M1Garandy Posted December 2, 2019 Share #1 Posted December 2, 2019 Anyone else collect these? Does anyone know when they started printing NM 1911A1/M1 Garand/M14 NM specs in this manner? What about when the Army quit printing them like this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Keith Posted December 2, 2019 Share #2 Posted December 2, 2019 Those are interesting, are they score books or rules? BKW Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M1Garandy Posted December 2, 2019 Author Share #3 Posted December 2, 2019 They are the specifications for each firearm for National Match competition for the year listed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie Flick Posted December 2, 2019 Share #4 Posted December 2, 2019 M1Garandy: That is a nice collection you have there. These Manuals were discontinued in 1968 when the Army's support of the National Match program was ended by that 'genius', then-Secretary of Defense Robert McNamara. I have a long time interest in the M1911A1 National Match pistols and, to a lesser extent, the M1903 and M1 National Match rifles. I also chase the accoutrements and Match ammunition. On the Pistol manuals I have examples of those issued for the Matches for 1957, '58, '59, '61, '62, '64, '66, and '67. I'd like to find examples for the years I don't have, so if you or anyone else has any spares, please let me know. Regards, Charlie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M1Garandy Posted December 2, 2019 Author Share #5 Posted December 2, 2019 I'll keep an eye out for you Charlie. The only spare I have is a very poor condition '62 NM Pistol. I'd like to fill in the gaps in my collection too, but I'm discovering that these don't seem to be common and are actually quite hard to find. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dalbert Posted January 3, 2020 Share #6 Posted January 3, 2020 I have the 1963 manual that covers the M1 Garand and M14. I think mine is a reprint that came from the U.S. Government Printing Office. I also have a similar, 1974 publication for pistols used by the U.S. Army Marksmanship Unit. Here they are: David Albert [email protected] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ccyooper Posted January 5, 2020 Share #7 Posted January 5, 2020 Here are a few rifle publications. Looks like Im missing 65-66. I have a couple of pistol pubs too, but cant seem to locate them now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M1Garandy Posted August 10, 2020 Author Share #8 Posted August 10, 2020 Just got a set of 1967 NM booklets to go with the above. The rifle one is pretty nice, the pistol one is a little rougher. Tough to find, I wonder what the total number printed each year were? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie Flick Posted August 10, 2020 Share #9 Posted August 10, 2020 13 minutes ago, M1Garandy said: . Tough to find, I wonder what the total number printed each year were? Hello Andy: I don't know the answer to your question with certainty and doubt that 60 years later that the information is still available. However, on the pistol Manuals we can probably come up with a good estimate. The chart below shows the number of National Match pistols that were produced during each year that the NM program existed. (Keep in mind that some NM pistols went through rebuilds so for example a 1960 NM pistol could have been rebuilt for the 1965 National Matches. While one could conclude from the chart that 2 pistols were built, with the understanding that some earlier pistols were rebuilt the total number of NM pistols built was far less than the total sum of pistols in the chart.) I think it is a fair assumption that at least one Manual was printed for each NM pistol produced during a given year. Thus, for 1967 the chart indicates that a total of 3625 NM pistols were produced. (That was the high water mark on NM pistol production.) So, my conclusion would be that at least 3625 NM pistol manuals were printed in 1967. BTW, thanks again for helping me locate a 1963 NM pistol Manual. I am still looking for the 1960 and 1965 Manuals to complete my collection. Regards, Charlie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M1Garandy Posted August 10, 2020 Author Share #10 Posted August 10, 2020 Charlie, I'm sure you are right that the info may no longer be out there. I'm just pondering on the subject while I search for the manuals I'm still missing. I wonder, did the Army print a copy of the specs for each National Match firearm built/rebuilt for each calendar or fiscal year (can't remember how production was tracked at the moment)? Or did they print enough for the competitors that signed up for the National Matches at Camp Perry for a given year? Neither? A combination of both? We may never know I suppose. You are quite welcome Charlie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ccyooper Posted August 11, 2020 Share #11 Posted August 11, 2020 Andy, my opinion is that one was included in each packet for each of the entrants and then there were probably extras to be handed out or picked up at the games. Distribution was probably based somewhat on those