Verdun16 Posted July 17, 2011 Share #1 Posted July 17, 2011 This group was up for auction on a British medals website and finished tonight for 4505 British Pounds or just over $6600. Far more than what I could afford to offer, Bryan http://www.neateauctions.co.uk/auction_det...ction_id=109701 Bronze Star (ANDREW F. HILL), Purple Heart (ANDREW F. HILL), American Campaign Medal, European African Middle Eastern Campaign Medal with one silver & one bronze star emblems, American Legion Valor Medal (A. F. HILL. W2-124-538). With original unit patches, ribbon bars, Bronze Star citation, Purple Heart award document, Presidential condolence scroll and two American Legion certificates. Documents folded. Citation for Bronze Star Medal (Posthumous) Warrant Officer (Junior Grade) Andrew F. Hill, W2124538, Parachute Infantry, United States Army, for meritorious service in connection with operations against the enemy from 1 April 1944 to 6 June 1944, as Assistant Regimental Munitions Officer, Parachute Infantry. Through his initiative, intelligence, and extreme devotion to duty under the most trying conditions, Warrant Officer Hill has been an inspiration to everyone who has worked with him. In the face of many obstacles, he was successful in maintaining the ordnance of his regiment in a superior condition and in keeping the regimental basic load of ammunition prepared for immediate movement at all times. During the planning period preceding the invasion of Europe, Warrant Officer Hill worked unceasingly to ready the regimental supply and ordnance sections for combat. Its success in accomplishing its mission is now history, and to Warrant Officer Hill belongs as much credit as can be given to any one man. His final act was his life on D-Day in an assault in which it has been reported he personally accounted for seventeen enemy casualties. His conduct was in accordance with the highest standards of the military service. Andrew F. Hill ID: W2124538 Entered the Service From: New York Rank: Warrent Officer Junior Grade Service:U.S. Army, 506th Parachute Infantry Regt, 101st Airborne Division Died: Tuesday, June 06, 1944 Buried at: Normandy American Cemetery Location: Colleville-sur-Mer, France Plot: F Row: 13 Grave: 5 Awards: Bronze Star, Purple Heart Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nic Posted July 17, 2011 Share #2 Posted July 17, 2011 http://www.usmilitariaforum.com/forums/ind...w+f\.+hill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Verdun16 Posted July 17, 2011 Author Share #3 Posted July 17, 2011 NIc, Thanks for posting the link. Knew I had seen this one before but could not remember where, Bryan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack's Son Posted July 17, 2011 Share #4 Posted July 17, 2011 After Nic's post, the group is not so 'shiny'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nic Posted July 17, 2011 Share #5 Posted July 17, 2011 It definitely raises a lot of questions. The documents in the auction look legit. I don't trust my eyes enough to say that the PH shown in the auction is the same one that was previously sold on E-Bay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack's Son Posted July 17, 2011 Share #6 Posted July 17, 2011 It definitely raises a lot of questions. The documents in the auction look legit. I don't trust my eyes enough to say that the PH shown in the auction is the same one that was previously sold on E-Bay. I tried to copy it to this post, but it won't work. I copied the pic from your post and compared it to the one in the auction.....they are not even close. Now, someone will ask.....which is the phony?? I have my opinion! Here is the PH in Nic's thread....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kadet Posted July 17, 2011 Share #7 Posted July 17, 2011 I like the engraving of the auction medals better than the one in the thread...just my opinion. The presence of the documents lends some credibility as well....it would be nice to know the background of this group. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nic Posted July 17, 2011 Share #8 Posted July 17, 2011 JS, The photo you posted is of Vic's PH. The one that was on E-Bay awhile back is this one: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack's Son Posted July 17, 2011 Share #9 Posted July 17, 2011 JS, The photo you posted is of Vic's PH. The one that was on E-Bay awhile back is this one: YES ! Here is the one from Vic's thread...Again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack's Son Posted July 17, 2011 Share #10 Posted July 17, 2011 Nic, After comparing the different pictures,....... Ebay Auction, Neateauction, and Vic's thread,........We have 3 different Hearts! Take a look and let me know if you agree ?? :think: Vic's Heart.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack's Son Posted July 17, 2011 Share #11 Posted July 17, 2011 EBay Heart... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kadet Posted July 17, 2011 Share #12 Posted July 17, 2011 There are three different ones. The auction, the one in Vic's thread and the other in the thread identified as fake from Ebay. I think the one in the auction group is the original. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack's Son Posted July 17, 2011 Share #13 Posted July 17, 2011 There are three different ones. The auction, the one in Vic's thread and the other in the thread identified as fake from Ebay. I think the one in the auction group is the original. Thanks A.H. I thought I was going.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack's Son Posted July 17, 2011 Share #14 Posted July 17, 2011 I got all three......finally!! Neateauction.. Ebay... Vic's... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbo Posted July 17, 2011 Share #15 Posted July 17, 2011 Well, I have to say that the medals in the recent auction are the real thing. The BSM, the PH, American Legion Valor Medal, all the documents and the engraving. While not the neatest example of hand engraving I've seen, its the best of the three. I liked it enough to be a runner up on the auction but it went for more than I could muster in the end. Probably for the best!! Apparently he was KIA in the assault on Brecourt Manor and his demise was depicted in Band of Brothers. He was looking for the HQ when he stumbled on the assault. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matmil Posted July 18, 2011 Share #16 Posted July 18, 2011 Guys 4505 GBP is currently4,505.00 GBP = 7,257.51 USD where is the bronze star certificate. JS, you nailed it, three of the same, one horrible fake, the one Vic showed and the one in the auction? The buyer is a british collector/dealer that buys extremely hi and sells even higher, will probably end up on his site for 15k Matt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emaier3 Posted July 18, 2011 Share #17 Posted July 18, 2011 I believe that Andrew Hill was the trooper shot in the head crawling up to the position at Brecourt Manor in Band Of Brothers. The last group looks fine to me, and considering the popularity of the movie, unit and D-Day casuality, it does not surprise me that someone paid a premium for a Purple Heart group to someone actually shown in the Band of Brothers movie. I wish I had the money. ;-) Take care, Ed Maier www.tohonorourfallen.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wartimecollectables.com Posted July 18, 2011 Share #18 Posted July 18, 2011 Vic's medal is an 'out of the woodwork' find and no question on it being right. That said, I also bid on the group in Neate Auctions. Two guys? Duplicate award? Error? We'll probably never know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
