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Fantasy, repro or counterfeit EGA's


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#151 BigJohn#3RD

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Posted 08 September 2011 - 01:37 PM

Hi teufelhunde,
I just acquired a copy of U.S. Marine Uniforms 1912-1940 by Jim Moran and noticed that he address the reverse head eagle but nothing said one way or the other about the style. They seem to look like the Army/Navy Style and the details are excellent why would someone go thru the trouble of making them like this; could it not just been a mistake made by the original makers and accepted by the corp unbeknown to the folks at the time. I guess I am disputing the the notion that they are reunion, fake etc. because in my time in the service I have seen mistakes in detail in items contracted for and accepted with the mistake. Thanks in advance...anyone else who know a lot about EGA's is free to tell me I am OTF (Out There Flapping).
Regards,
John

#152 teufelhunde.ret

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Posted 09 September 2011 - 04:40 AM

I do understand the confusion, since the author(s) of the book are not present, its appropriate to let the reader draw their own conclusions. The book represents their opinions and conclusions, I'll leave it at that and not comment on their book. I'm of the camp which in large part believes there is only two wartime varieties 1) the issue type and 2) the Army-Navy (two varieties - perhaps better said dies). These being replaced with EGA's in Feb 1920. So IMHO anything being made by unknown parties at an unknown time should rightfully be consider the later category, as I mentioned previously, or in the two threads I pointed you to. Here are two pic's of the ones you have posted, most recognize as simple being phonies.

post_156_1182388715.jpg post_376_1182694818.jpg


Ironically this thread was revived yesterday, I had not been able to find it to date. I think it will give you a better picture of the controversial nature behind WW1 disc's in general. Hope this helps... just my 2 cents!

(collar disc minefield as I like to call it) http://www.usmilitar...d...=28159&st=0

#153 teufelhunde.ret

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Posted 09 September 2011 - 08:31 AM

... and while looking thru my pic's for another topic found these tinkered with gems...

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Edited by teufelhunde.ret, 09 September 2011 - 08:32 AM.


#154 Brig

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Posted 10 September 2011 - 02:23 PM

these also came in the group. The emblem on the left I believe is 100% crap. I think the bullion patch is Pakistani, and the Eagle/globe is a copy made from an M37 H&H officer emblem with the continents removed. The one on the right has a much high quality bullion patch...and an original officer collar dress emblem that has been destroyed. Eagle rearmarked 'Silver', the anchor has been clipped at the edges of the Globe and the emblem sewn to the patch. Origins?

The Capt bar...for the early shoulder boards, but I don't know about that black layer in the middle...not sure if synthetic or what? White threads do not glow. Original?

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#155 Brig

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Posted 10 September 2011 - 02:23 PM

rears

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#156 Brig

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Posted 10 September 2011 - 02:24 PM

questionable layers...

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#157 Brig

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Posted 10 September 2011 - 02:24 PM

under the eagle on the right

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#158 Brig

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Posted 10 September 2011 - 02:25 PM

rear of eagle and sew job

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#159 usmcaviator

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Posted 10 September 2011 - 02:52 PM

Brig,
The one on the right is a US Navy bullion anchor insignia that has a "real" WW1 era officer collar device that has the anchor removed. This is in an attempt to make it look like an 1868 Officer's two-piece hat device. Nice attempt at an otherwise "unobtainable" insignia.

S/F,
Mike

#160 Brig

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Posted 10 September 2011 - 02:55 PM

thanks...thought the bullion was well done...is it Midshipman?

the eagle breaks my heart

#161 teufelhunde.ret

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Posted 11 September 2011 - 06:33 AM

Shame to see the EGA's sacrificed for this... nonetheless an interesting conversation piece "how not to...."

#162 usmcaviator

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Posted 11 September 2011 - 02:15 PM

thanks...thought the bullion was well done...is it Midshipman?

the eagle breaks my heart

Yeah, I think midshipman or 1930's-40's NROTC.

