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#51 BOB K. RKSS

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Posted 12 October 2007 - 01:05 PM

What can You Fellows tell Me about this Tiger camo shirt?

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#52 cbuehler

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Posted 12 October 2007 - 03:15 PM

What can You Fellows tell Me about this Tiger camo shirt?

This is standard cut of jacket marked for asian large, which is still small relative to US sizes. It is a so called "tadpole" or "silver" pattern, and these seem to be pretty common compared to some other patterns.
What I have found is that the US size marked examples tend to be more desireable, but sometimes these asian marked ones were worn by US military personel if they were small enough.
Looks like a very nice example!

CB

#53 Andrei

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Posted 12 October 2007 - 03:31 PM

Sometimes you have A-L shirts which are bigger than US-Small ones... I had an A-M shirt worn by an American, fully patched up for a 4th ID LRP.

#54 Spike

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Posted 12 October 2007 - 05:18 PM

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Since everybody is showing some tigers I thought I'd join in on the fun. US-L silver.

#55 hochiminhtrail

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Posted 13 October 2007 - 01:02 AM

hy everybody,

just wanted to introduce me, i m new to Vnam collecting field, but i will be glad to learn a lot from you guys. I m into collecting south vietnamese tiger stripes and other Vietnamese army outfits, so i think i m right here to learn the different tiger camo patterns.

Beogam you shown a color picture with 4 Vnese, the guy on the for right is he wearing the silver pattern tiger stripe?

to be honest i have problems for the moment to make the difference between the patterns.

Cheers

Alex

#56 beogam

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Posted 13 October 2007 - 01:09 AM

hy everybody,

just wanted to introduce me, i m new to Vnam collecting field, but i will be glad to learn a lot from you guys. I m into collecting south vietnamese tiger stripes and other Vietnamese army outfits, so i think i m right here to learn the different tiger camo patterns.

Beogam you shown a color picture with 4 Vnese, the guy on the for right is he wearing the silver pattern tiger stripe?

to be honest i have problems for the moment to make the difference between the patterns.

Cheers

Alex


HI ALEX
FOR ME THIS GUY WEAR A JOHN WAYNE DENSE PATTERN WHO S FADED

CHEERS JEROME

#57 Copran

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Posted 13 October 2007 - 08:51 AM

[/quote]

Beogam you shown a color picture with 4 Vnese, the guy on the for right is he wearing the silver pattern tiger stripe?


[/quote]

Hi Alex

The 2 guys in the middle wore Tadpole Sparse uniforms but there are not faded enough to become Silver Pattern.
- The Silver pattern means that your material become almost white when faded, and Tadpole pattern or John Wayne Pattern can both fade to white
- Only the Advisors Sparse pattern (as showed by TS from Spike) can fade to Gold (some Late war middel weight can also fade to Gold but it s less frequent)

Cheers

#58 hochiminhtrail

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Posted 13 October 2007 - 09:10 AM

So basicaly the tadpole pattern and the silver pattern is only a a fading coloration difference??
the cloth itself is the same, but just a different coloration? http://www.usmilitar...tyle_emoticons/default/think.gif


well i think i will have to learn a lot

very intersting all this

many thanks

Copran

Beogam you shown a color picture with 4 Vnese, the guy on the for right is he wearing the silver pattern tiger stripe?
Hi Alex

The 2 guys in the middle wore Tadpole Sparse uniforms but there are not faded enough to become Silver Pattern.
- The Silver pattern means that your material become almost white when faded, and Tadpole pattern or John Wayne Pattern can both fade to white
- Only the Advisors Sparse pattern (as showed by TS from Spike) can fade to Gold (some Late war middel weight can also fade to Gold but it s less frequent)

Cheers



#59 Spike

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Posted 13 October 2007 - 11:03 AM

I far as I'm concerned you guys are putting to much thought into this, for 20+ years me and alot of other collectors break it down to silver, gold and lightweight, this tadpole sparse and all that is just Johnson's names that he made up and everybody takes as gospel. When we in the US say silver shirt we all know what it means and very few guys that have been collecting for along time refer to tigers by the names Johnson made up. But that is just my opinion, it keeps things way simpler.

