Some recent Air Force patch finds.

[irish]

Here are 4 recent patch finds. Actually all of them came together. These are all likely Thai made from the late Viet War era. The 8th TFW is easy enough to recognize. The 601st Photo Flight is unknown to me. The large crew patch appears to possibly be a Refueling unit based on what looks like a boom at the rear tail section. The last patch, Hanoi Bombers is a novelty piece I am guessing. Any addtional information on the 601st Photo Flight and the Large Crew E-162 patch will be greatly appreciated. Best

 

[all-bull]

Those are great patches. Can't give you any history on the photo Sqdrn, but if you want to part with the big patch, let me know. Once again, nice Thai mades.

[Bluehawk]

601st Photo Flight:

 

http://home.earthlink.net/~combatphoto/601st001.htm

[irish]

Thanks Bluehawk, great link. I also see a connection to the 8th TFW.

[Bluehawk]

I found a variant of that Hanoi Buff patch at this link:

http://www.usafpatches.com/gallery/thumbna...=238&page=4

I believe they'd value you submitting yours to their generics gallery too...

[Bluehawk]

More on possible link to Mig Killer Buffs:

http://www.strategic-air-command.com/patch...ery-solved1.htm

 

B-52 MIG Killers -

"Obviously used during Viet Nam, but by who?

Les Robbins wrote, "Can't give you the specifics (sorry 'bout that) but I can provide some general information about two of the patches. The MiG Killer B-52D had to do with the D model B-52 gunners shooting down attacking MiGs during the Linebacker campaign to Hanoi and other parts of North VietNam (the bombing that finally brought NVN to the peace table for good. The D model gunners were still in the tail section of their B-52 and had a good visual on any attacking MiGs as well as on SAMs that were fired at them. The other model B-52 in that campaign (1972) was either the G or H model, and the gunners sat forward with the rest of the crew. He had a high resolution TV system to see who or what was attacking. Essentially he did not have nearly as good a view of incoming missiles or enemy aircraft. (Most of the 15 B-52s that were shot down were not the D models, because the rear direct looking gunner had excellent visuals. The gunners shot down some of the MiGs, so that is probably the source of the patch."

[Bluehawk]

Maybe your Buff patch could somehow be related to the units to which these two Mig Killers were assigned? I don't know this minute if these were the only 2 confirmed in a B-52 or not, there were other so-called Mig Killers in AF and Navy fighter squadrons looks like. But, seems possible to me that whichever squadron those Buffs were in might also have generated that Hanoi patch you have.

 

Link see:

http://airwarvietnam.com/migkills.htm

 

Air Force

 

B-52 "Gunner"

 

Mig Killers

 

SSgt Samuel O. Turner Mig-21 B-52 #6676 Call Sign – Brown 3

 

On 18 December 1972 near Hanoi , North Vietnam SSgt Turner, a B-52 Fire Control Operator (Gunner), shot down a MIG-21. For his action the 30 year old Atlanta , Georgia native was awarded the Silver Star. Turner retired from the Air Force with the rank of MSgt. He passed away 12 April 1985 as the result of an illness.

 

AIC Albert E. Moore MIG-21 B-52 #5083 Call Sign – Ruby 03

 

On 24 December 1972 near the Thai Nguyen railroad yards, North Vietnam. Moore, a B-52 Fire Control Operator (Gunner), shot down a MIG-21.

[irish]

Great info Bluehawk.

[irish]

Bluehawk, If you would like to submit the patch the usafpatches website go on ahead. Can you work off the photo posted? or do we need a better shot. Best John

[Bluehawk]

Bluehawk, If you would like to submit the patch the usafpatches website go on ahead. Can you work off the photo posted? or do we need a better shot. Best John

Thanks...

 

We'd need to have it in a jpeg by itself.

 

I'll submit it in your name if you'd rather not. They'll want to know who owns it.

 

I wish so much that Bob of Vintage Productions or Teamski would take a gander at that Hanoi patch... having a solid ID will help, but I can submit it as an unknown and ask for an ID I guess. If we know beforehand though, then it will just go straight into the gallery when verified.

[irish]

Thanks...

 

We'd need to have it in a jpeg by itself.

 

I'll submit it in your name if you'd rather not. They'll want to know who owns it.

 

 

OK, where would you like it sent?

[Bluehawk]

OK, where would you like it sent?

You can post it here, I'll just drag it off to my desktop and post it over there from that.

 

Thanks

[irish]

Bluehawk, here is a better photo. Best John Kelly

 

[Bluehawk]

Bluehawk, here is a better photo. Best John Kelly

 

Perfect.

 

I'll pass that along in your name.

 

I'm sure somebody will know exactly what it is and where it came from and when.

 

I think we're close, but not there yet.