numbers. So if 1000 people signed up to shoot rifle on avg, they would print 1500. Just a swag on my part as once in my lifetime I ran an Army print shop. Normally the distro was included somewhere in the manual but in a quick review of a couple issues I only noticed they were authorized to get them printed locally. As a side note after I posted the picture above, I found the two copies that were missing and also located a few extras so I have properly filed them with the others. I have all the rifle editions. What year are you still looking for? Charlie, I didn't see any extra pistol copies but if I do I'll let you know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ccyooper Posted August 11, 2020 Share #12 Posted August 11, 2020 Andy a couple more that may be relevant and can be found with different years of printing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M1Garandy Posted August 12, 2020 Author Share #13 Posted August 12, 2020 23 hours ago, ccyooper said: Andy, my opinion is that one was included in each packet for each of the entrants and then there were probably extras to be handed out or picked up at the games. Distribution was probably based somewhat on those numbers. So if 1000 people signed up to shoot rifle on avg, they would print 1500. Just a swag on my part as once in my lifetime I ran an Army print shop. Normally the distro was included somewhere in the manual but in a quick review of a couple issues I only noticed they were authorized to get them printed locally. As a side note after I posted the picture above, I found the two copies that were missing and also located a few extras so I have properly filed them with the others. I have all the rifle editions. What year are you still looking for? Charlie, I didn't see any extra pistol copies but if I do I'll let you know. Cool, that is an interesting perspective and seems logical. As for what I'm missing, for rifles I'm after 1968, 61, 60 and 1958 and older. For pistols, 1968 and anything before 1961. Much obliged! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M1Garandy Posted August 12, 2020 Author Share #14 Posted August 12, 2020 23 hours ago, ccyooper said: Andy a couple more that may be relevant and can be found with different years of printing. I passed on one of these for about $4. Not really kicking myself about it, but I should have bought it. I think that the same seller I got my '59 NM rifle booklet had it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M1Garandy Posted November 2, 2020 Author Share #15 Posted November 2, 2020 Just scored a 1959 NM Rifle and Pistol, a 1960 NM Rifle and Pistol and a 1965 NM Rifle manuals from the same seller on eBay. The 1959 and 1965 Rifles are spares, but for the price I could not pass them up. Glad I decided to look today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie Flick Posted November 2, 2020 Share #16 Posted November 2, 2020 Good for you, Andy! Those manuals are indeed tough to find these days. Glad to see that you could track these down. I am still looking for the 1960 and 1965 NM Pistol manuals. If you, CCYooper or any other member becomes aware of any that are available please let me know. Regards, Charlie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M1Garandy Posted November 3, 2020 Author Share #17 Posted November 3, 2020 I'll continue to keep an eye out for you Charlie! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ccyooper Posted November 4, 2020 Share #18 Posted November 4, 2020 Wilco Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M1Garandy Posted February 20, 2023 Author Share #19 Posted February 20, 2023 The gaps are getting smaller. Scored 1957 and 1958 NM rifle manuals today along with duplicates of the 1962 and 1964 I already have. Still proving to be rather elusive to find. Maybe I'll snap some new pics when they get here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
45govt Posted February 21, 2023 Share #20 Posted February 21, 2023 Hello I was wondering when the National Matches began. Thanks Don Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M1Garandy Posted February 22, 2023 Author Share #21 Posted February 22, 2023 I believe they started at Sea Girt, NJ in 1903 and moved to Camp Perry, OH in 1907. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M1Garandy Posted February 23, 2023 Author Share #22 Posted February 23, 2023 Rifle: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M1Garandy Posted February 23, 2023 Author Share #23 Posted February 23, 2023 Pistol: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M1Garandy Posted February 23, 2023 Author Share #24 Posted February 23, 2023 Spares/surplus (not pictured 1962 NM Pistol): Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M1Garandy Posted February 23, 2023 Author Share #25 Posted February 23, 2023 I really need to find a 1961 NM rifle manual to go with my '61 TII National Match Garand. I forgot what some of these looked like until I pulled them out. The earlier manuals were definitely nicer than the later ones. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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