Edited by Spike, 13 October 2007 - 11:04 AM.


#60 beogam

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Posted 13 October 2007 - 11:14 AM

I far as I'm concerned you guys are putting to much thought into this, for 20+ years me and alot of other collectors break it down to silver, gold and lightweight, this tadpole sparse and all that is just Johnson's names that he made up and everybody takes as gospel. When we in the US say silver shirt we all know what it means and very few guys that have been collecting for along time refer to tigers by the names Johnson made up. But that is just my opinion, it keeps things way simpler.


DEAR SPIKE

ABSOLUTLY I MEET DENIS JOHNSON SOME YEARS AGO I FEEL LIKE YOU HE HAVE A BIG "EGO" IS PLEASENT PERSON
BUT " TIGER PATTERN BOOK" IS VERY INTERESTING TO SPEAK ABOUT ALL DIFFERENTS PATTERNS
WITH INDENTIFICATIONS NAMES IS MORE EASY FOR ALL COLLECTORS SURE IS NOT ABSOLUTLY A BIBLE
AND I RESPECT THE BIG WORK OF MR JOHNSON I THINK IM VERY FAR TO DO A BOOK WITH BEOGAM AND DUCK HUNTER CAMO LIKE THIS
CHEERS JEROME

Edited by beogam, 13 October 2007 - 11:16 AM.


#61 hochiminhtrail

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Posted 13 October 2007 - 11:37 AM

Well i ordered the book, so i will see by myself, if it s very confusing or not, well for a guy who is just starting i will learn the way it s been thaught these days.

Maybe it s differnt for you Spike, i have heard from other collectors that the book is a little bit "complicated", i cant say this for mysel because i will start with the book, well lets see when i get it.

Alex

#62 Spike

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Posted 13 October 2007 - 12:11 PM

Maybe as a new collector you SHOULD NOT get his book as it will just confuse you more, like I said, the names he gives tigers are things he made up. He CAN be cool but he has an ego that can fill a footbll stadium and the book is cool as far as seeing what is out there but it should be what it is...a photo reference and not the bible as some collectors believe it to be, alot of good hard went into the book for sure but I'm sure in Nam nobody went to supply and said,
"Hey, you got any John Wayne sparse tiger stripes?"
"Nope, only John Wayne dense"
"Damn"

#63 beogam

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Posted 13 October 2007 - 12:15 PM

HI ALEX,

YOU ARE IN GOOD WAY TO LEARN WITH THIS BOOK(for refer pattern) WHEN I BEGIN MY COLLECTION OF VIETNAM CAMO GARMENT I M VERY POOR
OF DOCUMENTATIONS ACTUALLY YOU CAN FIND ON THE NET OR RECENT BOOKS YOU CAN FIND A FULL OF PICS OR INFORMATIONS
WHEN I BEGIN TO COLLECT VIETNAM STUFFS ALL MY FRIENDS ( ww2 collectors) TELL ME WHY YOU BUY SOME STRANGE DUCK HUNTER CAMO IS
NEVER WEAR IN WAR TIME
BUT NOW IM NEVER REGRET ALL UNIFORMS I BUY

HAVE A GOOD PLEASURES TO RESEACHS AND ANALYSES YOUR DOCUMENTATIONS

BON COURAGE ET PERSEVERENCE

CHEERS JEROME

#64 beogam

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Posted 13 October 2007 - 12:33 PM

