Siberia AEF postcard

[Bob Hudson]

A local picker brought this to me a few days ago in a batch of photos and ephemera. I glanced at it and didn't get too excited until I looked more closely at the postmark and the red censor stamp. It is addressed someone in San Diego and written in what I presume to be Polish or Russian.

 

 

 

Here's a closeup of the front. You can tell this was a low-budget printing job:

 

[Bob Hudson]

 

 

Here's the AEF censor stamp:

 

 

The recipient looks like "Charles Slavrick" but couldn't find him in ancestry.com

 

[Andrei]

It is written in Czech. Probably a soldier of the Czech Legion writing to a relative in the USA.

[Bob Hudson]

It is written in Czech. Probably a soldier of the Czech Legion writing to a relative in the USA.

 

Thank you. It may even be a US soldier writing to a relative back home. In the early 20th century a lot of immigrants from Bohemia who would have used their native language.

 

Can you tell you what it says?

[Andrei]

No, I dont read Czech. I can ask a friend but I am sure that a Czech member will translate the writing for us anytime soon. :wink2:

[Bob Hudson]

No, I dont read Czech. I can ask a friend but I am sure that a Czech member will translate the writing for us anytime soon. :wink2:

 

merci....

[irish]

Great card. The U.S.Postal Agency Siberia marking is somewhat scarce. The Czech Legion got holed up in Russia after the revolution and had a tough time getting home. As a collector of military postal history I say nice piece.

[Bob Hudson]

Great card. The U.S.Postal Agency Siberia marking is somewhat scarce. The Czech Legion got holed up in Russia after the revolution and had a tough time getting home. As a collector of military postal history I say nice piece.

 

I was shocked when I saw what one non-ebay dealer was asking for postcards with that postmark and the AEF censor stamp.

[Dave]

Having had a large collection of Czech Legion stuff over the years, I would venture to bet that this was from a Czech Legion soldier as Andrei pointed out. As the Czechs were waiting for the ships (several provided by the US) to take them back across to the other side of the world, they had close contact with the international contingent in and about Vladivostok. I have since sold them, but I had quite a few photos of Czech Legion soldiers socializing with soldiers from the US, Japan, France, Britain and others - quite an interesting composition of uniforms, to say the least! Unfortunately, I cannot read Czech (bad for a Czech Legion collector, I'll admit) but it appears that he's mentioning a ship name in the text...it would be interesting to be translated to see what exactly he's talking about.

 

Dave

[BEAST]

Don't know what the Czech portion reads, but the Russian at the bottom is something along the lines of "taking a break in the woods".

[Terry K.]

Hi All,

Nice card! One doesn't see much of anything from that action. I screwed up once and got a uniform from the US unit that was there at a garage sale for $15 and sold it, sure wish I hadn't. I think the collar disc read 332 or 336, something like that, I looked up and it was correct down to the guys name in the coat, he was listed in the Co. rolls.

Terry

[Bob Hudson]

Having had a large collection of Czech Legion stuff over the years, I would venture to bet that this was from a Czech Legion soldier as Andrei pointed out. As the Czechs were waiting for the ships (several provided by the US) to take them back across to the other side of the world, they had close contact with the international contingent in and about Vladivostok.

 

I had wondered why a Czech Legion soldier would be using the US forces postal system. I guess that if someone could read the message it might tell me if this was a Czech Legion soldier or a Bohemian-born American soldier.

[Dave]

I had wondered why a Czech Legion soldier would be using the US forces postal system. I guess that if someone could read the message it might tell me if this was a Czech Legion soldier or a Bohemian-born American soldier.

 

Actually, they all associated with each other and chances are, if he had a relative in the US, he may have known English. And, having a relative in the US, they probably allowed him to send the postcard via the US Mail. He didn't have many other choices...Japanese mail? British mail? Why not send something via US mail that's going to the US?

 

Lots of stories behind this card...just wish we knew what they were!

 

Dave

[BEAST]

I had wondered why a Czech Legion soldier would be using the US forces postal system. I guess that if someone could read the message it might tell me if this was a Czech Legion soldier or a Bohemian-born American soldier.