 

Thanks

[Bluehawk]

Here's the link to my query:

 

http://www.usafpatches.com/forum/index.php...g41338#msg41338

 

Wish us luck... good people there, if anybody knows, they will.

[ikar]

Here's some shots of U-Tapao in 1972. The visiting bombers were "G" models.

 

One night on patrol I had the occasion to run into one of the tail gunners who shot down a mig and he told me how it happened. There were only two gunners who accomplished this that I know of and they were both at U-Tapao.

[skio]

AIC Albert E. Moore MIG-21 kill On 24 December 1972 was in a B-52D belonging to the 7th Bomb Wing out of U-Tapao.

 

SSgt Samuel O. Turner MIG-21 kill on 18 December in 1972 may have belonged to the 96th BW at the time.

 

I can't find my MIG Kill book to see what info it has but will keep looking.

 

On the large crew patch, it is a refueler. A KC-135 by the looks of it.

 

I saw where you got these all together but did they come from the vet who owned them? If so, he would know these answers.

[Randy]

I don't think your B-52 patch has anything to do with MiG kills. The BUFF is dropping its load on the red star, which represents Hanoi, and the lines above the star are the Red River. Look on a map and you'll see Hanoi is situated just like that with the river.

Randy

[Bluehawk]

I don't think your B-52 patch has anything to do with MiG kills. The BUFF is dropping its load on the red star, which represents Hanoi, and the lines above the star are the Red River. Look on a map and you'll see Hanoi is situated just like that with the river.

Randy

Certainly not "Mig Killer", but the remarkable similarity in design between the two patches truly suggests (to me anyhow) some sort of close relationship between them as to identifying the unit one or both originated from.

 

Maybe ikar hit it that the unit came from U-Tapao for a time?

 

If so, then these are some of the AF units TDY there:

 

3rd Air Division

4258th Strategic Wing (SAC)

8th Air Force

307th Strategic Wing (SAC)

17th Air Division (Provisional)

307th Strategic Wing (SAC)

310th Strategic Wing (Provisional)

635th Combat Support Group (PACAF)

1985th Communications Squadron

11th USAF Hospital, Det. 12

38th Aerospace Rescue and Recovery Squadron, Det. VP-46

[Randy]

The inset patch on the MiG Killer patch is the official insignia of the River Rats. That has the same design as it represents the same things as I posted above. Check out their website for more info on the Rats patch. BTW, my dad was a BUFF Gunner with 486 total missions, 26 North and all the Linebacker II ones. He's told me several times that there were crews from over a dozen bomb squadrons at U-Tapao in December of 72, so tracking this one down to a unit could be a problem.

Randy

[Bluehawk]

One contributor on USAFpatches referred to the Hanoi patch as being a "recent re-make" - which it may indeed be.

 

My question is, a recent re-make of what unit's patch?

 

And secondarily, does anyone believe as I do that the two patches involved are directly related?

[Bluehawk]

The inset patch on the MiG Killer patch is the official insignia of the River Rats. That has the same design as it represents the same things as I posted above. Check out their website for more info on the Rats patch. BTW, my dad was a BUFF Gunner with 486 total missions, 26 North and all the Linebacker II ones. He's told me several times that there were crews from over a dozen bomb squadrons at U-Tapao in December of 72, so tracking this one down to a unit could be a problem.

Randy

Thank you for that, very much. It helps...

 

Surely somebody out there will remember the two patches. My thinking may be skewed, but since that other variant (if that's what it is) did mention MIG Killers (of which some say there were only two), I was hoping it might help narrow the unit down - possibly an impossible quest.

 

I got to this link for River Rats, but did not notice the inset:

http://palletmastersworkshop.com/patrol.html

[Randy]

Try this one: http://www.river-rats.org/index.php

Randy

[Bluehawk]

Try this one: http://www.river-rats.org/index.php

Randy

Aha... I see now what you were referring to.

 

Thanks for giving this some thought.

 

The patch may just be one of those unknowably unkowns.

 

I'll keep searching...

[Bluehawk]

Still on it, and maybe homing in on something.

 

One collector said this:

 

"The last time I was in the DFW area I saw a guy at an antique mart with several of these. I just felt it to good to be true that he would have several of the same Vietnam era B-52 patches. Bottom line is that I am not 100% sure if it is re-make or not... "

 

It could bode well.

 

Another collector suggested that it may be related to the 307th Strategic Wing which was stationed at U-Tapao from 1970-75; I believe. I did get a good confirmation that the 307th was indeed associated there.

 

Why am I still on this?

 

I have no idea, except that it fascinates me when patches like this one show up. There has got to be some kind of an explanation as to why your patch and the MIG Killer version are so similar, and then who made it for whom and when.