Blouse Sniper ETO 1944

[RandallClan]

British made for American, no doubt about that.

 

No odd phenomonen that.. M1928 pack systems, canteen covers, aid pouches, belts, ammo bags, in fact pretty much all web gear was British made for US as well as the heavy wool ETO jackets and rare matching trousers.

 

These sniper suits were just one more thing..

 

As well as British made for US, US troops, particularly USAAF also utilised British made for British battledress, boots and other such items particularly in North Africa and amongst the 8th and 9th Air force.

 

The use of British Flight kit by USAAF is a topic on its own.

 

 

"pretty much all web gear was British made for US"

 

You mean to say US made for the British? I haven't seen any of the items you listed "M1928 pack systems, canteen covers, aid pouches, belts, ammo bags, ... as well as the heavy wool ETO jackets and rare matching trousers" that were English made using patterns that were for American service members. Everything that I have ever come across was American products and even those with the Arrow for English has been on American companies products. As I am aware the English during WWI as well had a heck of a time producing enough items for themselves so many things were produced over here for use in England. As an example the Thompson Sub machine gun (WWII) as well as in WWI the Model 1917 Enfield (in .303 British)

 

 

 

*Edit - I am not saying that it is not impossible to find the items listed above made in England, but certainly in no way were most items made in England

[deros]

No I don't mean US made for British at all.

 

Lots of US made for British gear was made, most of it bearing a unique hybrid label made to mirror British practice at the time. Notable for me is the battledress WA which is a hybrid of 37/40 pattern BD in a wool most resembling US blanket wool. This enjoyed wide issue but seems to have mostly been used by commonwealth (predominantly British) troops in Italy.

 

However, British made stuff for US was very significant. thousands upon thousands of pieces were comissioned.

The canvas used was more of a pea green than US OD3 or 7, metal fittings were painted rather than blued and british brass snaps were often used in place of the 'durable' lift the dot. where spring fastenings were used on US made stuff, a kind of pigs tail bent wire was used on british made which served the same purpose.

Where items were all web rather than web and canvas, the canvas was more coarsely woven. Identical, not surprisingly, to brit 37 pattern.

 

In case you misunderstood me I am not intimating that the US relied on the British for their webbing manufacture :think: , rather that if it was produced by the US, there was a British made equivalent for supply indiscriminately to US troops (unless the item was too obscure for large scale production.) Such items are invariably stamped US but also 'British made'

[deros]

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/U-S-ARMY-FIRST-AID-P...=item3cb50d9652

 

 

 

http://cgi.ebay.com/Original-1944-British-...=item230d8a26ad

 

 

looking for a suitable image of a doughboy pack as there are most strikingly different

 

 

 

http://www.stewartsmilitaryantiques.com/di...860f2aecaba2610

 

(edit)

[bravo_2_zero]

This turned up in the mail today.

 

It's been worn and i would say for military usage too, dirt on the chest green side, dirt on the elbows down the the cuffs. It looks like it has seen worn in a typical 'sniping' position. This i guess would was out but there is no way i am.

 

There is no fade to it from sun or wearing

 

There is a small brown cardboard tag under the collar held with steel staples which has been torn out but still bits remain.

 

The white tag is hidden under the right green side pocket flap. There is also an inked WD /l\ next to it as found on British equipment but it's very faint.

 

The material is twill on green side and a poplin on the brown side

 

No holes, tears or anything but a few loose threads on the green side pockets under the pocket flaps.

 

The brown print in places has discoloured the green side and had bled through.

 

I would say it's been used for what it was made for but who knows where and when.

[kammo-man]

First off , great hit , this thing is as real as can be .

 

I have been talking long and hard all weekend to a VERY advanced collector and he got his first one 30 years ago , we looked at this and said its the same , he is an English collector .

Now we also thought the English company SASS did a knock off of this once , these guys were poping a great tiger and a beogam pattern in the 80s , so WW2 also came to include the holy grail English AM Officers Dennisons.

However this one is a WW2 British made item from a company with a proven track record making camouflage items such as the Windproof suits and maybee the Dennison , I need to check the WAF as there is a very concise record posted in the Dennison section.

 

I honestly think the British manufacturer may have taken an artistic approach with the labeling as this item was being made in the US with a different label .....but the same cut .

Although ...this label makes it a unique item in the whole Lend lease system and one worthy of owning in the very simple Allied camouflage effort when considering the German break through advances by this period in night sights , carbon prints .....something not seen until the 1981 Woodland !!!!