custer1 Posted July 18, 2011 Share #19 Posted July 18, 2011 Interesting situation and discussion. The Neateauction group appears to have authentic certificates and other "neat" attributes such as the Am Legion Valor Medal and campaign medals. But (as Matt points out), why no BSM certificate? Another stand out oddity there is the EAME medal with a silver star and one bronze star. 6 campaign credits? Given this guy's service, he would/should have one arrowhead and one bronze campaign star, correct? Also, I have seen at least two posthumous WWII PH/BSM groups for men killed in their first combat action that included a CIB (in addition to the certificates and usual papers). Why the 82nd Airborne patch? Does anyone know what the "award criteria" is for that American Legion Valor Medal? Lots of questions for a $7k+ USD group. JimB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vicjoy1945 Posted July 18, 2011 Share #20 Posted July 18, 2011 Hey Guys ! Just found this thread. WOW...I wasn't on-line this weekend and look what i found this A.M. Very interesting turn of events !! I'm very confident on the Andrew F. Hill PH in my collection as its a "woodwork" find (courtesy of Wartime Collectables) and discovered well before the Band of Brothers craze that gripped the collecting (and non-collecting) community after the release of the mini-series. I know Gary Neate and he's a stand-up guy as well. At first glance, I actually like the Neate Andrew F. Hill grouping. The engraving looks "good" on first glance and the documents appear to be original. I think the campaigns have been added but lets face it your not buying this grouping for the campaigns. The BS and PH (more on this PH below) look "legit." As for the ebay "fake" Hill PH...I had my doubts on whether it was actually fake at the time as I was in contact with the ebay seller and he supposedy had a Bronze Star and some original documents to support the medals INCLUDING, in his words, a "Harry Truman certificate" !! None of this material ever made its way to ebay at the time. Note that the Neate grouping has a Harry Truman accolade. I think the Neate grouping is the very same grouping !! However, the engraving on the Neate Hill PH does appears to be different than the one that was listed on ebay. This is very, very disconcerting to me. So...either there were two PHs in that grouping or the one in Gary's was added by someone else or maybe we just need a better image of the PH. In addition, the Neate Hill grouping would appear to be a post-war issued medal & document grouping. One would tend to think that a Roosevelt accolade would have been issued to Hill's NOK given the date of his death !! I tried blowing up the image on the Neate PH certificate and it appears that the date is from 1947. Possibly this grouping was issued to say his parents at their request after the war !?! I believe WOJR Hill was married and his listed NOK was probably his wife !! His wife would have received the original engraved BS & PH and documents in probably late 1944...this means the accolade issued at that time would have been a Roosevelt Accolade..NOT a Truman accolade !! This scenario is entirely possible as I have another D-Day grouping to a tanker that consist of two posthumously issued PHs where one is hand engraved and the other is script engraved. This was a case where the wife was completely estanged from the parents of this gallant soldier. There was a series of letters back and forth between his mother and the government regarding this unfortunate situation in his IDPF file. Also, both of these PHs came straight out of two different houses in my neighborhood !! I posted this grouping on the forum awhile back and here's link to that PH pair. http://www.usmilitariaforum.com/forums/ind...416&hl=figg Below is a pic of the pair... It would appears there are no absolutes in collecting !! Whatchya guys think !?! Vic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matmil Posted July 18, 2011 Share #21 Posted July 18, 2011 Vic: Excellent insight in to this group that you have provided. I suppose it is possible. I suppose it is also possible that the Andrew F. Hill from Washington County State of Texas that enlisted in Texas ?, may have been wounded and received such a purple heart ? Here is an image that may be a bit larger. Matt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack's Son Posted July 18, 2011 Share #22 Posted July 18, 2011 Vic, I agree, you can feel good about your Heart......but what about these other two! Someone will send a lot of money for the "wrong person's" Heart, or a late replacement or fraud! :crying: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JDK Posted July 18, 2011 Share #23 Posted July 18, 2011 There's too many questions to be confident in any one of them really. The extras in the auction group tend to lend a little more credibility to that heart, but I wouldn't have wanted to spend that much on the auction group with all these other hearts floating around! Just my opinion on it! JD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KASTAUFFER Posted July 20, 2011 Share #24 Posted July 20, 2011 I have seen quite a few groups to KIA with multiple officially named PHs. There are a number of reasons this happens.... multiple family members, updated "dates of death" based on new info, ETC. Based on the fact the group has a Truman Accolade, I would guess its a re-issue. He could have been MIA and his date of death was changed based on new information too. I have a group with 2 accolades and both have different dates on them. Kurt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack's Son Posted July 20, 2011 Share #25 Posted July 20, 2011 Kurt, I believe that most of us think that the multiple Hearts water down the value of this group, and that it will be impossible to know if all or any one of these Hearts are Authentic. What do you think of the price tag vs. the quality of the group ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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