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Model 1916 Holsters


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Charlie Flick
I have a holster which I would like some info on. Any further info and a guess to value would be appreciated.

 

Thanks

Rich

 

Hi Rich:

 

Your holster is a Model of 1916 holster designed to carry the Model of 1911 .45 ACP pistol. It was manufactured by the Boyt Harness Co. of Iowa during WW1. "JRJ" is the initials of the inspector of the holster. The black stamp on the inside is likely the name of the soldier to whom the holster was issued at one time.

 

I hope that this information has been helpful to you.

 

Regards,

Charlie Flick

 

 

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Hmmm, not sure what you mean, Lloyd.

 

There was nothing in there to stop my 1911!

 

Undo the flap and look inside the holster...there should be a rigid "block" of hard leather at the rear of the inside to keep the 45 "tight" inside the holster.

 

If you look at your middel picture you can see the stitch outline of where it should be.

 

Regards

 

LLoyd

What do you need another one of those for.....you have 6 of them already ?.........

:blink:

 

my girlfriend to me on a regular basis as another piece of US WW2 "Green stuff" aka militaria arrives in the post..:-)

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Undo the flap and look inside the holster...there should be a rigid "block" of hard leather at the rear of the inside to keep the 45 "tight" inside the holster.

 

If you look at your middel picture you can see the stitch outline of where it should be.

 

Regards

 

LLoyd

 

Had a look. Half of the stitching is there, but 'cut' on the inside whikst the other half has just left holes in the leather.

 

It looks as hough it has been cut out! Is this common?

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FYI. For a WWII pistol the "block" itself is actually a wooden form, covered by leather and stiched in place. It was part of the holster design from the beginning to keep the pistol tight in the holster and to tilt the butt of the pistol out away from the body, for easier grasping. During the holster trials it was found the magazine release button of the pistol would sometimes press against the block and could eject the magazine. The block design was quickly modified with a cutout so the magazine release button could not be accidentally pressed, while the pistol was inside the holster.

"No bastard ever won a war by dying for his country. He won it by making the other poor, dumb, bastard die for his country" George Pattons speech to the Third Army.

 

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  • 4 weeks later...

My M1916 holster has all-brass hardware including the flap stud. It's marked 'BOYT' on the back with the large stamp, equal-sized letters. Usually you find a date under the BOYT stamp but on this one it has the inspector's initials 'E.T.C.'. Is this most likely WWI or II?

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As guys told is WWI. These Boyts show different markings while WWII ones have always the same. You can find Boyt marking plus date and inspector initials or Boyt with only a date or Boyt with only inspector initials or Boyt alone.

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My M1916 holster has all-brass hardware including the flap stud. It's marked 'BOYT' on the back with the large stamp, equal-sized letters. Usually you find a date under the BOYT stamp but on this one it has the inspector's initials 'E.T.C.'. Is this most likely WWI or II?

 

Simply Boyt

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  • 8 months later...

I recently purchased a 1943 Graton & Knight pistol holster for a WWII M1911A1.

it's kind of dark colored and was wondering if anyone had ever used pecard leather dressing or any other method of lightening it up to it's natural color and maybe restored cracking in the leather.

what was your method?

 

here the pics of it

 

2383_1.jpg

2a14_1.jpg

 

thanks

Brad

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Greg Robinson

I've seen them where the leather had been redyed....not black as was done in the '50's....but a dark brown. I own a near mint G&K 1918 holster on a near mint MILLS M1912 pistol belt. Belt has what looks like mustard tan color blanco applied to it and the holster is a mahogany brown color. No way would I try to change it back to original color.

**PLEASE NOTE: THIS COMMUNITY MEMBER, SADLY, HAS PASSED AWAY**

http://www.usmilitariaforum.com/forums/index.php?/topic/106069-rip-greg-robinson/

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  • 2 years later...

Anyone familiar with this type modification to a 1916 holster. I suspect it is a repair.

Looking for original photos and other items from the First World War US 77th Infantry Division.

Also interested in BAR and M1917A1 BMG related items.

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Interior.

Looking for original photos and other items from the First World War US 77th Infantry Division.

Also interested in BAR and M1917A1 BMG related items.

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Anyone familiar with this type modification to a 1916 holster. I suspect it is a repair.

I've seen quite a few holsters with this modification. Looks like it was just to give that flap a little more strength in that area.

I don't see how it could be a repair as the flap is one piece of leather...not two thinner pieces sewn together.

