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INTERESTING UNIFORM, OPINIONS??


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#1 cpatrick

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Posted 18 May 2007 - 06:01 PM

As many of you know, most of my uniforms I purchase directly from primary sources, and such is the case here. This one came out of a house two days ago, and quite frankly, it has me puzzled. The man who I had purchased this from, said that this belonged to his brother, who was a WWII veteran, and a career soldier. He has his service cap as well, but needs to find it. The ribbon bars are all WWII, and I would expect to find some later ones on there, but there are none! The marksman badge is a WWII pin-back, as are the backs of the bars. The coat is dated 1963. (I think, I am still a little new at reading these later spec labels) I will let the pictures do the talking here, and see if you guys can come up with any ideas. It's unlikely that this is a put-together, so what say ye?

Also, what does the bar on the GCM indicate?

Chris

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#2 cpatrick

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Posted 18 May 2007 - 06:02 PM

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#3 cpatrick

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Posted 18 May 2007 - 06:02 PM

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#4 CNY Militaria

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Posted 18 May 2007 - 06:13 PM

My opinion:
He served into the 50's and 60's and CHOSE not to wear any additional ribbons or service stripes, perhaps because he was in the reserves and didn't care.

Or, perhaps he lost his WWII uniform and took a "newer" one to restore and wear for parades or other functions.

Edited by Schottzie, 18 May 2007 - 06:16 PM.


#5 bobgee

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Posted 18 May 2007 - 06:22 PM

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My opinion is that the SSgt who wore this uniform was last in the NY National Guard - 27th Armored (Empire) Div. in the 1960s. His ribbons suggest to me that he served at the end of the war and went to the Pacific, and perhaps Japan but was not in combat - no Stars on his Asiatic Pacific ribbon; no combat patch on his right sleeve. He has 2 Overseas stripes. He also has the American Campaign and the WWII victory medal as well as the Army Occuption medal. He had multiple awards of the Army Good Conduct medal and has 2 4-year service stripes. If he was in the Guard in the 1960s he would not have worn his WII uniform...it would have been long obsolete......Good hunting! Bob

#6 776thamtrac

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Posted 18 May 2007 - 06:24 PM

First to answer your GCM question. The knots represent the subsequent awards of the Good Conduct. As for the rest of it, I could totally buy Justin's answer. My thoughts on the matter are this...wasn't the 27th a New Jersey or New York National Guard unit? Or still is in fact isn't it? It's a 56 pattern uniform but possibly as new as the 60's of course without seeing the label. Seeing the OS bars and the reenlistment stripes I'm thinking he just stayed in the Guard or Reserves Post war. No campaign stars on the PTO ribbons even with a year overseas is nothing unusual. He probably didn't earn any depending on his branch of service. I would also assume that in his time post occupation in the reserves or guard he either earned no new awards other than the good conduct or simply chose not to wear any because his WWII awards were most important to him.

#7 CNY Militaria

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Posted 18 May 2007 - 06:32 PM

On that note about choosing to wear awards, I saw a USAF LTC today wearing only 2 rows of ribbons, only his WWII service ones including DFC and AM. The AF awarded a LOT of ribbons for everything, so its up to the individual to choose what to wear. I don't even wear everything I get in terms of awards, and notice that few people wear everything they are entitled to, usually because of pride.

PS: 27th AD was from NY.

Edited by Schottzie, 18 May 2007 - 06:36 PM.


#8 776thamtrac

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Posted 18 May 2007 - 06:46 PM

I totally agree Justin. I don't know many guys who wear all the "fruit salad" just as a matter of personal pride. All the extras are only good for is impressing the ladies and lying to them about what they really mean http://www.usmilitar...tyle_emoticons/default/thumbsup.gif

#9 cpatrick

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Posted 18 May 2007 - 07:35 PM

Thanks everyone for your informative comments! When in doubt, throw it on the forum! I am glad to see that there is nothing wrong with the uniform. Once I get the hat, I will show the complete ensamble! I don't get that much into the post war stuff, unless I really like it. Since this has a neat WWII association, I think this will go "in the pile"!

Does anyone know what unit the DI's represent?

Thanks again everyone - much appreciated!

Chris

#10 QED4

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Posted 19 May 2007 - 02:18 PM

The DI is for the 208th Armor, neither it or the 27th Amd Div appear in the WWII Order of Battle so I would say it is defiantly his post war NG uniform. The great proliferation of ribbons did not start until the 1970s so he could have served in the 1950s and 60s with out getting any more ribbons except maybe the Armed Forces Reserve Medal and if he had a break in service he may not have qualified for that.

#11 cpatrick

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Posted 20 May 2007 - 10:40 AM

Thanks QED4! I believe that the 27th was re-designated as such, having been previously an infantry regiment in the Pacific. Perhaps he was with this unit? Speculative, for sure -

Chris

#12 atb

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Posted 20 May 2007 - 03:30 PM

Remember it is not a "Combat Patch." It is and always was to show what unit a soldier was assigned to in a designated overseas area during an officially specified period. The soldier did not have to have seen combat to be able to wear his former unit on the right shulder. All he had to have done was be in the area during the designated specific period. That is still true today. The insignia is called the Shoulder Sleeve Insignia-Former Wartime Service (SSI-FWTS). I know eligibility period for the WW2 US American Campaign Medal and Asiatic-Pacific Campaign Medal was up to 2 March 1946. I guess eligibility for an SSI-FWTS ended befor that.

#13 Lee Ragan

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Posted 21 May 2007 - 05:18 AM

On that note about choosing to wear awards, I saw a USAF LTC today wearing only 2 rows of ribbons, only his WWII service ones including DFC and AM. The AF awarded a LOT of ribbons for everything, so its up to the individual to choose what to wear. I don't even wear everything I get in terms of awards, and notice that few people wear everything they are entitled to, usually because of pride.

PS: 27th AD was from NY.

How do you know he earned those ribbons in WWII? Were they WWII specific? Most of the WWII vets were retired out of the Air Force by the early 70's. Or was this a veteran wearing his last uniform to some special function?

#14 CNY Militaria

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Posted 21 May 2007 - 07:17 AM

He only wore ribbons that were from WWII service, DFC,AM, EAME w/ 5 stars, American Campaign, WWII Victory, and NYS Conspicious Gallantry Cross. I am guessing that he either lost his original uniform, it doesn't fit anymore, or he left just after 1947.

#15 QED4

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Posted 21 May 2007 - 01:27 PM

I really don't see what the big mystery is with this uniform. I think it is obvious, this guy served in WWII and received the ribbons on the uniform, he dose not have a combat patch because one was not available or he didn't bother. At some point he joined the National Guard and this was his uniform at the end of his service in the late 1960s or maybe 1970s the patch and DIs are NG units not Regular Army. What ribbons would you expect him to have? You have to be in Federal Service to receive Federal ribbons you only receive State ribbons in State Service. The only ribbon he would have been eligible for was the Armed Forces Reserve Medal which requires 10 years continues service. The great plethora of ribbons you get now for "just being there" were not around in the 1950s and 60s. This uniform is just what I would expect to see on a National Guardsman in the mid-1960s.


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