#163 Leatherneck72

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Posted 11 September 2011 - 07:47 PM

Concur with Mike on all above...spot on assessment. Too bad on the WW1 bird...

#164 teufelhunde.ret

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Posted 07 October 2011 - 07:39 AM

same anchor as this USN insignia

Another one of these fantasy emblems appeared last night BUYER BEWARE!

http://www.ebay.com/...=item3cbcefd148

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#165 teufelhunde.ret

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Posted 07 October 2011 - 07:40 AM

.

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#166 teufelhunde.ret

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Posted 07 October 2011 - 07:40 AM

.

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#167 cgorth

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Posted 07 October 2011 - 11:37 AM

.

Okay, if this is a repro or a fantasy piece as you describe it, who made it, when was it made, and where was it made?

#168 usmcaviator

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Posted 11 October 2011 - 06:16 PM

Okay, if this is a repro or a fantasy piece as you describe it, who made it, when was it made, and where was it made?

Thats funny. None of the questions can be answered, and nor should they. This piece is a conglomeration of a WW1 enlisted service hat piece (suspect made by Art Medal Works or Ronson) and has had an added USN Chiefs anchor and rope to make it "officer". This piece was not pre-existing until just a few months ago. Two have no popped up. I didnt even look to see if it may be the same one. Its crap, and someone got taken for almost $500!!!

S/F,
Mike

#169 kanemono

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Posted 12 October 2011 - 06:13 AM

Are there any books out there that show real EGA's with the correct time period they were worn?
Dick

#170 teufelhunde.ret

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Posted 12 October 2011 - 06:22 AM

The Eagle, Globe, and Anchor, 1859-1969. Col John A. Driscoll, USMCR. 1971. 1977 reprint. 164 pp. is the only publication out there which is satisfactory, yet it has flaws, as we know it today.

http://www.tecom.usm...19000319900.pdf

It is a large PDF, on occasion you can find copies on ebay 15-20 bucks, originals 50 bucks plus

#171 Shanghai Jack

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Posted 16 October 2011 - 07:16 PM

A USMC China Marine EGA Diamond set was just listed on ebay. Unfortunately the seller only posted two photographs which don't show close up details of the badges.

http://www.ebay.com/...e#ht_500wt_1413

#172 Alec

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Posted 16 October 2011 - 09:30 PM

A USMC China Marine EGA Diamond set was just listed on ebay. Unfortunately the seller only posted two photographs which don't show close up details of the badges.

http://www.ebay.com/...e#ht_500wt_1413


Considering two of the plates have officer's egas on them I am a bit leary of this. If the seller is that knowledgeable of these as being rare why dont they point out two of them being officers? My two cents worth.

#173 Leatherneck72

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Posted 16 October 2011 - 10:12 PM

Seems like I am seeing alot of these lately.....I will be the first to weigh in and pat someone on the back, but to be honest....

I have my doubts...

#174 teufelhunde.ret

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Posted 17 October 2011 - 01:51 AM

I have my doubts...


Quite agree, w/o better pic's its a crap shoot, at best.

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#175 Leatherneck72

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Posted 17 October 2011 - 03:30 PM

These have been "showing up" recently as the economy has slowed and people need money. Unfortunately, I believe that these are re-pops made possibly 1960's/1970's. Many people who think they have good pieces got burned many years ago and didnt realize it. Just because something was has sat in a collection for 30 years, doesnt make it right. As I have stated in other posts about these type diamonds, I do not think they are real. These are ringers for the ones that popped up last month, except for the one that sold on E-bay. These here lack specific characteristics that are associated with attributed originals. Not too many people have handled real and documented Peking Legation badges. Once you handle a real one, you know.

If the seller doesnt show close shots of the enamel details, back side, and side profile shots, he is definately hiding things. If he is going to want the big money that it appears he is asking with a $1000 first bid he needs to show more, If he shows these profiles, those who have seen or handled real ones will have their answer.

s/f,

Brian

Edited by Leatherneck72, 17 October 2011 - 03:30 PM.



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