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GAUNT WINGS


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#1 Mr.Jerry

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Posted 21 February 2009 - 07:53 AM

I think these are all bad, but just wanted to be sure:
All same maker mark, construction, kind of mushiness to the details etc.

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#2 bschwartz

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Posted 21 February 2009 - 08:35 AM

Good to see another Wisconsin person on the forum! Any time you see Gaunt on the back of the badge it always makes you a little nervous. It will be easier for people to form an opinion if you can show the entire backs of the wings so we can see the constrution, the pin, etc.

#3 Cobrahistorian

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Posted 21 February 2009 - 09:08 AM

I'm interested in the issues with Gaunt hallmarks. I've got a pair of 1LT bars that are JR Gaunt marked that came off of a officer's class A jacket back in the early 90s. They were original to the piece as far as I know. Obviously these are not wings, so I'm not sure what to think.

Is this a case of WWII tooling being purchased and "new" production wings being made, or was Gaunt not really in production during WWII?

Thanks!

Jon

#4 John Cooper

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Posted 21 February 2009 - 09:09 AM

I agree with Bob on this Jerry. I would like to see some higher res full front and back shots. I think 700 - 800 pixels wide with decent lighting and taken with a macro setting on your digital.

Regards,
John

#5 Mr.Jerry

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Posted 21 February 2009 - 12:47 PM

sadly I returned the wings from where they came. seeing 3 exactly the same spooked me.
This is all that I have for pics.

Gaunt certainly did make insignia in WWII, but there seems to be a flood of it on ebay.

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#6 Mr.Jerry

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Posted 21 February 2009 - 12:48 PM

hopefully a bit larger;

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#7 Gary Cain

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Posted 21 February 2009 - 03:24 PM

Gaunt made insignia from before WWI and continued on after WWII for the US. They had a store in New York and they obviously sold out of their shop in the UK during the war. The problem is that about 8 years ago a whole flood of new made insignia showed up on ebay and they were on what appeared to be original Gaunt cards.
I bought one just to have for my records and I can gurantee you it is a reproduction. They are all marked STERLING(which was very rare during the war) and the ones I saw were all nice and shiny. These wings you have posted so far look OK but you really do need to have a good overall look to see if all of the details match up.


Cheers
Gary

#8 JDK

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Posted 22 February 2009 - 04:56 PM

A agree with Gary. From known originals I have, have had, and have seen, I thought you're
wings looked good. It's tough to say for sure based on the pictures. Having them in hand is
always a big help. I agree that they are much easier found nowadays than in the past, which
always makes a guy wonder!
J.D.

#9 VolunteerArmoury

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Posted 23 February 2009 - 04:42 PM

Gaunt made insignia from before WWI and continued on after WWII for the US. They had a store in New York and they obviously sold out of their shop in the UK during the war. The problem is that about 8 years ago a whole flood of new made insignia showed up on ebay and they were on what appeared to be original Gaunt cards.
I bought one just to have for my records and I can gurantee you it is a reproduction. They are all marked STERLING(which was very rare during the war) and the ones I saw were all nice and shiny. These wings you have posted so far look OK but you really do need to have a good overall look to see if all of the details match up.
Cheers
Gary



I had the impression most Sterling pin backs were WW2 or pre. Was sterling a shortage material during the war?

#10 Gary Cain

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Posted 23 February 2009 - 08:23 PM

Most Gaunt made insignia of all eras is not sterling. Sterling was a upgrade fom the standard insignia. Also except for some very rare instances they would use the English hallmarks to show Sterling content. I have only seen three pieces of insignia that are only marked STERLING that I know to be real(they all belonged to Hub Zemke) and until I saw those I would have said they didn't exist.



Cheers
Gary

I had the impression most Sterling pin backs were WW2 or pre. Was sterling a shortage material during the war?



#11 uscollector

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Posted 23 February 2009 - 09:41 PM

What about the color?

#12 Gary Cain

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Posted 28 February 2009 - 09:24 PM

The color on these is hard to determine exactly because of the red background....but that being said I have no problem with the color because the other details(which are far more important) are right.

What about the color?



#13 Cobrahistorian

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Posted 28 February 2009 - 10:09 PM

I know they're not wings, but the Sterling mark questions have got me thinking now. I got these 1LT bars off of a class A jacket in NYC back in 1994.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v247/cobrahistorian/GauntLTbars.jpg

#14 jgawne

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Posted 13 March 2009 - 08:51 AM

There is a somewhat well known individual in the UK that has been cranking out "British Made" aka Gaunt silver wings of all types since the late 80's or early 90's (I may be wrong on the dates, but about then it started). So much that I will not buy a britsh style pin back unless it comes from a horrendously original source. And when the market was flooded with plain ones all the wacky types like chaplain's wings and multi starred ones appeared.

A lot of people just assume a Briitsh made wing can be a little different as it was, well, British made. Which is why a LOT of money was made on these, and probably still is) .

#15 Gary Cain

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Posted 13 March 2009 - 10:51 AM

The pins are both not correct(though they could have been replaced, why I would have no idea) and the STERLING hallmark does not look like the ones on Zemke's insignia. I for one would not buy these.

I know they're not wings, but the Sterling mark questions have got me thinking now. I got these 1LT bars off of a class A jacket in NYC back in 1994.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v247/cobrahistorian/GauntLTbars.jpg



#16 Tseuh

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Posted 14 March 2009 - 06:20 AM

Hello,

I'm collecting USAAF items but mostly uniforms and flight equipment. I have several wings in my collection, but I'm really a beginner concerning them.
Here are wings (3 inches) I've found in an internal pocket of a flight case where they were forgotten for many many years.

