solcarlus Posted August 26, 2011 Share #1 Posted August 26, 2011 Bonjour A friend bought this cartridge, but he does not know what model or for which weapon it is intended. Merci. regards solcarlus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
collector Posted August 26, 2011 Share #2 Posted August 26, 2011 Stripper clips for an '03? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
solcarlus Posted August 27, 2011 Author Share #3 Posted August 27, 2011 Stripper clips for an '03? :dunno: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie Flick Posted August 27, 2011 Share #4 Posted August 27, 2011 S: I can't identify this pouch but I tend to think it is not for individual soldiers in the infantry or cavalry. Indeed, I don't think it was intended to hold rifle ammunition at all. My suspicion is that it was intended for use with some kind of artillery tool or device. The brass ring on it does not conform to any load bearing system in use by individual soldiers around 1906. Sorry that I could not be of more assistance. Perhaps other members have some better information. Regards, Charlie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RustyCanteen Posted August 28, 2011 Share #5 Posted August 28, 2011 Charlie is probably correct. It's not an issue infantry or cavalry item that I am familiar with. RC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike D Posted August 28, 2011 Share #6 Posted August 28, 2011 Cavalry? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RustyCanteen Posted August 28, 2011 Share #7 Posted August 28, 2011 What ever it is, it looks to have been dyed black. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RustyCanteen Posted August 28, 2011 Share #8 Posted August 28, 2011 Carter Rila would have known exactly what it was. No question about that. RC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jprostak Posted August 28, 2011 Share #9 Posted August 28, 2011 In 1906 RIA made cartridge boxes for 40 rounds of .30 cal in clips. See if 8 striiper clips of 30/06 fit. That would narrow it down. As for the ring on the back, I'm not sure. I'll keep on looking at my sources. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
solcarlus Posted August 29, 2011 Author Share #10 Posted August 29, 2011 Bonjour. Thank you for your answers. Note the absence of the symbol "US" on the front. Can you think of equipment for export? Cordialement solcarlus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
USARV72 Posted August 29, 2011 Share #11 Posted August 29, 2011 What about Bannerman?From what can be seen in the pics consider: Inspectors mark "T.C." was most likely Thomas Cory of RIA. Notice the off center rivet holding the leather tab with the ring on the back. Really don't think that would have passed inspection. Is the stitching attaching the 2 leather belt loops the same as the rest of the pouch?Looks different to me. What is the piece of raw edge leather where the cover is attached on the back of the pouch? And there is no "U.S." as mentioned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RustyCanteen Posted August 29, 2011 Share #12 Posted August 29, 2011 It could have been made for state use. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jprostak Posted August 30, 2011 Share #13 Posted August 30, 2011 RIA did not make anything for export. Everything that was issued to state units was by 1906 standard US Army equipment. As I said before, check to see if 8 five round clips fit. RIA made lots of stuff for experimental trials. If it was made at the Federal Arsenal, one would expect that it was up to par for issue. RIA only made a little over 2,000 leather boxes for .30 in clips. Its marked on the back as RIA and 1906, those things should not be in question. Not everything that RIA made had a US embossed on the flap. It was suggested by a friend of mine that (this is a guess only) maybe you would wear three boxes on a leather belt, in similar fasion to the German system and with one box on each front hip and one in the small of the back. Suspenders could have been the 1903 web suspenders. Quite honestly, until the records of the Infantry Equipment Board or a period photo can be found everything is just a guess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
artu44 Posted August 31, 2011 Share #14 Posted August 31, 2011 I think it was made for export. Dont forget Mills did web gears for Italy, Belgium and others immediately before WWI. Consider also that the ring reminds me to the french harness. Have you ever seen the zillion of M1 carbine mag pouches butchered in France adding a ring? Phil, pour moi l'anneu dit Armèe française ou belge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jprostak Posted September 1, 2011 Share #15 Posted September 1, 2011 The US arsenal at Rock Island did not make anything for the export market. It was a US Government Arsenal. Mills was a commercial concern that made equipment for anyone who was willing to pay for it. Just because it didn't have a big embossed US, does not mean it wasn't a piece of US equipment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RustyCanteen Posted September 1, 2011 Share #16 Posted September 1, 2011 I have to agree with jprostak. This is an issue item, we just can't readily identify what and the possibilty remains open that it was a test or experimental piece. RC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
artu44 Posted September 1, 2011 Share #17 Posted September 1, 2011 The US arsenal at Rock Island did not make anything for the export market. It was a US Government Arsenal. Mills was a commercial concern that made equipment for anyone who was willing to pay for it. Just because it didn't have a big embossed US, does not mean it wasn't a piece of US equipment. Yes, it makes sense. I was quite active on the french forum where Solcarlus is the big guru and I saw they often adapt foreign piece of equipmenr for their army use. Oviuosly the most are WWII web gear donated by US after the war. Considering that this item is bought on a french flea market, I'm not sure it would be unmessed. For instance I cannot understand the presence of that small hole in the loops. The upper ring on pouches is tipically european and it's to be used with suitable suspenders. I'm far to be an expert in pre WWI US stuff, but definitively this piece doesn't look to me made for US Army or Cavalry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
solcarlus Posted September 1, 2011 Author Share #18 Posted September 1, 2011 Bonjour. Indeed, the leather equipment had this ring for attaching the straps of the suspension. Thank you for the searches you perform. No Arturo, I'm not a guru. :laughing1: solcarlus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jprostak Posted September 1, 2011 Share #19 Posted September 1, 2011 Hi Solcarlus, Can you post box measurements? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
etienne Posted September 1, 2011 Share #20 Posted September 1, 2011 No Arturo, I'm not a guru. :laughing1: Really ?? ... you're more than a guru, Sol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lansquenet Posted September 1, 2011 Share #21 Posted September 1, 2011 Really ?? ... you're more than a guru, Sol My God SOLCARLUS !!!! You are here!!!!! L. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
artu44 Posted September 1, 2011 Share #22 Posted September 1, 2011 My God SOLCARLUS !!!! You are here!!!!!L. Yes, it was my fault!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RustyCanteen Posted September 1, 2011 Share #23 Posted September 1, 2011 Yes, it was my fault!!!! Do we blame you for all the best web belts being off the market? :thumbsup: RC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
solcarlus Posted September 2, 2011 Author Share #24 Posted September 2, 2011 Bonjour. Here are the dimensions in centimeters. There was a second copy sold on Ebay Fr 133 mmx88mmx55mm. I'm not a guru, but some of my friends call me "God" slcarlus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jprostak Posted September 30, 2011 Share #25 Posted September 30, 2011 OK, so I cut out some cardboard and made a box the same size and it fits 8-5 round clips of 30/06. (by the way, its almost the same exact size as the BAR spare parts leather box) Then, while I was at work today, with plenty of time to ponder such things, I thought, hey whats the snap hook on the Merriam pack for? In 1906 RIA also made 779 Merriam Packs. They also made 2300 russett cartridge boxes for .30 in clips. Maybe the boxes were suppose to be used with the Merriam Pack and a leather belt. The Infantry Equipment Board thinks......... New Rifle, needs ammo storage, New York has a million Merriam packs that don't attach to our new m1903 cartridge belts, someone keeps on pushing the Meriam pack on us, we need ideas............................... See pics attached which I borrowed from a post on the subject of the Merriam Pack. I'm just guessing until I have more data from the National Archives. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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