Help with patch backing information

[pfrost]

Hello all,

 

I have been doing some reading on this forum and understand that post-war German-made patches sometimes used a black paper backing that was similar to the backing found on many of the Pakistani-made patches.

 

I have a very interesting patch that has a very fine (almost a tissue paper) backing glued to the back of a patch. I'm not sure if it is vintage post-war German made (which would make sense) or if it is a Pakistani-made fake (which would also make sense).

 

Is there any good way to tell the difference between the two possibilities?

 

Thank you for any help you all can provide.

 

Patrick

[Longhorn92]

Can you post a pic?

[pfrost]

I'll try to get better ones soon.

 

 

[pfrost]

opps... double post

[pfrost]

These are a bit clearer, I think.

[Airborne-Hunter]

Please post a photo of the front. My gut says this is a war crimes trial patch? From a general stand point, I am not seeing any major pakistani red flags, but that doesn't mean I'm sold either. Generally speaking, collectors shy away from black back patches. There are real ones. Also generally speaking, the Pakistani paper backs are heavier paper and typically purple-ish in color. This does not appear to be typical pakistani made. However, if this is a war trials patch, I would proceed with extreme caution. Around 2013-2015 a load of somewhat decent and varied fakes came out and I wonder if this is one of those.

For clarification: Pakistani patches are generally accepted as fakes, but that's somewhat of a misnomer. This is a whole topic onto itself.

[pfrost]

Hi Airborne Hunter

 

Yes, this is a war crimes patch. I wanted to put up the back first, to get some ideas before I posted the front, which I suspect may ignite some controversy. I am NOT an expert in patches but I did a fair amount of research on this one before I decided to buy it simply because it was cheap enough and interesting enough for me to grab it up. I am well aware that this is a field full of fakes (and that this is more than likely a fake) but you won't hurt my feelings. LOL

 

While I can find a fair amount of examples of fake patches on the internet, I couldn't find one like this one. The bullion looks ok to me, the threads don't appear to glow under a black light, and the patch has an extra detail of small silver metal additions to the key(?) on top.

 

 

 

 

 

[Wake1941]

Is the swastika Metal ? This is definitely a different one

[pfrost]

Yes, it is a metal bit sewn onto the patch.

[Airborne-Hunter]

I'm not sure how I feel about the patch, but I'm generally thinking its not ok. The black paper back is what is expected on a German War Trials patch, but this paper is inconsistent with known originals. I wouldn't write it off on that metric alone, but what really does it for me is the black thread. Its simply not consistent with any German made patch I've handled. The only other place I have seen this type of thread is on other questionable war trials patches (link below). Best ABN


http://www.usmilitariaforum.com/forums/index.php?/topic/220304-nuremberg-trials-patch/

[tredhed2]

The paper backing may be the only likeable characteristic of this patch. The cables on the border are an incorrect size and sewn incorrectly- there is no uniformity to the angle with which they are attached. The cables on the back of the patch are inconsistent with known German embroidered. The bullion on the arms and sanctions looks like two different types of bullion salvaged from two different patches. The metal swastika and key end are nice touches but that's all they are. That the manufacturer did not get the details of the broken eagle correct AND it is an example of a faux template embroidered is jarring. This is one patch that screams for authentication and documentation.

[pfrost]

Thank you everyone for your input. It is what it is, I have no provenance or other information about it. I did think it was pretty cool.

 

Best

P