 

Well done mate .

 

owen

[bravo_2_zero]

Sorry to drag this up but just had an email for the curator of the Imperial war museum in London

Dear Sir, We have both jacket and trousers in the collection of similar designand the jacket can be seen in the attached image: When I received ours, I catalogued it thus: UNI 12188 Jacket, sniper's (camouflaged, reversible): US Army 1944 Description:Single-breasted double-sided camouflage printed jacket. The jacketfeatures a pair of deep chest pockets, secured by straight flaps withbuttons. The cuffs can be adjusted to be tightened over the wearer'swrists by means of buttons.Inside, the pockets are repeated exactly, including all front fasteningbuttons, ensuring the jacket is fully reversible. All buttons are thestandard vegetable fibre style as used on British army clothing.The pattern of camouflage is of the same design as that used on theM1942 herringbone twill (HBT) suit, consisting of brown, light and darkgreen 'leaf' patterns on a mid-green field. One side of the garmentdisplays light summer green colours colours, while the reverse showsdarker tan autumnal shades all in the 'Duck Hunter' leaf pattern. Markings:Printed in black ink on white linen label. The label is sewn to theunderside of the flap of the right chest pocket: BLOUSE SUIT, SNIPERS U.S.A. E.T.O. Spec No. U/1440 SIZE 40R Denham (1333) Ltd. 1944 (broad arrow mark) Historical/Contextual Notes:Second World War period US Army sniper's jacket. The Americans firstexperimented with camouflage clothing with the introduction of aone-piece coverall issued to Marines in the Pacific. This garment provedunpopular as the men had virtually to undress when attending to personalablutions. Later a two-piece jacket and trousers were issued but theseitems were criticised as being impractical in jungle conditions, beinghighly visible during movement and therefore only useful to snipers whomaintained a more stationary post.In a limited issue, jacket and trouser combinations were issued to someUS troops during the Normandy campaign, but these stocks were withdrawnfollowing numerous instances of casualties through 'friendly fire' as USinfantry mistook their own 'camouflaged' men for Waffen-SS.The uniform is unusual in that it was made by a British contractor forissue to US personnel. For interest, the matching trousers are as follows: UNI 12189 Trousers, snipers (camouflage/reversible) US army 1944 Description:Pair of double-sided camouflage print trousers, featuring large deeppockets, one each thigh, secured by straight flaps and single buttons.The trousers have seven belt loops and are secured by a concealed fly.The pockets are repeated internally, permitting them to be fullyreversible. The pattern of camouflage is of the same pattern of thematching jacket, UNI 12188. Markings:Printed in black ink onto white linen label. Label is sewn to theunderside of the flap of the right inner pocket: TROUSERSSUIT, SNIPERSU.S.A., E.T.O. Spec No. U/1440SIZE 38x 33Denham (1933) Ltd.1944(broad arrow mark) As regards operational use, I cannot confirm anything other than suchuniforms DID exist. I hope that reply answers some of your questions. Yours sincerely Martin BoswellCurator Uniforms, Personal Equipment and Flags Imperial War MuseumCollections Enquiry Service

[kjones5452]

I'm glad you did bring it back up. It was very decent of him to take the time and send that.

[Cobrahistorian]

I passed up on a set of these at Ft. Indiantown Gap back in 1995 due to a shortage of funds. They wanted $200 for it then. I'm still kicking myself.

 

Awesome find, congratulations!

 

Jon

[kammo-man]

I just seen some pictures of FFL members wearing then in53 ish , so they were issued from either US or British supplies.

 

owen

[Beau-Brummel]

I just seen some pictures of FFL members wearing then in53 ish , so they were issued from either US or British supplies.

 

owen

 

No one has faked the AM smock yet.

[kammo-man]

SASS did an officers version with the full zip and cream colored knitted collar !

 

Though as I type am feeling somewhere in India or Hong kong one is being made ........know what I mean?

 

o.

[Beau-Brummel]

SASS did an officers version with the full zip and cream colored knitted collar !

 

Though as I type am feeling somewhere in India or Hong kong one is being made ........know what I mean?

 

o.

 

They did but It was heavy denim I seem to remember and the colours were horrible.

 

As to your second point, sadly you're probably right. Luckilly they are so rare It's unlikely they will find a real one to copy.

 

Yours, Guy.