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problematic WWI Jr. Military Aviator badge


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#1 wingman

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Posted 14 April 2019 - 09:17 AM

Jr MA a.jpg Jr MA b.jpg I've owned this badge for nearly two decades, but have always had concerns about its authenticity. Several colleagues share that concern. If, indeed, it is an illegitimate (opinions most welcome here) period piece, I'd like to dispose of it responsibly. One thought would be giving it to a museum for a suitable uniform on display where security might be an issue  -- if stolen, no great loss!  Selling it, even for a very low price, might find it in the marketplace again ready to snare another unwitting buyer (like I was).


Edited by wingman, 14 April 2019 - 09:21 AM.


#2 hawk3370

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Posted 14 April 2019 - 01:59 PM

attachicon.gifJr MA a.jpgattachicon.gifJr MA b.jpgI've owned this badge for nearly two decades, but have always had concerns about its authenticity. Several colleagues share that concern. If, indeed, it is an illegitimate (opinions most welcome here) period piece, I'd like to dispose of it responsibly. One thought would be giving it to a museum for a suitable uniform on display where security might be an issue  -- if stolen, no great loss!  Selling it, even for a very low price, might find it in the marketplace again ready to snare another unwitting buyer (like I was).

 

What are your concerns? Other than the odd stitching on the back I don't see any flags. No signs of being a cast copy, the beading around the wing are all consistent in size which is usually where the fakes start to fail, feathering looks crisp. All in all I don't see a problem with this. But I am certainly no expert so would like to hear opinions of others as to their doubts.
 



#3 pfrost

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Posted 14 April 2019 - 02:41 PM

I see a couple of things that give me concern and a couple of other things that I like.

 

Good: The fabric seems to be correct, it isn't a felt which you see on a lot of the fakes.

The thread, while poorly done, seems to have that purplish hue that comes from aging of thread dyed with natural dies.

The pin seems right.

The wing seems to be die struck and like Terry said, the detail is good.

The beads are pretty uniform, the stars are crisp, the lines are good.

 

I would agree with Terry that this isn't a cast wing...

 

BUT, correct me if I am wrong, some of the House of Sword fakes were also die struck.

 

Bad/worrisome:  The feathering in the shoulder doesn't match either the "3-feather" Eisenstadt or the "mutli-feather" pattern of the BB&B wings.

In fact the feathering pattern strongly suggests, that at least for this wings, this is a new die.

The US doesn't really match the other known Dallas wings.

The little veins on the feathers are just a series of "V"s and don't show the typical workmanship of the feathering on other Dallas wings.... But the workmanship is better than the worst of the House of Sword fakes.

 

If you look at the gold "U" and "S" in the US are they sitting directly on shield or on little platforms?  and if they do, how high are they sitting?

 

It would be interesting to see how the parts of the wing are attached to the backing plate.

 

It is an interesting wing, and it could be just fine.  I would start perusing the internet and look very carefully at the wing feathering of other Dallas wings (good ones and the fakes).  That may be the best place for you to find the information you need.  Cliff always claimed that there were only 3 makers of Dallas wings, but I suspect that there are a few more patterns out there than that.

 

P


Edited by pfrost, 14 April 2019 - 02:50 PM.


#4 pfrost

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Posted 14 April 2019 - 02:48 PM

Your wing seems to fall somewhere in between a good one and a fake.

 

And somewhere between the Eisenstadt and BB&B based on feathering and shield.

 

Its a head scratcher.

 

Perhaps it is a BB&Beisenstadt?

 

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#5 wingman

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Posted 14 April 2019 - 06:48 PM

Excellent, and very helpful comments, Patrick.  Next I was going to try to have the gold tested to see if it was solid or plated.  Other than that, I wasn't certain where to go with this other than throwing it out there for comments.  Thanks guys!



#6 pfrost

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Posted 15 April 2019 - 08:05 AM

Just another update for you Wingman,

 

Read this thread and note the end where Cliff posts a version of what seems to be the pattern used with your wing.

 

http://www.usmilitar...on#entry2129393

 

 

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#7 pfrost

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Posted 15 April 2019 - 08:10 AM

This is a "composite" of some Dallas wing patterns that I made many years ago. 

 

I was on the fence, but now I'm kind of leaning towards a reproduction with your wings.  I am sorry.  One thing I have always wondered about these fakes is what they look like disassembled.  Not that I am suggesting you take the thing apart, but if you were to do that, it would make an interesting learning tool.

 

P

 

 

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