gunbarrel Posted January 5, 2012 Share #51 Posted January 5, 2012 I also noticed as I was looking over the ad historyThose items you postedlook sell for 50.00 to 199.00 not a big profit ! IMO The other ones listed for high money never sell ! Then, why keep making them? :dunno: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cromwell Posted January 5, 2012 Share #52 Posted January 5, 2012 Then, why keep making them? :dunno: Good question ? I thought the way the OP was acting that these were 2000.00 knives not 200.00 ?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gunbarrel Posted January 5, 2012 Share #53 Posted January 5, 2012 Good question ? I thought the way the OP was acting that these were 2000.00 knives not 200.00 ?? OP = original poster? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cromwell Posted January 5, 2012 Share #54 Posted January 5, 2012 OP = original poster? Yes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nuke41 Posted January 5, 2012 Author Share #55 Posted January 5, 2012 OP I called the number you listed ,ahh I suggest that you call it,as the lady said I was only caller. I had to leave message and got a reply within 20 min. The lady said those 2 knives were made for a customer quite a while ago & are posted as examples of items she has made. You may want to Throw your investigator hat back on for a few & rethink . Here’s another attempted sale I didn’t post already: “From: "[email protected]" Sent: Thursday, August 18, 2011 8:14 AM Subject: [brass Knuckles Collector Club] Digest Number 681 Brass Knuckles/Knuckle Duster Collectors Messages In This Digest (2 Messages) 1. EW Stone WW II knuckle knife From: alwilliam2000 2. E w stone knuckle knives From: alwilliam2000 1. EW Stone WW II knuckle knife Posted by: "alwilliam2000" [email protected] alwilliam2000 Wed Aug 17, 2011 8:04 am (PDT) For sale a ew stone skull & snake knuckle knife with a Robinson shuredge blade and it's original usn Boyt 43 sheath... Items are well used but still intact & useable 1200.00 obo or possible trades . Email for pics... no dreamers please ! Back to top Reply to sender | Reply to group | Reply via web post Messages in this topic (1) 2. E w stone knuckle knives Posted by: "alwilliam2000" [email protected] alwilliam2000 Wed Aug 17, 2011 8:50 am (PDT) couple of emails on the ew I have , here's my answer. Their are so many ew stone type knuckles out their ,I think if the truth were more clearly known ,people would know their rare ,but not as rare as is thought. Now a true e.w. Stone as cast by ew sr in ww2 aboard the USA holland ... Now that's rare but The were many "stone knucks" cast by not only ew stone sr but stone sr friends,other molders on at least 4 ships that I know of,the Australia foundry cast ones,currie cast ones,copies made during the war and right after the war,edmf Dale sandberg cast ones,the many back door cast ones,etc,etc, etc .... Unless I had a notarized letter from bill sr NOT jr saying when and where he cast it him self ,I would not count any of the so called ew stones as true ew stones . Just for a research start...Read the i think may 2002 issue of knife world ,it had a article by ew himself ,it's a real eyeopener as to just how many ew knives maybe out their and how many people have made them.” - Text comparison software (and common sense) indicates the above emails are from “Arcane”; this knife is more than likely the same as former Gun Broker item # 252473705. - I think the sellers of these feel they can hide behind the supposed anonymity of email and the internet, but in actuality that’s harder than they might think. Using open source data internet IDs like “Bladeslinger”, “Arcane” and “[email protected]” start turning into real names like Skimming and Pelozzie and that leads to phone numbers and street addresses. “Arcane” for example has a shipping address that’s a house that was built in 1900; it was bought in 2000 for $23,000. - So the foundry claims they didn’t make any of the ones Arcane is selling? I find that utterly incredible since the foundry and the seller(s) are all in Spokane Washington. Will they stick by that when a postal inspector comes around with a Miranda card in hand? - As to fraud, the previous attempted sales by Arcane show documented intent; any collector coming forward saying they bought a knife that was claimed to be authentic will have an easy time. The fact that he’s listing them now as reproductions or as “I don’t know” items can’t erase the fact he’s attempted to sell replicas as original estate sale Stone knives. The “I don’t know, you decide” descriptions are not a slam dunk, but still show deception since the seller knows he selling newly made knives coming out of a local foundry. As to value of the sales, fraud is fraud, the value of the sold item will have an impact whether it’s a felony or a misdemeanor and may have an impact of the penalty phase (you’re lawyer relatives can confirm that). - So why do I care about all this? Simply because I spent years and lots of money collecting and studying Stone and other theater knives. Fakes have been an issue with Stone knives and collectors have had to be careful, but the recent high volume of fakes now threatens to degrade the value and collectability of one of the most desirable theater knives ever produced. I don’t want to be at a show in the future and hear someone say “all those are fakes” when he sees a Stone knife on display or for sale. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capajo02 Posted January 5, 2012 Share #56 Posted January 5, 2012 Thanks to the original poster for starting and continuing an interesting, helpful thread on this forum. Not to pick on anyone or to make any general negative statements about the USMF community, but I feel as if there are many, many threads which are started with a legitimate post with information or a question about an item, then the whole thread is filled with either "expert" naysayers or yes-men. This post is what - I believe - forums like this one should be about: great research and sharing information. Despite the comments of some in this thread, information and research presented in this topic seems to be quite thorough and incredibly well-done. Thanks for giving us something worth reading, and something that doesn't blindly adhere to old collecting myths or rumors. Your original research and information in this area is commendable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cromwell Posted January 5, 2012 Share #57 Posted January 5, 2012 My research still shows nothing about " original " ,rare etc