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Here is the answer courtesy of a poster on the 1911forum -

 

Scott Meadows book indicates 1000 holsters were sent to San Antonio Arsenal for C&R (clean and repair). One of the problems was enlarged holes in the flap. The fix made there was to place a socket with washer (Durable Lift-The-Dot). They sent one to Rock Island Arsenal for comment. The CO stated and he felt this repair was a good serviceable job (his words). He goes on to state that another repair has been tried out on a holster by sewing a leather reinforce on the inside of the flap. This repair is recommended for used it will serve the purpose and is less expensive. All of this was going on in the mid 1930's. The country was in the midst of The Depression and military budgets were tight.

 

Mystery solved, thanks to Scott Meadows great book,

 

U.S. Military Holsters and Pistol Cartridge Boxes. 1987, Taylor Publishing Co.

 

http://forums.1911forum.com/showthread.php...800#post3163800

Looking for original photos and other items from the First World War US 77th Infantry Division.

Also interested in BAR and M1917A1 BMG related items.

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I have seen this stitching a few times on M1916 holsters. Two stick in mind, one of a soldier operating a water cooled 30cal browning, which I need to search out and the other attached of US Paras - 503rd - 11th ABN possibly, at Luzon 1945, sat on a Ford Jeep. The configuration of the stitching appears exact to the example above.

The Luzon pic appeared in JEEP Goes to War by William Fowler, MAGNA Books (ISBN 1-85422-453-0)

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  • 4 months later...

M16 Holsters dyed black.

 

 

I love this forum site. It's made me dig into stuff I forgot I had. Digging thru an old barracks bag full of web belts and misc. I found 3 M16 holsters that have been dyed black.

 

I assume this was done ca 1956 when the Army changed from brown to black. First one is a "Tex Tan", no date, dyed front and back. Next is a "Warren Leather Goods Co.", no date dyed 3/4 of the way around. The third one is an "Enger-Kress", no date, dyed face only.

 

Were these dye jobs done by the individual soldier or at depot level? or both.

 

All things being equal regarding condition, how does it affect the value of the holster? Serious drop in price, or just part of the piece's history?

 

Thanks,

 

Frank

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Frank, I would say that the M-1916 holster was done by the depots, and done by the individual soldiers. I have seen complete quality dye jobs, and some half way jobs. I don't know for sure this is just my feelings on the issue.

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I see WWII M1916 holsters that were dyed black and someone tried to remove the dye or cover it with brown polish. Those are pitiful and aren't worth much, except as an actual holster for carry. A M1916 holster dyed black tops out at about $25-30; they're too late for Korean War (1950-1953), and in the Viet Nam War (1965-1976) tthe military usually used the later manufactured ones with the part number on the back and with the factory black dye. However, I'm sure some were used in Viet Nam by the early Advisor Groups, so they would be as correct for that period as the later ones.

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There were many unissued tan holsters in inventory at the time the Army went to black accessories in 1955-'56, so they had to do something with what they had.....some of them were only dyed on the front half while others were made black on the front and back.

 

I had 3 or four different ones when I had a holster collection that numbered in the 40s to about 50....they do have a place in the historical context of what the Army used for a while.....collectors will find value with them for that reason alone.

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Exactly= they are a transitional piece, and deserve to be collected as such. Gives us another GOOD reason to go out and find some.

 

Frank

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VolunteerArmoury

I've read or been told that the USAF had holsters dyed black (late '40s) when they prescribed black leather shoes & chinstraps. Does anyone know if that is correct? Seems it also claimed that the USAF had holsters produced dyed black in '50 or '51 give or take. I'm curious if that is correct too. I personally like the dyed holsters because it just adds more history to it in my opinion.

Be well,

 

Chad C. Rogers

Retired Army

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El Bibliotecario

A soldier who served 58-60 told me he was issued brown boots and obliged to dye them black, which makes me suspect most of the brown field equipment was dyed at the unit level. This would also explain the rather lacadasical dye jobs often seen.

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RustyCanteen

They are still collectable but to a smaller market than a normal undyed WWII holster, thus the price/value is much lower.

 

RC

"It is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. Insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts."

*Sherlock Holmes in "A Scandal in Bohemia"*

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VolunteerArmoury
A soldier who served 58-60 told me he was issued brown boots and obliged to dye them black, which makes me suspect most of the brown field equipment was dyed at the unit level. This would also explain the rather lacadasical dye jobs often seen.

 

I have my father's boots which he claimed to have to dyed black when he enlisted in '61. The brown is peaking thru.

Be well,

 

Chad C. Rogers

Retired Army

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