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1st Division WWI variant insignia


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#1 Jeeperz83

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Posted 16 January 2019 - 01:22 PM

Need help identifying a sub unit who would have worn this 1st Division insignia. Uniform appears to be an unmolested original. Collar disc is Infantry, Company B.  I've been told in an older issue of ASMIC someone identified a similar example as being for a 1st Division driver working for the American Battle Monuments Commission. However, I do not feel that to be accurate for several reasons, namely as the ABMC isn't formed until 1923, four years after the 1ID rotated home. Any divisional involvement in the inter-war era would have been much later in the 1930s, long after use of this uniform. 

 

I've seen other 1919 Occupation era 1ID patches that incorporate the "1" and the wreath, but not one with these horizontal bars. Any help is appreciated. 

 

2018.78.1_left.JPG



#2 Jeeperz83

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Posted 16 January 2019 - 01:22 PM

1.jpg



#3 AustinO

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Posted 16 January 2019 - 02:18 PM

I have seen another example on the forum but cannot locate.  I think it has to do with the specific Regiment/Battalion but I cant remember - hopefully someone else can chime in. 



#4 world war I nerd

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Posted 16 January 2019 - 03:37 PM

My understanding has always been that the design posted above was either a early or a later variant of the 1st Division insignia that was used before or after the adoption of the more familiar and official "Big Red One" shoulder patch.

 

I could be mistaken, but I believe that the insignia with the wreath was based on a design that was painted onto 1st Division vehicles during the spring or summer of 1918.


Edited by world war I nerd, 16 January 2019 - 03:49 PM.


#5 world war I nerd

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Posted 16 January 2019 - 03:47 PM

This drawing, dated November 24, 1918, was posted by Militariaone in the AEF vehicle insignia topic elsewhere on this forum. It shows the wreath, but not the horizontal bars.

 

The second image, posted by Dunmore, also in the AEF vehicle insignia topic, shows the same 1st Division logo printed on a poster.

 

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  • post-31352-0-85092400-1481640017 militariaone.jpg
  • post-104684-0-22978400-1483326481 dunmore1774.jpg


#6 Jeeperz83

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Posted 16 January 2019 - 05:48 PM

I have seen another example on the forum but cannot locate.  I think it has to do with the specific Regiment/Battalion but I cant remember - hopefully someone else can chime in. 

 

I thought this as well. The horizontal bars possibly denoting a specific company and regiment, much like the POM codes used during WWII. No luck though so far in locating a chart that might indicate this for WWI units. 


Edited by Jeeperz83, 16 January 2019 - 05:49 PM.


#7 tredhed2

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Posted 17 January 2019 - 05:57 PM

Somehow, the part about this patch being for "The Society of the 1st Division" did not make it from the original article into the first post of this thread. That was (and is) the veteran's organization for the 1st ID - in fact, it incorporates "Infantry" into the title now. I thought that might be important to mention. There is much info about the Society on the web, including images of the patch, minus the bars. 

 

As far as only one reason being listed, e.g., ABMC not being activated until 1923 - I don't speculate, and do not know the ID of the 1st Div vet driving that ambulance for the ABMC. However, WW I doughs wore their uniforms post-war for reunions, the Bonus Marches of 1931-32 (before Patton ran them over with tanks) and in WW II hometown patriotic parades, sometimes with Patch King patches on them.

 

One of the authors of that article is a 1st  ID vet and a member of the Society, and has a very good reputation for writing completely and accurately. The article reflects that he did not know the reason for the bars, which remained unknown until the postings on USMF that they are reflective of specific elements of the Division.        



#8 Jeeperz83

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Posted 17 January 2019 - 06:55 PM

I don't have the article and was only made aware that there was some mention of this style of patch in a previous article. I'm aware of the Society of the 1st Division and their using the 1ID vehicle insignia incorporating the numeral "1" and the wreath as their logo. 

 

I've seen other variants of the 1ID shoulder patch on uniforms incorporating both the "1" and wreath- no special Society connection- just utilizing that same design. The bars are the mystery.




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