Maybe as a new collector you SHOULD NOT get his book as it will just confuse you more, like I said, the names he gives tigers are things he made up. He CAN be cool but he has an ego that can fill a footbll stadium and the book is cool as far as seeing what is out there but it should be what it is...a photo reference and not the bible as some collectors believe it to be, alot of good hard went into the book for sure but I'm sure in Nam nobody went to supply and said,
"Hey, you got any John Wayne sparse tiger stripes?"
"Nope, only John Wayne dense"
"Damn"

DEAR SPIKE

SURE NOBODY TALK A TIGER SUIT BY JOHNSON NAMES IN NAM WAR TIME
IS AN EVIDENCE
I DON T TAKE THIS BOOK FOR THE TRUTH THAN TRUTH BUT YOU CAN LEARN SOMETHING ABOUT
CUTS,PATTERNS , ETC......

REGARDS JEROME

Edited by beogam, 13 October 2007 - 12:40 PM.


#65 Spike

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Posted 13 October 2007 - 12:44 PM

You'd be surprised how many people use Johnson's names for describing tigers, ebay is full of them.

#66 hochiminhtrail

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Posted 13 October 2007 - 12:58 PM

Hy gerome and spike

well i gues´s i would use for the pictures just be able to see the different patterns, i must say that it has been confusing a bit with all the different patterns see on e bay and the web, and they all look quite similar.

so a close study of the book ( pictures only) and many questions and posting on this fabulous site will help me find my way through the dense jungle of tiger stripes and other Vietnam war camo items.

Here one more question, i have been reeding trough the tiger stripe threads, copies were made with original cloth, stranded after the war, how can you recognize an original Tailor made tiger stripe shirt from a post war made tiger stripe also tailor made with original cloth.

i mean this must be very difficult, because every tailor has a different sweeing system, got his own kind of doing shirts and trousers, it s not like it s factoory made and approve by US army with a DSA tag, i guess the shirts a localy made, all over the region right??" SE Asia"

Merci Jerome pour ton aide

thanks Spike for your help

Alex

#67 beogam

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Posted 13 October 2007 - 01:03 PM

You'd be surprised how many people use Johnson's names for describing tigers, ebay is full of them.


EXACT LOT OF PEOPLES USE JOHNSON TIGERS NAMES TO SELL FAKES OR ACTUALLY PRODUCTS UNIFORMS
I UNDERSTAND AND ACCEPT YOUR FEELING YOU REFER SOME PATTERNS BY SILVER, GOLD, LIGHT WEIGHT ETC IS THE ORIGINAL
DESCRIPTION OF TIGER CAMO OK ¨NO PROBLEMS
I JUST WRITE IS GOOD BOOK FOR THE NEWS COLLECTORS
BEFORE I GET THIS BOOK I REFER ALL PATTERNS I VE GOT IN MY COLLECTION BY NAMES I GIVE IT
BUT FOR ALL AND ALL DIFFERENTS TIGERS PATTERNS WHO S EXCITED IS PREFERABLE TO GET SOME TABLES DESCRIPTIONS

AND FOR EGO LIKE FOOTBALL STADIUM OKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKK

BESTS REGARDS JEROME

Edited by beogam, 13 October 2007 - 01:08 PM.


#68 nkomo

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Posted 13 October 2007 - 01:11 PM

Like many of you have said, I find Johnson's book to be EXTREMELY confusing to use. Like Spike, I think things should be kept simple. I remember before that book came out, I could readily pick up a set of tigers at gun shows for $75.00. That all changed after Tiger Patterns came out!
I have only talked to Johnson a few times. I distinctly remember his arrogance. That being said, he was the one man who got me to start collecting Iraqi uniforms. He gave me some excellent advice that I have passed down to numerous young collectors over the years.

#69 Copran

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Posted 14 October 2007 - 12:23 AM

Dear all

Please find here a pictures of SVN Special forces or CIDG, I will let you decide which Tiger Pattern they wore since I think we have 2 patterns here.