are stated but original ww2 ? Even when Atlanta cutlery stated selling their ew they used the same story,till Bill jr Contacted them & they changed it. Please point out these accusations about the knives being original stones ? Thank you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony-in-NH Posted January 5, 2012 Share #58 Posted January 5, 2012 It also states that "These were cast from a original ew stone mold"Has the EW Stone estate loaned out the Molds to make these knives? LF I have spoken to Bill Stone Jr. recently. about the molds. His reply was " They have never been let out. " So that answers that point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nuke41 Posted January 5, 2012 Author Share #59 Posted January 5, 2012 My research still shows nothing about " original " ,rare etc are stated but original ww2 ? Even when Atlanta cutlery stated selling their ew they used the same story,till Bill jr Contacted them & they changed it. Please point out these accusations about the knives being original stones ? Thank you http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem....?Item=252473705 “HARD TO FIND leather USN marked BOYT 43 SHEATH WITH A ROBESON SHREDGE BLADE ,CAST ALUMINIUM SKULL COBRA SNAKE KNUCKLE DUSTER HANDLE...ALL IN FAIR CONDITION ! SEE PICS ! **** USS HOLLAND USN ITEMS,ID DOG TAGES,DRESS BLUES,FLARE,ZIPPO,ECT... NOT FOR SALE IN THIS AUCTION !**** SKULL KNIFE AND SHEATH ARE THE ONLY ITEMS FOR SALE IN THIS AUCTION ! THE KNIFE CAME FROM THE ESTATE OF A USS HOLLAND Damage Control man WHO SERVED ON THE HOLLAND IN WW2 ! THE ESTATE HAD A LARGE KNIFE COLLECTION that the owner had collected while SERVING ON THE USS HOLLAND FREE SHIPPING WITH BUY IT NOW !!!!” http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem....?Item=252626883 “DEVIL KNUCKLE DUSTER knife called "the billy knife" & cast from duralumin in the 40s on the uss holland by a damage control man with casting and machine skills. This version has brass skull crusher horns and a m3 blade along with a us m8a1 bm co vp marked sheath. sheath has a broken strap and lots of wear as does the knife !! see pics for condition ! notes found with collection stated that the knife was made for a "black devils" member who was a friend of the usn damage control man.” The seller can’t claim something was made on the USS Holland during WWII when they know it was made at their local foundry a couple of weeks ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cromwell Posted January 5, 2012 Share #60 Posted January 5, 2012 I was waiting on this info And think correct time to say is now. I bought the Robeson in that ad, but when pressed seller stated it was a reproduction to me . Deal was far below the ad price,I think I paid 150.00 Devil is one I have not seen ,anyone buy that one here ? I got a interesting pm from another buyer on here of these knives,will You please post what you pm me . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sactroop Posted January 5, 2012 Share #61 Posted January 5, 2012 I was waiting on this info And think correct time to say is now. I bought the Robeson in that ad, but when pressed seller stated it was a reproduction to me . Deal was far below the ad price,I think I paid 150.00 Devil is one I have not seen ,anyone buy that one here ? I got a interesting pm from another buyer on here of these knives,will You please post what you pm me . Maybe I'm missing something regarding the flow of this thread. But isn't the underlined above at the heart of this matter? Why should an ethical seller need to be pressed regarding an item being original or a reproduction? Even if the market place is such at this time that most who are willing to buy are offering prices that are in line for a reproduction why shouldn't the manufacture sell these not only as copies but also with a built in tell to distinguish them from the originals? If I'm missing the point to the discussion I do apologize. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cromwell Posted January 5, 2012 Share #62 Posted January 5, 2012 Maybe I'm missing something regarding the flow of this thread. But isn't the underlined above at the heart of this matter?Why should an ethical seller need to be pressed regarding an item being original or a reproduction? Even if the market place is such at this time that most who are willing to buy are offering prices that are in line for a reproduction why shouldn't the manufacture sell these not only as copies but also with a built in tell to distinguish them from the originals? If I'm missing the point to the discussion I do apologize. You are 100% right on ! I am trying to contact maker now, I am in total Agreement with op and you know the point of why not sell as current reproduction Is going going to be my main point I want to present. I think that is a fabulous idea. Maybe this will stop all this vintage,old,original poppycock & as you said not have to Pry the true deal out. Geez Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
damcon3 Posted December 15, 2012 Share #63 Posted December 15, 2012 I know this is an old post but, is this the same seller now selling on gunbroker? http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=322025240 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cromwell Posted December 15, 2012 Share #64 Posted December 15, 2012 Yes same gunbroker seller,these are recastings as listed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adogg1976 Posted June 21, 2019 Share #65 Posted June 21, 2019 Yes same gunbroker seller,these are recastings as listed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adogg1976 Posted June 21, 2019 Share #66 Posted June 21, 2019 I realize this is a old thread ....but since that the cat is out of the bag and maker of these reproduction theater and Stone knives identity is now known ....does anyone on here have any of these castings(theatre knives or knuckles) they would be willing to sell? I would be a very interested buyer let me know! Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adogg1976 Posted June 21, 2019 Share #67 Posted June 21, 2019 I was waiting on this info And think correct time to say is now. I bought the Robeson in that ad, but when pressed seller stated it was a reproduction to me . Deal was far below the ad price,I think I paid 150.00 Devil is one I have not seen ,anyone buy that one here ? I got a interesting pm from another buyer on here of these knives,will You please post what you pm me . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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