New Find- USMC Bell Crown

[kklinejr]

I picked this piece up over the weekend on the cheap. It has a few moth holes, but is in overall sound condition. The EGA is poked through the hat (no grommet for EGA) and it features EGA marked visor buttons. I can't get them away from the hat far enough to read their makers. Any opinions on type, authenticity, etc, etc, etc? Doesn't seem like an enlisted visor, but I have little experience with this type of item.

 

Thanks!

 

Ken

[kklinejr]

Photos

[SteveR]

My gut reaction is that it is an old fraternal cap that someone has put together. I don't remember any bullion chinstrap on Marine or Army caps of the period. The fact that there is no grommet for the EGA immediately raises a red flag for me. Sorry friend.

Steve

[Bob Hudson]

You might want to compare the EGA with those in this thread: http://www.usmilitariaforum.com/forums/ind...?showtopic=9168

[gunbarrel]

I don't know anything about vintage Marine covers, but this hat looks like one of the fireman's hat, or train conductor hats you see in the antique shops...

[teufelhunde.ret]

My gut reaction is that it is an old fraternal cap that someone has put together. I don't remember any bullion chinstrap on Marine or Army caps of the period. The fact that there is no grommet for the EGA immediately raises a red flag for me. Sorry friend.

Steve

 

DITTO... I presume Jeremiah and Mark will see this and elaborate...

[Bob Hudson]

My gut reaction is that it is an old fraternal cap that someone has put together. I don't remember any bullion chinstrap on Marine or Army caps of the period. The fact that there is no grommet for the EGA immediately raises a red flag for me. Sorry friend.

Steve

 

I found two photos of Marine Band director John Philip Sousa wearing a similar cap with, of all things, what appear to be Navy insignia, but it does have the bullion chinstrap (I put a small black and white version of the above cap in this collage):

 

[cbuehler]

The EGA is of course incorrect and is the type worn on the early paddle shoulder boards. Regarding the cap itself, if it does not have a quatrefoil on the top of the crown or grommet for the ornament, it is not Marine Corps. Also, the chin strap is incorrect as well.

I am keeping my fingers crossed that the quatrefoil is there. Officer's hats from this era are rare, even without the ornament or proper chin strap.

 

CB

[kklinejr]

Hey, for the price I got what I expected...a mock -up. No quatrefoil above which I knew crossed out an officer's cap and the bullion strap also led me to also question this being an enlisted piece. For the price, I couldn't complain. I'll set this in with some other "oddities" I have picked up over the years.

 

Thanks for the opinions...as I said, about what I expected.

 

Ken

[Dirk]

No quatrefoil, no eyelet for the EGA and the chin strap should have a scarlet stripe running through it.

[usmcaviator]

IMO, that cap is a train conductor or band cap. It sports a mohair band which is only found on officer's caps (but those have a quatrefoil on top), it also has a non-military dress chin strap. The whole thing looks like a poor attempt at the enlisted P1904 dress cap, which should sport a heavier guage gilted brass or gilder's medal EGA. It has a Bannerman's (I suspect 2 prong or 4 prong) nickled EGA and some Marine side buttons. The only thing actually Marine on this cap or saw service is the buttons (my opinion is that Bannerman EGAs never saw any service).

 

Mike

[Brig]

I agree that the lack of the grommet almost immediately disqualifies it as USMC.

[jeremiahcable]

Ken, if you got it cheap enough it may be that you have a good EGA and chinstrap buttons. Sadly these things are being built and faked like crazy now. Looks like everyone pretty much summed it up.

 

Jeremiah