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Army Specialist 8 & 9 Insignia

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Does anyone know if Specialist 8 & 9 rank insignia was ever created. Although no soldier ever made it to those ranks, I assume that those rank patches were created and sold in Clothing Sales or whatever the 1950-60s version of the Army's uniform sales store was called. If those patches were created I assume they'd fetch a hefty price since no soldier made it there. Does anyone know where I can purchase one (either and original or reproduction) or where I can have one made?


11B1P Long Range Surveillance

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Check out these two on eBay right now.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...T#ht_500wt_1282

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...T#ht_500wt_1282

 

Try using the Forum's "Search" function for "Specialist ranks". You would have found these discussions:

http://www.usmilitariaforum.com/forums/ind...hl=specialist+8

http://www.usmilitariaforum.com/forums/ind...0ranks&st=0

http://www.usmilitariaforum.com/forums/ind...=12181&st=0

 

There is a history of Army enlisted ranks on the Institute of Heraldry website, which is a good place for information on some of the other questions you are posting:

http://www.tioh.hqda.pentagon.mil/Uniforme...ed_history.aspx


~ In Memory Of ~
Donald Earl Boston, IC3 - KILO PLT, SEAL TEAM ONE, TF 116, USNAVFORV - KIA 07 April 1967, Vietnam
David Rolland Jackson, CWO - 71ST AHC, 14TH AVN BN
, 16TH AVN GROUP, AMERICAL - KIA 25 September 1969, Vietnam

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They show up from time to time, as you can see, they were produced, although for the most part (there is some controversy about this) never worn.


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After having a double bypass this past year, it's time to downsize and pass along much of my 'stuff'. I've had my fun, now it is someone elses turn.

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Yes the Specialist 8 and 9 ranks did exist, but no one ever attained those ranks. I have seen a few Spec. 8 and 9 chevrons for sale on eBay.

 

 

-Nick


Looking to buy ww2 M1941 Field Jacket

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I was in the Army National Guard 1977-1984 and worked on Korean War era electronics. We had some training films that had Specialist 8 and 9 in them and the guys who had been in for a long time almost fell out of their chairs laughing. They said nobody ever wore them, but a few actors wore them at one time.


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Here is a chevron display I just finished that show the Spec 8 and 9. Pairs of Spec 9 were expensive on ebay not that long ago.

post-736-1313526259.jpg


 

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"I am not broke but you can see the cracks, you can make me perfect again. All because of you". U2

 

Jace, Tim, and Mike you will always be my buds. God's Blessings guys.

 

" It's awful squatchy out here"

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In 1972 our Hospital Chief Wardmaster at BAMC was a Spec 8. He might have been an E-7 who was "frocked" and wearing Spec 8. At the time I was a Pvt and I wouldn't even look at him, much less ask about his rank. He was the only Spec 8 I ever saw during my 36 years in the Army. I've never seen anyone wearing Spec 9 rank, but nearly every major HQ's supply room had Spec 9 rank on the shelf. In the 80s when the Army started phasing out Specialist rank, a fellow Soldier (Supply NCO) built a display of Specialist rank from Spec 4 to Spec 9, so the E-8/E-9 specialist rank was still in the supply system. He even obtained the smaller female versions.

Regards,

555

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In the 80s when the Army started phasing out Specialist rank, a fellow Soldier (Supply NCO) built a display of Specialist rank from Spec 4 to Spec 9, so the E-8/E-9 specialist rank was still in the supply system. He even obtained the smaller female versions.

 

Spec 8 and 9 were discontinued in 1965... I'm surprised they were still in the system fifteen or more years later.


~ In Memory Of ~
Donald Earl Boston, IC3 - KILO PLT, SEAL TEAM ONE, TF 116, USNAVFORV - KIA 07 April 1967, Vietnam
David Rolland Jackson, CWO - 71ST AHC, 14TH AVN BN
, 16TH AVN GROUP, AMERICAL - KIA 25 September 1969, Vietnam

donation2019.gifdonation2020.gif

donation2017.gifdonation2018.gif

donation2014.gifdonation2015.gifdonation2016.gif

donation2010.gifdonation2011.gifdonation2012.gifdonation2013.gif

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Here is a chevron display I just finished that show the Spec 8 and 9. Pairs of Spec 9 were expensive on ebay not that long ago.


