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Not Familiar with Luxenberg Pattern & Hallmark


awmartin
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This weekend I was able to purchase what looks to be a Luxenberg wing (3 inch), although I am confused by the pattern and hallmark. This is my first Luxenberg wing, so I don't know too much about this style of wing.

 

When I first saw them I immediately noticed that it says "silver" instead of sterling, which I haven't seen on domestically produced wings. I've tried to find another example of the "Luxenberg New York Silver" hallmark, but wasn't able to find one, and in the meantime became confused with identifying which pattern they are, as they look to be in between pattern 2 and 3.

 

Anyone have any additional information on these?

 

Thanks

 

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I would like to start this one off by saying that I would have to pass on this one. I don't like the combination of hallmarks, I've never seen a flat back Lux before, I don't like the hardware. Might be a "3rd pattern" but I don't make the "silver" stamp. You have to remember that people have been "reproducing" Luxes for over 25 years.

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All three patterns can be located on Bob's excellent website CLICK ME The question is are there 3 patterns or 4? I think most folks would agree there are at least 3 as shown on Bob's site.

 

 

Here is a link to a discussion about the three patterns USMF THREAD

 

 

I think some confusion comes from what Fitzsimmons wrote that injects a the mark shown above as that of the 3rd pattern vs. the 3rd pattern on Bob's site. Fitzsimmons moves the 3rd pattern mark into the number four position.

 

I have been told that what was printed was incorrect and that it was a fake although I have no evidence to prove this as it was all part of conversations with different collectors. I am sure some of the resident experts will be able to provide more detail that I can. Additionally the photo in this post does not match the Fitzsimons 3rd patten.

 

I hope this info is helpful

 

Cheers

 

John

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  • 8 years later...

Found this old thread and I thought I’d finally post this wing that has intrigued me for a number of years to generate constructive dialogue.  There has been recent discussion on the mark SILVER, so thought this was an opportune time to post.  The wing does retain a significant portion of the original frost finish as is visible in the recesses and based on the horizontal lines on the center shield, the strike is strong.  The photos do show the pin does open completely to 180 degrees with no stopper.
 

I don’t know when the relationship between Blackington and Luxenberg commenced, but this pattern is usually attributed to 1920’s or 1930’s and I believe there is other evidence on Bob’s WW2 Wings site connecting this pattern to Blackington.

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31C89FF7-87F3-46A4-B37F-6E9DD151E177.jpeg

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I did some quick research, but it appears that as a military outfitter, Morry Luxenberg started around WWII (he was born in 1892 and died in 1968) and continued until his death.  Thus, you will find marked hats and such from WWII up into the VN era.  I think he was married in 1928 or so, and the 1940 census has him listed as a salesman/manufacturer (via ancestry). I also found a blurb from a1950's vintage Stars and Stripes newspaper that states that Morry Lunxenberg was going to be visiting 6-7 PX in Germany to sell uniforms, etc.


Is is much less clear what he was doing prior to WWII, but it seems that he was probably a salesman/tailor in New York.  I did find a reference to him visiting a tailor shop in 1927 or so, so he was either actually working as a tailor or as a salesmen for other tailor's shops.  But, all things considered, you really don't find m(any) Luxenberg-marked militaria (either uniforms/insignia) that seems to have been made prior to 1942. That makes sense, as I can imagine the depression and relatively low number of soldiers in the 20's and 30's would have made making a profit difficult.  Also, he seemed to have tried to focus on higher ranked military officers. Thus, from everything I have seen, I would be inclined to argue that Luxenberg (as a military outfitter) was probably active during WWII and post WWII. 

 

On another note, I've always felt that the "First Pattern/Second Pattern/Third Pattern" dating of Luxenberg wings to be very artificial and more based on collector's feelings than data.  AECo was out of business by 1948 or so, so at least we know that the AECo-pattern wings are more than likely WWII vintage.  Blackinton was also making their pattern wings from WWII and probably well into the KW time period. You can find the Blackinton pattern used on a fair number of airline wings, post WWII.  If I had to guess, I would think that the different patterns were probably offered all at the same time to prospective clients (if they wanted insignia) depending on supply and demand, from the 40's all the way up until near the 1970's.

 

As for these specific wings... I can provide some gossip that may (or may not) add something to this discussion.  in the late 1990's early 2000's Charles Fitzsimmons upgraded his "book", and  included Xerox images of a bunch of Luxenberg and Blackinton wing ratings.  He was also (kindly enough) selling these wings to sundry collectors (I know, I was one). In hand, the wings were cheaply made, very thin and had weak hallmarks.   Often times they had a "STER" or "SILVER" hallmark.  I was told by the Wing King (Art G) that as far as he knew, Fitzsimmons and some other dealers/collectors had gone to Blackinton and had them pull out their old dies and make a few runs of their wings.  Either the wings were hallmarked there, or someone added a fake hallmark later.  I don't know how true (or not) this story is, but having handled some of these "Fitzsimmon's-specials", it certainly fit my own experiences.

 

Patrick (not Pete!).... LOL

 

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Patrick,

 

Thanks for the additional research on Luxenberg’s activities.  With that, it is still unclear when a relationship between Luxenberg and Blackinton commenced, but good info nonetheless. 
 

Interestingly, this wing below from Bob’s WW2 Wings site and owned by Cliff P has a very similar pattern to the front to the wing I posted.  What I found intriguing is the mark on the back of the Observer wing below which looks very much like the STERLING semi-circle seen on the Luxenberg 2nd pattern wings.

 

Thanks again Patrick!

 

Pete

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While it may be comparing apples to oranges, I do know that Blackinton used its old dies/patterns to make other types of wings up to today.  This is a Capitol Airways pilot wing from (more than likely the 1960's).  Also, while I don't have it on hand right now, I believe I have the same wing you show, in gilt but without the central device--that was probably used as a base wing for various other airlines.

 

My point is that Blackinton probably used their old dies/patterns throughout their history.  I know if you go onto the Blackinton website you can find products that they make now for sale. So finding an old badge made by Blackinton doesn't necessarily mean that can be used to date another badge.  I suspect it can be very complex!  LOL. 

 

https://www2.blackinton.com/Pages/ProductsPage.aspx?CategoryId=CAT4096

captair-1.jpg

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