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Campaign star on an American Defense Ribbon?


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#1 gtpcamaroz

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Posted 16 February 2009 - 10:53 AM

Hello,
I have an Ike jacket that has a ribbon rack with an Asiatic-Pacific Campaign ribbon, an Army Occupation Campaign ribbon, and an American Defense ribbon and a few other ribbons. My question is that the American Defense ribbon has a campaign star attached to it. The Army Occupation ribbon also has a campaign star attached to it and the Asiatic-Pacific Campaign ribbon has three stars attached to it. I'm not too worried about the Asiatic Campaign ribbon and as for the Army Occupation ribbon, I remember reading at one time that soldiers would sometimes attach campaign stars for a years of service?? As for the American Defense ribbon, is there a reasonable explanation on why it might have a campaign star? I can't remember where I got this jacket from, but I planned on listing it on Ebay. Basically, I have a slight suspicion this may be a put-together and I simply do not want to be another one of those Ebay sellers knowingly selling put-together uniforms. Thanks for any advice offered.

#2 Wailuna

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Posted 16 February 2009 - 11:32 AM

A "Foreign Service" clasp was authorized by the Army for the American Defense Service Medal to indicate that the soldier was on foreign service between September 8, 1939, and December 7, 1941. A service star is worn on the ADSM ribbon bar in lieu of the "Foreign Service" clasp. Similar clasps for "Germany" and "Japan" were authorized for the Army of Occupation Medal for WWII, however, substitute service stars were not authorized for the ribbon bar.

#3 gtpcamaroz

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Posted 16 February 2009 - 11:36 AM

A "Foreign Service" clasp was authorized by the Army for the American Defense Service Medal to indicate that the soldier was on foreign service between September 8, 1939, and December 7, 1941. A service star is worn on the ADSM ribbon bar in lieu of the "Foreign Service" clasp. Similar clasps for "Germany" and "Japan" were authorized for the Army of Occupation Medal for WWII, however, substitute service stars were not authorized for the ribbon bar.

Okay, great, that makes sense. Thank you for the information.

#4 Military-Memorabilia

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Posted 18 February 2009 - 04:08 AM

Hello,
... The Army Occupation ribbon also has a campaign star attached to it ...


While all the WWII Occupation Medals (Army, Navy, and Marine Corps) were NOT authorized a Bronze Star Device (as correctly noted above), they WERE authorized the Gold Airplane Device for qualifing participation in the Berlin Airlift.

My take on a WWII Occupation Medal or Ribbon Bar having a Bronze Star Device affixed to it would be that the correct Gold Airplane Device had been lost, and the seller, either unawares of correct protocol or being unable to obtain the correct device, filled the hole in the ribbon/ribbon bar with a device that they had handy in order to "complete" the ribbon/ribbon bar.

I would suggest, since the correct device is readily available for purchase online, that you obtain the correct device, and use it to replace the improper Bronze Star Device. Later, if you come accross another ribbon/ribbon bar missing a device, and it correctly uses a Bronze Star Device, you will have one to finish it out.

Edited by Military-Memorabilia, 18 February 2009 - 04:14 AM.


#5 Wailuna

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Posted 18 February 2009 - 10:17 AM

...My take on a WWII Occupation Medal or Ribbon Bar having a Bronze Star Device affixed to it would be that the correct Gold Airplane Device had been lost...

Assuming that the service star replaced a "lost" Berlin Airlift Device requires a bold leap of faith. The Berlin Airlift occurred in 1948/49. Gtpcamaroz gives no indication that the presumed owner of this Ike served that long beyond the end of WWII.

Can you post a picture of this jacket, gtpcamaroz?

#6 Military-Memorabilia

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Posted 18 February 2009 - 10:44 AM

Assuming that the service star replaced a "lost" Berlin Airlift Device requires a bold leap of faith...


True. My faith is based upon:

1) In order to maximise their sales price, most sellers I've known WILL attempt to replace lost devices in order to not sell ribbons/ribbon bars that are "damaged" (having a hole where they are missing a device). And since many sellers do not know regulations too intimately (all the time), and the cheapest/most common device to be had is the bronze star...

2) gtpcamaroz says:

... I have a slight suspicion this (Ike Jacket) may be a put-together ...


Having experienced the normal nature of the desire by sellers and collectors to restore relics, combined with gtpcamaroz's suspicions makes this for me a candidate for the error replacement. This should be read in the context that if gtpcamaroz is correct, the ribbon bar(s) may NOT be original to this jacket.

Of course, another assumption could be that a seller is attempting to increase marketability by adding devices to ribbons, even where they do not correctly belong. Of course that leads us into the area of seller fraud.

#7 Wailuna

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Posted 18 February 2009 - 05:27 PM

These discussions of "what-might-have-been" can become very contorted; however, in the absence of further credible information from or about the original owner of this jacket (which is not likely to be forthcoming) we will never know who originally put which device on this ribbon or when it was done. My most charitable guess would be that the G.I. put the star on the ribbon himself, for whatever reason, but perhaps for the same reason some G.I.s put stars on their WWII Victory Medal ribbons, and I'll leave it at that.

#8 doyler

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Posted 18 February 2009 - 05:40 PM

I agree with out knowing what unit patches are shown or worn its all speculation at this point.I would lean toward the vet did this as Wailuna discussed.The star on the victory medal has been a puzzle to me also.

RON

#9 Military-Memorabilia

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Posted 19 February 2009 - 12:32 AM

... its all speculation at this point ...


Ditto, ditto, ditto. Without talking to, or knowing the Ike Jacket's original owner, or at the very least, a photo/listing of all accoutrements and patches on the jacket, we are all trying to surmise the best scenario that creates the end result. http://www.usmilitar...tyle_emoticons/default/think.gif

So, gtpcamaroz, can we have some further information? You state that the Ribbon Rack has "... an Asiatic-Pacific Campaign ribbon, an Army Occupation Campaign ribbon, and an American Defense ribbon and a few other ribbons ...". What is the complete Ribbon Rack? Are there any unit patches affixed to the jacket? What are they? How many Overseas Service Stripes are present?

#10 Mark M

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Posted 04 September 2009 - 07:06 PM

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