the Regular Marine Corps in Nov. 1948. Her 1952 dated impressed medal is very scarce, particularly as awarded to a WM.

 

Semper Fi.......Bobgee

[Bob Hudson]

Seems a good place to share this WM's medal group.

 

Kopp Medal bar Obv.JPGKopp Medal bar Rev.JPG

 

As awarded to GySgt ANN M. KOPP USMC. Her group of four medals, bar-mounted for wear: GCM w/ 3 stars, impressed Ann M./ Kopp 1952"; American Camp; WWII Victory, NDSM . Gunny Kopp entered the MCR in July 1943. Released from active duty in Nov 1945, she re-enlisted in Sept 1947 and served until her retirement in 1965. She earned 5 Good Conduct badges and was among the first group of Women Reservists to be sworn in as members of the Regular Marine Corps in Nov. 1948. Her 1952 dated impressed medal is very scarce, particularly as awarded to a WM.

 

Semper Fi.......Bobgee

 

Interesting - this made me realize that although I've purchased a few WWII USMCWR groups from families I have never seen a ribbon, let alone a medal, on them.

 

Did the WWII women Marines receive any ribbons?

[bobgee]

Interesting - this made me realize that although I've purchased a few WWII USMCWR groups from families I have never seen a ribbon, let alone a medal, on them.

 

Did the WWII women Marines receive any ribbons?

They earned medals under the same criteria as male Marines. Since most were serving stateside the most common was the American Campaign. Service in Hawaii or Alaska would have earned them the APT and of course the WWII Victory. Bob