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New Army uniform changes possibly in the works


MattS
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How many times have we all heard soldiers say: "Bring back the BDU". What are the guys in Washington not hearing?

Not hearing is what the guys in Washington do best."

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The ACU is a crappy uniform. It fits baggier than a maternity BDU, it's velcro doesn't hold great and looks awful, the zipper looks uncomfortable, the no sleeve rolling policy is horrible, and the pattern doesn't blend into jack. The beret sticks out like a sore thumb next to any other serivce, besides the USAF Security Forces and Red Horse, and isn't subdued (the beret flash catches my eye all the time when I'm driving next to a soldier in traffic.) The patrol cap is practical, fits comfortable, looks sharp, can be rolled up and put in the pocket need be, and does keep the sun out of my eyes. The marines are lucky to have advanced BDU technology IE the MCCUU. It looks sharp, has pockets on the sleeves without velcro, sleeves look sharp has always rolled up, looks good even if it is wash and wear, and most importantly, it appears to fit somehat like the BDU.

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I agree, the Marines came out on top at the end of the post-BDU uniform battle. Interestingly, I saw an army recruiter set up with a Humvee at a local car show and he was wearing a complete Multicam uniform as if to say, "Look kids, not all the army's uniforms suck!" :lol:

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Sometimes I get tired of Army guys bitching about uniforms. I can't afford this or I can't afford that, I shouldn't have to pay for this, I can't believe the Army is making me buy that. Then out of the other side of their mouths, "I want to go back to the days of creases and shinola shined boots :blink: Are you forking kidding me???

When we had temperate weight BDU's, the whining and complaining was that the material was to heavy and hot, so we came out with the summer weights. "I hate these things, the crotches rip out of them to easy" "They fade, they don't last", exact same complaints as the ACU.

I have had the unique opportunity to talk to uniform developers and do y'all know that the ACU design, not talking the velcro, was completely Soldier driven. The ACU was exactly what Soldiers asked for during these uniform boards that have been held. They wanted slant pockets, bellowed backs, slanted side trouser pockets. All of the ergonomics are soldier driven. When the recommendation to beef the crotches up was made and done in experiments, the soldiers complained because there was too much material in the crotch and they didn't want it. The ACU is designed to last six months of rotated service in combat, that is it. The Multi-cam is the same, six months. What happens, Joe gets four sets and typically rotates two and then bitches because in a few months, that uniform is wore out. Who here can remember the says of dots and no dots on their combat boots so that you evenly wore your boots, maybe we need to go back to holding peoples hands again.

As for the velcro on the uniforms, I get really tired of the lame excuses of the velcro being tactically unsound. Fist, velcro has been in the inventory for over 50 years now and it is here to stay. Secondly, if you are ripping pockets open when you are laying in wait in an ambush, you need to be beat severely. Guys will bitch about the pockets being velcroed yet, you don't hear a single complaint about tactical vest ammunition pockets being velcro'd, make Joe go back to the old style clips and they would have a meltdown.

The reason for velcro so so that in environments where you don't have established laundry, you can take your patches off, turn your uniforms in, step over to the clean pile and pick up a uniform your size, put your patches on and walk away without having to wait a couple days. Does that happen, not really, but the concept has worked when Soldiers needs uniforms after having their uniforms destroyed.

I'm not defending the ACU, I hate the pattern like everyone else, but the newer FRACU's have had a color shift and they are no longer the blue uniforms they used to be and they now blend in pretty well in a desert environment. I have pictures of soldiers with the new FRACU's and a MC pack on and there really isn't much difference at a given distance.

As for the Marine MARPAT, everyone always seems to laud the Marines for getting it right. I have hauled a lot of Marines by helicopter and I will tell you that their uniforms after a few washings look like cook whites. Under NVG's, they stand out worse than ACU's, they literally look like ghosts. To top it off, putting the coyote brown over their cook whites is a complete defeat of camoflage tactics.

I vote to stay with the ACU pattern, get rid of the mandarin collar, pixelate the MC colors and call it good, but then again, I woke up on the wrong side of the bed, didn't take my Naproxen last night and my legs hurt, so I'm posting out of pain and am probably full of shinola.

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Gee Steve, how do you really feel? ;) Besides, enlisted guys (below E-4 or so) have to bitch about something, it's what they do. Always been that way as far as I know. Plus, I seem to recall getting a 'clothing allotment' once a year to buy new uniforms, but it seems rare that the money ever went towards that.

I agree the slanted, bellowed pockets are great. I do remember the dot/no-dot boots, but only in basic. I can't imagine what recruits do with their time when they don't have to press uniforms or shine boots though. Of course, when I went to basic we had steel pots and M-16A1s.

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Good, you Americans could never wear berets properly anyway :hapy0004:

 

Personally, I take that as a compliment. I like the way ours look compared to the limp, floppy wool rag of many of the others. Same as the Israeli way. It has a very distinct look that says we don't give a ratz azz what the rest think of us. :thumbsup:

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Finally!