The shape and Gaunt's marking seems differents. What do the wings specialists think about it ?

I can take other pics if necessary.

All the best

Tim.

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Posted Image

#17 Cobrahistorian

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Posted 17 March 2009 - 02:30 AM

The pins are both not correct(though they could have been replaced, why I would have no idea) and the STERLING hallmark does not look like the ones on Zemke's insignia. I for one would not buy these.


How are they not correct? Brass pins seem to be pretty standard from what I've seen. They both got a bit bent up over the years, but they're definitely original to them. As I said, they've been in my collection for fifteen years and came off of a provenanced uniform.

Edited by Cobrahistorian, 17 March 2009 - 02:33 AM.


#18 101combatvet

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Posted 17 March 2009 - 04:17 AM

Your wing appears to be a good one in my opinion.

Hello,

I'm collecting USAAF items but mostly uniforms and flight equipment. I have several wings in my collection, but I'm really a beginner concerning them.
Here are wings (3 inches) I've found in an internal pocket of a flight case where they were forgotten for many many years.

The shape and Gaunt's marking seems differents. What do the wings specialists think about it ?

I can take other pics if necessary.

All the best

Tim.



#19 Cobrahistorian

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Posted 17 March 2009 - 04:36 AM

How are they not correct? Brass pins seem to be pretty standard from what I've seen. They both got a bit bent up over the years, but they're definitely original to them. As I said, they've been in my collection for fifteen years and came off of a provenanced uniform.


I'm just wondering what to look for. The hallmark offset on the bottom one was always an oddity to me, but the pins (the bottom one got crushed, so I've straightened it as best I could) from what I knew, were right in line with everything else I'd seen. If they aren't correct, what am I looking at that says so? Especially since they came off of a uniform that I had some solid provenance on at the time.

Its fine to say "its not good", but show me how to tell.

Thanks,

Jon

Edited by Cobrahistorian, 17 March 2009 - 04:36 AM.


#20 Gary Cain

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Posted 17 March 2009 - 08:10 AM

Hi Jon,

When I said the pins are wrong I should have said the spring side is the wrong shape. You do see this shape on CBI insignia but not on Gaunt insignia.
They may be good insignia, I don't have them in hand so I am merely going on photographic evidence which is never the best, but the STERLING(as I stated in a previous posting until I saw the Hub Zemke insignia with the STERLING mark I would have said that they did not exist in WWII due to the very regulated English silver hallmark system, but having seen his, I am modifying my viewpoint on rank insignia) mark is a concern and add the wrong pin spring shape and I will pass. They could very well be OK, I am just not comfortable with them at this moment. The reason I am so harsh on Gaunt insignia is simply because it is the most heavily faked and it all invariably is marked STERLING.


Cheers
Gary

I'm just wondering what to look for. The hallmark offset on the bottom one was always an oddity to me, but the pins (the bottom one got crushed, so I've straightened it as best I could) from what I knew, were right in line with everything else I'd seen. If they aren't correct, what am I looking at that says so? Especially since they came off of a uniform that I had some solid provenance on at the time.

Its fine to say "its not good", but show me how to tell.

Thanks,

Jon



#21 Cobrahistorian

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Posted 17 March 2009 - 09:27 AM

Hi Jon,

When I said the pins are wrong I should have said the spring side is the wrong shape. You do see this shape on CBI insignia but not on Gaunt insignia.
They may be good insignia, I don't have them in hand so I am merely going on photographic evidence which is never the best, but the STERLING(as I stated in a previous posting until I saw the Hub Zemke insignia with the STERLING mark I would have said that they did not exist in WWII due to the very regulated English silver hallmark system, but having seen his, I am modifying my viewpoint on rank insignia) mark is a concern and add the wrong pin spring shape and I will pass. They could very well be OK, I am just not comfortable with them at this moment. The reason I am so harsh on Gaunt insignia is simply because it is the most heavily faked and it all invariably is marked STERLING.
Cheers
Gary



Thanks Gary, that makes total sense. I'm baffled by Gaunt stuff, so any new info is more than welcome! The uniform was in pretty bad shape (in retrospect, I should have taken it, since it was a named uniform) but I bought the LT bars from the guy anyhow. That was well before I was into collecting provenanced history rather than just "cool WWII stuff".

Jon

#22 101combatvet

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Posted 17 March 2009 - 09:34 AM

I'll take them off your hands since they appear to be repops.... :lol:

Thanks Gary, that makes total sense. I'm baffled by Gaunt stuff, so any new info is more than welcome! The uniform was in pretty bad shape (in retrospect, I should have taken it, since it was a named uniform) but I bought the LT bars from the guy anyhow. That was well before I was into collecting provenanced history rather than just "cool WWII stuff".

Jon



#23 Cobrahistorian

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Posted 17 March 2009 - 11:04 AM

I'll take them off your hands since they appear to be repops.... :lol:


Sorry man... holding on to them, they're going back on my current Class A's, since I'm still a 1LT (Captain should be later this year!).

Jon

#24 Cobrahistorian

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Posted 17 March 2009 - 11:59 AM

Sorry man... holding on to them, they're going back on my current Class A's, since I'm still a 1LT (Captain should be later this year!).

Jon


I think I may be the only guy in the division with a WWII 28th patch on my class A's , WWII green tabs and LT bars!

#25 101combatvet

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Posted 17 March 2009 - 12:26 PM

Don't shine them up to much... taking off that patina will ruin their collector value.

Sorry man... holding on to them, they're going back on my current Class A's, since I'm still a 1LT (Captain should be later this year!).

Jon




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