EDIT: Picture is no longer available

NICE! :thumbsup:

"Old tankers never die, they just smell that way!"

A co. 4/73rd Armor, 1st Infantry Division (Forward)

 

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Holy Mackrel, that is rare! I don't know about $200 rare, but rare nonetheless.


11B1P Long Range Surveillance

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Spec 8 and 9 were discontinued in 1965... I'm surprised they were still in the system fifteen or more years later.

 

I can honestly say I saw Specialist 5 & 6 rank still on shelves as late as 1993. In 1993, I was sent to help relocate a unit from Fort Campbell to Fort Bragg. We sent several boxes of new Spec 5 and 6 rank to DRMO. Maybe their supply guys thought the specialist rank would come back. Who knows.

 

When our Supply Sergeant builtt his collection, he was assigned to a Logistics Group HQ, he didn't seem to have any problems finding the Spec 8 and 9 rank. That was probably around 1985.

 

Regards,

555

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Can anyone give me a clear year as to when Spec 8 & 9 were abolished. I've seen sources that indicate 1965 and sources that say 1968.


11B1P Long Range Surveillance

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Can anyone give me a clear year as to when Spec 8 & 9 were abolished. I've seen sources that indicate 1965 and sources that say 1968.

Emerson says '65 and the Army's Institute of Heraldry says '65.... I'd go with '65....


~ In Memory Of ~
Donald Earl Boston, IC3 - KILO PLT, SEAL TEAM ONE, TF 116, USNAVFORV - KIA 07 April 1967, Vietnam
David Rolland Jackson, CWO - 71ST AHC, 14TH AVN BN
, 16TH AVN GROUP, AMERICAL - KIA 25 September 1969, Vietnam

donation2019.gifdonation2020.gif

donation2017.gifdonation2018.gif

donation2014.gifdonation2015.gifdonation2016.gif

donation2010.gifdonation2011.gifdonation2012.gifdonation2013.gif

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Well I got ahold of some Spec 8 and 9 ranks. All ranks pictured here are matched pairs, not just single insignia.

post-49998-1318018834.jpg


11B1P Long Range Surveillance

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Emerson says '65 and the Army's Institute of Heraldry says '65.... I'd go with '65....

Are you certain that it was '65? I'm not sure that there were subdued ranks prior to '67 or '68.

post-49998-1318030167.jpg


11B1P Long Range Surveillance

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Are you certain that it was '65? I'm not sure that there were subdued ranks prior to '67 or '68.

 

This type of subdued rank insignia is typical of the u.s. made type,it is emrbroidered on OG cootton sateen material.This u.s. made subdued types started to be made in around the late summer of 1966 and was shortly rushed to the RVN.In a 25th Inf division yearbook that came out in late 1966 you can see some men wearing this type it is unmistakely the u.s type, so that this super spec rank may in fact would have been made if they in fact where abolished in 1968 It is significant that this subdued super spec patch is a u.s made type and not a vietnamese made type,this would at least indicate like some of the other members are thinking in that it was a rank that despite it being abolished it may have been considered to be implemented again down the line or the other earlier theory that these super spec ranks where in fact abolished in 1968.

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Are you certain that it was '65? I'm not sure that there were subdued ranks prior to '67 or '68.

How long have you owned this subdued Spec9?


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I don't own that Spec 9 subdued patch. I found a picture of it on a website that had some Spec rank insignia. What you see in the photo is what I own in regards to Spec ranks; one pair of gold on green, cut edge, 1955 style ranks from Spec 4 to 9 each. And one pair gold on green, cut edge, 1958 style ranks from Spec 4 to 9 each.


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Are you certain that it was '65? I'm not sure that there were subdued ranks prior to '67 or '68.

I didn't say it was 1965 .... Bill Emerson and the United States Army said it was 1965.

And, yes .... I'm pretty certain they both know what they're talking about. :dry:


~ In Memory Of ~
Donald Earl Boston, IC3 - KILO PLT, SEAL TEAM ONE, TF 116, USNAVFORV - KIA 07 April 1967, Vietnam
David Rolland Jackson, CWO - 71ST AHC, 14TH AVN BN
, 16TH AVN GROUP, AMERICAL - KIA 25 September 1969, Vietnam

donation2019.gifdonation2020.gif

donation2017.gifdonation2018.gif

donation2014.gifdonation2015.gifdonation2016.gif

donation2010.gifdonation2011.gifdonation2012.gifdonation2013.gif

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I don't own that Spec 9 subdued patch. I found a picture of it on a website that had some Spec rank insignia. What you see in the photo is what I own in regards to Spec ranks; one pair of gold on green, cut edge, 1955 style ranks from Spec 4 to 9 each. And one pair gold on green, cut edge, 1958 style ranks from Spec 4 to 9 each.