 

F.S. If you type the words into the google search, it will translate them for you. Don't know how accurate it is, but it's worth a try. I had the best luck when I preface it with the word translate.

[Andrei]

 

Czech Legion members in Washington, 1918. Captain Hurban is in the middle.

 

Leader of Czech Army in Capital

Capt. Hurban's Visit May Have Effect on Ally Plans.

 

Capt. Vladimir Hurban, citizen soldier, leader of the gallant Czecho-Slovak army which has amazed the world by its remarkable action in Siberia, is in Washington conferring with the officials here on the Russian problem.

 

"Slight of build, not more than 30 years old, Capt. Hurban came here unannounced to report to President Wilson, allied military officials and Dr. T.G. Masaryk, commander-in-chief of the Czecho-Slovak forces in Russia. ...

Washington Post, Aug 4, 1918

 

Vladimir Hurban was later the head Czech diplomat to the U.S. from 1936-1943 and the first Czech ambassador to the U.S. when they established an embassy in 1943.

[Bob Hudson]

Thanks for that: the Czech Legion and the US military has to be one of the lesser-know stories (even less well known than the fact the US sent troops to Siberia).

 

 

Czech Legion members in Washington, 1918. Captain Hurban is in the middle.

 

Leader of Czech Army in Capital

Capt. Hurban's Visit May Have Effect on Ally Plans.

 

Capt. Vladimir Hurban, citizen soldier, leader of the gallant Czecho-Slovak army which has amazed the world by its remarkable action in Siberia, is in Washington conferring with the officials here on the Russian problem.

 

"Slight of build, not more than 30 years old, Capt. Hurban came here unannounced to report to President Wilson, allied military officials and Dr. T.G. Masaryk, commander-in-chief of the Czecho-Slovak forces in Russia. ...

Washington Post, Aug 4, 1918

 

Vladimir Hurban was later the head Czech diplomat to the U.S. from 1936-1943 and the first Czech ambassador to the U.S. when they established an embassy in 1943.

[tom63]

This is not exactly a Siberia post card but the soldier who wrote it indicates that he is "leaving for Siberia soon" so may be AEF related. Notice that it is Post Marked Oct.14, 1919, just 11 days (and 12 hours) after the card above was posted. Looks like the guys name is Erich Kronsbein. Where can I research to see if he indeed ended up in Siberia or was just trying to impress the Red Cross gal!!

 

 

 

[Dave]

Thanks for that: the Czech Legion and the US military has to be one of the lesser-know stories (even less well known than the fact the US sent troops to Siberia).

 

That's how I got fascinated by them...40,000+ Czechs from all different manners of life (former POWs, former soldiers, etc...) all uniting to create an army without a country that eventually took over a significant part of Siberia! Had they not gotten tired, they could have probably laid claim to a large portion of the former Russian empire...just think what would have happened if they would have prevented the Soviets from taking over the former empire...a different world!

 

Dave

[Bob Hudson]

This is not exactly a Siberia post card but the soldier who wrote it indicates that he is "leaving for Siberia soon" so may be AEF related. Notice that it is Post Marked Oct.14, 1919, just 11 days (and 12 hours) after the card above was posted. Looks like the guys name is Erich Kronsbein. Where can I research to see if he indeed ended up in Siberia or was just trying to impress the Red Cross gal!!

 

I think there is some sort of searchable name index online.

 

Erich (also spelled Eroc) Kronsbein was born in Germany and stayed in the Army at least through 1920 when he was in the Philippines. He died young in 1951 and never married, so that postcard may be his entire legacy.

