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Reising smg used by Belgian Colonial Army during WWII?


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#1 ThompsonSavage

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Posted 10 July 2019 - 04:19 AM

Picture taken in the Egyptian desert during a 1944 Belgian Colonial Army training. Reising M50?

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#2 MWalsh

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Posted 10 July 2019 - 05:58 AM

It sure does look like one. 



#3 patches

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Posted 10 July 2019 - 08:17 AM

Interesting photo, interesting apart from the weapon, was we were not aware of Belgian troops, Colonial or Metropolitan in North Africa, but they were., after fighting in East Africa

 

This from a WIKI.

 

Three brigades of the Force Publique were sent to Abyssinia  alongside British forces to fight the Italians in June 1940. This was done, in spite of the government in exile's reservations, to demonstrate its allegiance to the Allied cause and in retaliation for the deployment of Italian bombers in bases on the channel coast within occupied Belgium.

 

The Belgian 1st Colonial Brigade operated in the Galla-Sidamo area in the South-West sector.In May 1941, around 8,000 men of the Force Publique, under Major-General Auguste-Édouard Gilliaert, successfully cut off the retreat of General Pietro Gazzera's Italians at Saiot , in the Ethiopian Highlands after marching over 1,000 kilometres (620 mi) from their bases in western Congo.The troops suffered from malaria and other tropical diseases, but successfully defeated the Italians in a number of engagements Gilliaert subsequently accepted the surrender of Gazzera and 7,000 Italian troops Over the course of the campaign in Abyssinia, the Force Publique received the surrender of nine Italian generals, 370 high-ranking officers and 15,000 Italian colonial troops before the end of 1941. The Congolese forces in Abyssinia suffered about 500 fatalities.

 

 

 

After the Allied victory in Abyssinia the Force Publique moved to the British colony of Nigeria, which was being used as a staging ground for a planned invasion ofVichy controlled Dahomony which did not occur,was also garrisoned by 13,000 Congolese troop

 

Then a part of the Force Publique went to Egypt and British Mandatory Palestine and was redesignated the 1st Belgian Congo Brigade Group during 1943 and 1944.[27]



#4 STG44

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Posted 10 July 2019 - 08:38 AM

It sure does look like one. 

 

I would have to agree.



#5 ThompsonSavage

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Posted 11 July 2019 - 01:09 AM

Any idea how an M50 could have end up in the hands of the Belgian army during WWII?



#6 patches

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Posted 11 July 2019 - 05:33 AM

Any idea how an M50 could have end up in the hands of the Belgian army during WWII?

Since this is 1944, I would think it was surplus Lead Lease seeing it was no longer used by us, seems they sent some to Canada and Russia among others Free Forces.



#7 ThompsonSavage

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Posted 11 July 2019 - 06:22 AM

Could be. But I think they would equip the Belgian Forces with British gear (Sten or the odd Thompson)...



#8 patches

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Posted 11 July 2019 - 05:42 PM

Could be. But I think they would equip the Belgian Forces with British gear (Sten or the odd Thompson)...

They probably did get them from the British, the British somehow getting they hands on some and gave them to the belgians, the British,they are listed as one of the countries that used them, just how many they got?.

 

On the WIKI for the M50, list Germany as useers, says captured from the Soviets, the Finnish too, would be interesting to see a photo of a German carrying one, especially if it was one taken on the reopened western front in 1944, that would initially have everyone scratching they heads as t how it got there :D.



#9 johnsonlmg41

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Posted 13 July 2019 - 04:01 PM

Typical British side mounted sling swivel.   He's not much of a fighter without a magazine in the gun though?  Maybe he's British?



#10 manayunkman

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Posted 13 July 2019 - 04:25 PM

Very interesting.

#11 Browninggunner688

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Posted 14 July 2019 - 03:09 AM

Typical British side mounted sling swivel.   He's not much of a fighter without a magazine in the gun though?  Maybe he's British?



Are you suggesting that British soldiers aren't "much of a fighter "?????? Seems like it to me. I take offense at that remark as an ex serving British soldier for 6 years.

#12 johnsonlmg41

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Posted 14 July 2019 - 05:23 PM

I'm suggesting anyone holding a machine gun without a magazine isn't in for much of a fight, regardless of country......that's all.  I don't know anything about uniforms and am asking if he's under British command.  



#13 patches

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Posted 14 July 2019 - 05:47 PM

I'm suggesting anyone holding a machine gun without a magazine isn't in for much of a fight, regardless of country......that's all.  I don't know anything about uniforms and am asking if he's under British command.  

You mean it's a posed photo!, yes I would say it's one. As to being under British command, yes, as this is Egypt, though the fighting is long long over in this region, training more or less. I don't know, maybe they might of been committed to combat Italy under the U.S. 5th Army or the British 8th Army, but as we know that didn't occur.

 

Apart from the helmets they seem to be wearing British KD uniforms, puttees and gaiters too maybe, though with Belgian Leather gear



#14 pararaftanr2

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Posted 14 July 2019 - 07:58 PM

I'm suggesting anyone holding a machine gun without a magazine isn't in for much of a fight, regardless of country......that's all.  I don't know anything about uniforms and am asking if he's under British command.  

Earlier in the war, Belgian Colonial troops fought, and defeated, Italian forces in the continent of Africa, taking thousands of prisoners. By this time, 1944, some of their units had been reassigned to Egypt and Palestine as an occupation and training force, therefore, no need for loaded weapons on a training exercise in a non-combat zone.


Edited by pararaftanr2, 14 July 2019 - 07:59 PM.


#15 Linedoggie

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Posted 14 July 2019 - 09:07 PM

I'm suggesting anyone holding a machine gun without a magazine isn't in for much of a fight, regardless of country......that's all.  I don't know anything about uniforms and am asking if he's under British command.  

It's a training picture

 

Here are US Rangers (29th Provisional) without mags in their Thompsons

 

http://4.bp.blogspot...rs-1024x815.jpg

 

 

British Commandos training in cliff climbing. No Mags in Thompsons

http://1.bp.blogspot...hompson400w.jpg

 

 

US Army Thompson training

https://olive-drab.c..._ny_1942_sm.jpg

 

 

Many times before a LFX we carried out M16's and M4's without magazines inserted

 

so I would not judge a soldiers capability based on lack of a mag inserted



#16 dalbert

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Posted 17 July 2019 - 05:23 PM

It is definitely a Reising Model 50 in the photo.  Canada adopted the Reising.  The British tested the Reising, and may have purchased a few, but no large orders are known.  In 1944, any number of scenarios could have placed a Reising in the hands of a Belgian soldier.

 

Keep in mind that the sling mounting position shown in the photo on the side of the stock is fairly normal, based on the action bar position under the stock.  I have a first model, early "Commercial" Reising Model 50 that has the same sling mounting.  It's not to say that slings weren't mounted on the underside of the stock, like with most other weapons, however that sling position could potentially interfere with operation of the action bar, which is recessed into the bottom of the stock.  It's much better to side mount a sling on a Reising, in my opinion.

 

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