About the Johnson book, I think it s quite confusing about how he made the tiger classification, but for new collectors, they can see a lot of good quality pictures of each pattern and garment and learn by themselves how to make a difference, and it s simpler to talk when you don't have pictures. But it s only my opinion, it helped me a lot when I start collecting tiger stripe, but I have to recognise that in France we don't have a lot of guns show or military surplus to get used with US Vietnam era camo unifomrs, so Silver or Gold pattern didn't mean a lot for me at the beginning.

Cheers

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#70 Copran

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Posted 14 October 2007 - 01:02 AM

This one with the Silver Pattern

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#71 Copran

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Posted 14 October 2007 - 01:18 AM

Another pattern of Tiger Stripe, you can see a SVN guy wearing it in the movie about the training of LRRP. This one has a cut like the ARVN fatigue, the pattern is rather similar to French Lizzard 47/56 than Tiger Stripe.

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#72 hochiminhtrail

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Posted 14 October 2007 - 03:30 AM

i ll give it a shot, the 2 guys in the middle have a golden type pattern ? the guy on the left a silver pattern, not sure about the guy on the right?

I am right???????

Alex

#73 hochiminhtrail

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Posted 14 October 2007 - 03:39 AM

so from what i understood so far the different coloartion in Vnese tiger stripe pattern make out their type.
now the question how comes that so many shades differ with the same cloth????
i know that sum bleeching and other factors can make it a difference, but it must be that the manufacturing must have been done in many different locations so as to have this different color with the age, so the fabric is not the same on all patterns?

For the moment i try to only focus to the Vietnamese pattern as not to confuse me any more, because i know that theere is Thai pattern and other countries too

i know that there is heavy fabric and light fabric ( this is what i just picked up in the last days). So all these factors makes the different coloration.

i ll hope i m correct, maybe i m dead wrong

Cheers

Alex

#74 Copran

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Posted 14 October 2007 - 08:51 AM

i ll give it a shot, the 2 guys in the middle have a golden type pattern ? the guy on the left a silver pattern, not sure about the guy on the right?

I am right???????

Alex


Hi Alex,

Nice try but I think you are all wrong :lol: (no offense ), the 2 in the middle had the late war medium weight pattern that faded to green - yellow (it can be called Gold but it s not a true Gold pattern), the 2 left and right guys had the same pattern that faded to purple.

If it doesn't bother you, according to Johnson classification (I think you have a book now) you have Late war Dense Medium Weight for the 2 middle and Advisor Dense (ADD) for the 2 others (the Advisor Dense pattern is almost faded to purple after just 5 or 6 washing cycles). The other picture the guy had a Tadpole Sparse (Silver pattern)

Do you have some TS to share ? it would be nice

Cheers

#75 hochiminhtrail

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Posted 14 October 2007 - 09:08 AM

Hy copran

no i do not have anything to share at the moment, i m really new to the hobby of collecting Vn war items.

i do not posses the book yet, it will be shipped only in a couple of weeks by a friend of mine.

so you see i was dead wrong, well i think i ll try to undersatnd slowly by reading here on this forum

i did possed some few bit s and pieces of Vn war stuff that i did aquire with the time, just by pure interest, not all was original, but it was not expensive, so give me some time here to get my collection started and i ll hope to be able to contribute with some items in the next coming month.

let me tell you it s very difficult to make the difference with the tiger stripe patterns.

thanks

Alex


Hi Alex,

Nice try but I think you are all wrong :lol: (no offense ), the 2 in the middle had the late war medium weight pattern that faded to green - yellow (it can be called Gold but it s not a true Gold pattern), the 2 left and right guys had the same pattern that faded to purple.

If it doesn't bother you, according to Johnson classification (I think you have a book now) you have Late war Dense Medium Weight for the 2 middle and Advisor Dense (ADD) for the 2 others (the Advisor Dense pattern is almost faded to purple after just 5 or 6 washing cycles). The other picture the guy had a Tadpole Sparse (Silver pattern)

Do you have some TS to share ? it would be nice

Cheers




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