ID help Vietnam Avn. insignia

[khaki1941]

Hi Guys!

 

Just picked up this piece for the collection, and it's driving me nuts!

I've seen it somewhere before, but can't remember which reference.

 

I don't many more hairs to pull out, so any help may save me from going totally bald!

 

Thanks,

Howard

[khaki1941]

Anyone have any information?

 

HK

[gwb123]

I'd love to tell you that I have a positive ID on the patch, but I don't. And that is after going through all of my Army Aviation books. And I would like to say I have seen this or something very close to it before as well...

 

Obviously it is a Service Platoon for a Cobra unit. But therein lies the problem.. while we have books and reference books full of insignia for hard charging Air Cav troops and squadrons, patches for their support personnel are less likely to documented.

 

And keep in mind these are not for a company, but a platoon size unit. That makes them limited to a group of about 45 people as opposed to a patch worn by the full company. And sometimes you find them for even smaller groups, like the Avionics section, Armament, etc.

 

To my eye, this looks Korean made. I am guessing it was made by hand guided sewing machine. Patches like this were made up on a whim, and may have had a very brief tenure.

 

If you get a chance please post a photo of the back.

[khaki1941]

Hello Gil,

 

Thanks for the comments. Your so correct the Service units don't get much attention.

 

It's Vietnam machine made. "Cheap Charlie" construction. I'll post a photo of the reverse ASAP.

 

Regards,

Howard

[KurtA]

The uneven stitching of the black border suggest VN made to me. I always look for that in a machine embroidered on twill VN patch (makes me more confident it's original).

Kurt

[vintageproductions]

Howard- I have been racking my brain on this one. I know I have had it a couple of times in the past, but can't remember the exact id on it. Did you ask Conway?

[khaki1941]

Howard- I have been racking my brain on this one. I know I have had it a couple of times in the past, but can't remember the exact id on it. Did you ask Conway?

 

Hi Bob,

 

Yes, I did send photos to Conway. He didn't know what it was.

 

It's driving me nuts also. The "unknown" service platoon!

 

Thanks,

Howard

[khaki1941]

Reverse of insignia.

 

Howard

[gwb123]

As always, we learn so much from the back of the patch!

 

Just taking one more opportunity to confirm what you already know... that backing material surely does look like that used by the famous "Cheap Charlie" of Saigon fame.

 

I thought that might offer a clue, so I pulled out my old Ray Morrone sales lists. For those readers not familiar with Ray Marrone, he was one of a handful of collectors who actually served in Vietnam. He, and others, bought up patches from the local shops over there, and even had some second runs made. These were then sold in the USA for the astounding price of $1 each.

 

In any case, I went back and forth over his lists looking for "Service Platoon" seeing if it might offer a clue as to the unit identity.

 

Surprisingly, for all of the "Service Platoons" serving in Vietnam, this was only used on one patch on his list, which did not match this design (1st Avn Bn, Co A, which according to ASMIC features a bulldog holding a wrench in its mouth.)

 

Instead, most of the aviation maintenance units that were on the list went with clever logos such as "Sword Sharpeners", "Hanger Rats", "Dry Dock" etc. So for now, we are stuck!

[khaki1941]

Thanks Gil!

 

Any chance of obtaining a copy of the Ray Morrone sales list? Seems like it would be an excellent reference.

 

I'm sure that there are some of his and "others", patches in my collection.

 

Regards,

Howard

[gwb123]

Thanks Gil!

 

Any chance of obtaining a copy of the Ray Morrone sales list? Seems like it would be an excellent reference.

 

I'm sure that there are some of his and "others", patches in my collection.

 

Regards,

Howard

 

I'll look and see if I have a spare copy. Otherwise it may be awhile before I can get to a copier.

 

I am sure that many collections are graced by Ray Marrone's patches. On the positive side, many of them were made in the same shops as the originals. But he and his cohorts were not above having one shop make the patches of another. Sometimes design details and lettering got lost in the process. However many of the patch designs from the Vietnam War would have been lost to history if they had not been duplicated by these enterprising collectors.

[vintageproductions]

Howard-If Gil can't find copies I can make you some after my show in Pomona next week. I have about three years worth of Marrone's, Richard Smith's, and some of Cecil's. I also have a set of photos that Cecil used to send to collectors, you circled what you wanted and sent the images back. A few weeks later you received a package of patches from Cecil. Some of the photos I let Jason Hardy & Mike Tucker use in their SOG book.

Bob

[gwb123]

Howard-If Gil can't find copies I can make you some after my show in Pomona next week. I have about three years worth of Marrone's, Richard Smith's, and some of Cecil's. I also have a set of photos that Cecil used to send to collectors, you circled what you wanted and sent the images back. A few weeks later you received a package of patches from Cecil. Some of the photos I let Jason Hardy & Mike Tucker use in their SOG book.

Bob

 

Bob, If you end up making copies of those, please make a set for me as well. I have two or three of Marrone's and one of Smiths. I have never seen the photos that you mentioned from Cecil. I would love to get a set of those.

 

Also, I think awhile back you mentioned you had some of Tom Clinton's stuff. If this included Vietnam era stuff, I'd like to get hold of some of those as well.

 

I do have a couple Al Mendez lists if anyone needs those.

 

Happy to reimburse for postage and printing. Thanks!