 

[Bob Hudson]

Okay to add some further intrigue to this: the picker who brought me the postcard, today showed up with some more WWI-era photographs and one of them has an ID on the back that seems to link it to the Siberian AEF postcard, written in Czech to someone in San Diego:

 

 

 

Well Camp Kearny is - or was - in San Diego (the site of Camp Kearny is now Marine Corps Air Station Miramar), and it turns out that in did in fact host part of Czech Legion. Here's an excerpt from a 1920 Congressional hearing on WWI expenditures:

 

Finally, these Czecho-Slovaks, many of them wounded—I think almost all of them wounded—most of them invalided men with one leg and men with no legs; men with one arm and men with no arms; men with one eye and men with no eyes: the men who were the shattered remnant of these heroic people were in Siberia, where they u~ere badly housed; the conditions were growing constantly worse; (he congestion which that produced tended to create diseased conditions which were a menace to our own soldiers and generally to the condition in Siberia. The ability to secure food for them was embarrassing. The question of medical and surgical assistanceto them n'as almost insoluble. The Red Cross, our own consular agent there, iincl Gen. Graves, who is in charge of our forces, all urged that provision be made for their repatriation. Every agency and the military and humanitarian authorities urged that these men be repatriatcd by being-brought from Vladivostok to Trieste. That question Whs brought up in Paris by representatives of the supreme war council and it was roughly decided as a part of our military duty the United States should assume responsibility for the repatriation of half of these 5,000 or 6,000 people. And the practical way to repatriate them was to bring them from Vladivostok to a port of the United States and allow them to go to France, as long as we had transports that were sailing on the eastbound trips practically unloaded, but that were loaded on the westbound trips, and it was thought that was a proper contribution in a military way for the United States to assume.

 

The matter was under discussion between the Shipping Board and the War Trade Board, and large correspondence passed between them. Most of this took place when I was in Europe, and when I came back I found it had been agreed that a thousand of them— substantially 1.000 or 1.200—should land near Camp Kearny, rest there after the trans-Pacific journey for a few days, until they recovered—and many of them are sick, as I stated—and then they could go on to Hampton Roads and then be sent on Army transports to a French port. The British authorities will transport the balance.

 

 

 

So I wonder, if the person in San Diego who received the postcard from Siberia, took this photo when the Czech Legion arrived in San Diego? I'm hoping that the next time this picker shows up he'll have something else related to this.

[Bob Hudson]

I've started a discussion at http://www.usmilitariaforum.com/forums/ind...showtopic=73604 on the US military mission to rescue the Czech Legion.

[Bob Hudson]

 

Czech Legion members in Washington, 1918. Captain Hurban is in the middle.

 

Leader of Czech Army in Capital

Capt. Hurban's Visit May Have Effect on Ally Plans.

 

Capt. Vladimir Hurban, citizen soldier, leader of the gallant Czecho-Slovak army which has amazed the world by its remarkable action in Siberia, is in Washington conferring with the officials here on the Russian problem.

 

"Slight of build, not more than 30 years old, Capt. Hurban came here unannounced to report to President Wilson, allied military officials and Dr. T.G. Masaryk, commander-in-chief of the Czecho-Slovak forces in Russia. ...

Washington Post, Aug 4, 1918

 

Vladimir Hurban was later the head Czech diplomat to the U.S. from 1936-1943 and the first Czech ambassador to the U.S. when they established an embassy in 1943.

 

I picked up two more original photos of Czech Legion officers and was wondering whether it's Capt. Vladimir Hurban in either of these photos? Since these came from the San Diego area, they may be from when the Legion was billeted at Camp Kearny. Has there been any other foreign army brought to and billeted on US soil?

 

 

[KASTAUFFER]

 

 

Here's the AEF censor stamp:

 

 

The recipient looks like "Charles Slavrick" but couldn't find him in ancestry.com

 

 

Very nice piece of postal history! I like it a lot!

 

Kurt

[Dave]

These are just super...to find postcards of the Czechs in San Diego...simply amazing! I'm really looking forward to seeing more of them if more come to light!!!

 

Dave

[Bob Hudson]

These are just super...to find postcards of the Czechs in San Diego...simply amazing! I'm really looking forward to seeing more of them if more come to light!!!

 

Dave

 

There was the one postcard, but the two of the officers are photographic prints. Something from this has been showing up every two weeks or so as this picker cleans out his storage unit, so who knows what else will be uncovered.