The reason I ask is that I never saw any of these until relatively recently (primarily on Ebay). I'm trying to determine if they are original. Lots of repro subdued US Army chevrons out there. And they are very difficult to detect.


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Valid point. I think it would cost more to have a repro made, than the amount you can make off of it. Spec 8 and 9 ranks run about $20-$30, and I can't imagine that it costs less than that to make, at least not to the point where you are making much of a profit. Look at some of the ranks that were made in country in Vietnam, you can usually tell if they are fake. However, nowadays with all the technology, I guess that it is possible to get them made. However I just have a feeling that if it was easy to get Spec 8 and 9 ranks, we'd see a lot more gold on blue and gold on white spec 8 and 9 ranks. As for the subdued Spec 9 insignia, I still have no idea as to when the Spec 8 and 9 ranks were abolished, I know what the Army Institute of Heraldry says but I think that that subdued spec 9 rank is legitimate.


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Valid point. I think it would cost more to have a repro made, than the amount you can make off of it. Spec 8 and 9 ranks run about $20-$30, and I can't imagine that it costs less than that to make, at least not to the point where you are making much of a profit. Look at some of the ranks that were made in country in Vietnam, you can usually tell if they are fake. However, nowadays with all the technology, I guess that it is possible to get them made. However I just have a feeling that if it was easy to get Spec 8 and 9 ranks, we'd see a lot more gold on blue and gold on white spec 8 and 9 ranks. As for the subdued Spec 9 insignia, I still have no idea as to when the Spec 8 and 9 ranks were abolished, I know what the Army Institute of Heraldry says but I think that that subdued spec 9 rank is legitimate.

 

I'll say that its a period made u.s. made subdued one as well, as from what I can see it has all the characteristics of this type which is the use of OD cotton sateen as well as the border which is like the type on u.s. made patches of all kinds. This subdued Spec 9 patch may have been made in late 1966 into 1967 by a manufacturer who simply made them because these ranks where still catogorized as being in the u.s.army rank structure despite them being no longer autherized, and where only made briefly. My experience with the subdued repros of this type is that they all seem to have a twill like background with very thin OD borders,when you have them in hand you can tell be the feel of them, A simple burn test on the thread of the background material of these will all ways burn poly.

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A simple burn test on the thread of the background material of these will all ways burn poly.

Burn test for 1960's era patches??? Per your advice, I went through my collection of 1960's/Vietnam era patches and checked for any made of polyester/synthetic threads. I threw any such patches I found in the trash.

I no longer have a VN er patch collection. Bummer!


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Burn test for 1960's era patches??? Per your advice, I went through my collection of 1960's/Vietnam era patches and checked for any made of polyester/synthetic threads. I threw any such patches I found in the trash.

I no longer have a VN er patch collection. Bummer!

 

I was talking about those subdued U.S. made sleeve rank patches, if they are orignial from the period of 1966 to 1968 they will be embroidered on OD cotton sateen or OD cotton twill, this is from where I removed a thread to burn, from the edge of the background cloth. The black threads used in the chevrons-rockers -specialist eagles ET-AL would be of rayon,if the border is OD thread same rayon. This naturally applies to most if not all the vietnamese types to include the shoulder patches in this type machine imbroidery on this type of cloth both U.S. and vietnamese made,also the qulification badges.The back or bobbin threads for the most part however will be the white poly/synthetic threads, this being in keeping with the use of this poly thread on the regular full color shoulder patches, enlistedmen sleeve rank insignia and qualification badges that where made during this period. As you said there are repros but from what I seen these are easy to spot. Where there ones made on a poly/synthentic background ? I would say no, they,re where however ones made I think in late 1968 into 1969 the had its background cloth made of that poly/cotton blend twill like material of the type that would eventually be used in making the officers and enlisted collar rank insignia and the qualification badges but since its a poly/cotton it will burn away slightly different from pure polyester thread.

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