 

Sew on Name/Branchtapes, Sew on Skill/Combat Badges

 

Beret ditched for ACU, Patrol cap back for everyday wear

 

SOURCE:

http://www.army.mil/article/59441/ACU_chan...fault_headgear/

 

Most important statement in that link is the last sentence: "Implementation dates for the announced changes have not yet been decided. Soldiers should wait for direction from their commands before implementing any uniform changes."

 

Linedoggie, thanks for posting the link!

 

Steve

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Hawkdriver, I fully agree with you on that.

 

Thanks for the back-up, was beginning to think that i was pejorative on this issue having disparaged the Marine's uniform.

 

MattS: Actually had more to say, but I was getting the evil eye from the wife for being late to church.

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When I was in the recruiting office signing up today they got an email about this. You can sew on a unit patch and wearing of the beret is at the discretion of your commanding officer(?). Or something along those lines.

 

-Matt.

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VolunteerArmoury
When I was in the recruiting office signing up today they got an email about this. You can sew on a unit patch and wearing of the beret is at the discretion of your commanding officer(?). Or something along those lines.

 

-Matt.

 

We will still have velcro unit insignia and flags.

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We will still have velcro unit insignia and flags.

 

I didn't catch all of what they were saying but he did say some things would still be velcro. I didn't catch exactly what though.

 

-Matt.

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http://www.foxnews.com/us/2011/06/14/us-ar...for-patrol-cap/

 

"The decision does not affect units that have long worn berets as a mark of distinction, including the Rangers' black beret, Army special forces' green beret and Airborne's maroon version."

 

I'm confused. Does this last statement mean that the Rangers will revert to the black beret? The latest announcement seems to be that the black beret will still be worn by everyone other than the elite units, but only with the Class-A's and not the ACU. Or is the beret being abandoned altogether except for Rangers, Special Forces and Airborne?

 

Also, as an insignia collector, I'm looking forward to all of the theater made skill badges on ACU material that are going to start popping up now that they can be sewn on.

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Looks like the text of the link from Army.mil has changed: "The announced changes take place June 14. Soldiers should read Army Directive 2011-11 for full details." Army Directive 2011-11 is dated 13 JUN 11. My copy in .pdf is 246kb - 150kb is the Forum's upload limit.

 

Hawk, you hit the nail on the head with your opinion!

 

Steve

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Hawk, you hit the nail on the head with your opinion!

 

Thanks, but I did make one flaw in my statement. I said that Joe gets issued four sets of uniforms and only rotates two. I was wrong. What happens, especially with the new Multi-cam, he wears two and then sells the other two sets to collectors at a much exagerated price :w00t:

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Looks like the text of the link from Army.mil has changed: "The announced changes take place June 14. Soldiers should read Army Directive 2011-11 for full details." Army Directive 2011-11 is dated 13 JUN 11. My copy in .pdf is 246kb - 150kb is the Forum's upload limit.

 

Here's the PDF and below screen shots of the pages: Army_Combat_Uniform.pdf

 

beret1.jpg

 

beret2.jpg

 

beret3.jpg

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Cobrahistorian

I just pulled the velcro off the back of my patrol cap last night and sewed my name strip on. Much nicer.

 

I don't think the cut of the ACU is a bad design, far from it. I just think that the excessive amount of velcro needed to be reduced, and thankfully it is being done. I just want button cuffs on my sleeves now!

 

Jon

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"The decision does not affect units that have long worn berets as a mark of distinction, including the Rangers' black beret, Army special forces' green beret and Airborne's maroon version."

 

I'm confused. Does this last statement mean that the Rangers will revert to the black beret?

 

 

No, it simply means they copied another news outlets article, which was wrong to begin with. Besides the line you mention, the starting sentence is bogus as well. The Army is not abandoning the beret, simply reserving it for more formal/semi-formal occasions. Another case of the media getting things wrong, and not researching the matter properly.

 

 

 

BTW, am glad for you guys still serving that "they" finally came to some common sense. No more bacon strips for tapes, and no more stupid subdued badges that you constantly have to touch up with flat black to fix the shine, and wear on them. Or buying new ones all the time.

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I am dumbfounded that this issue went from research findings, to reporting to ACoS, to implementation, to change in regulation AR 670-1 in less than 6 weeks! It took years for the beret to become standardized headgear and a few weeks for it to be replaced. Amazing.

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According to the new directive copied above, in addition to the Drill Sergeant identification badge, the Tomb Of The Unknown Soldier guards badge and Recruiter badges will be authorized as subdued sew-on badges for the ACU. Were these ever authorized to be sewn on the BDU or olive green utilities?

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I know DIs wore their shields, and I seem to recall seeing NCOs wearing Recruiter shields on the pocket of their BDUs, not sure about the Tomb of the Unknown though. My Drill Sergeants in basic, D/S Yates and D/S Glover.

post-32676-1308082585.jpg

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