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MOH two classes ?


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#1 roadrunner

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Posted 11 July 2018 - 12:40 PM

Hello

I come across this picture at the LOC. For me it looks like that the picture was taken at the day the awards were presented.

1. Why is the officer ( second from left ) wearing a MOH with the neck ribbon and the enlisted wearing the MOH on their chest ? Is this a sort of two classes ?

2. It looks like the Marine already has a MOH ( Tiffany Cross ) and received a second MOH.

Sorry for the low res picture, better pictures you can get at LOC
http://www.loc.gov/p...tem/2016890894/

Michael

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#2 Orion27

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Posted 11 July 2018 - 01:07 PM

The middle man is John J. Kelly.  He won the army and navy MOH, one of 19 to do so.



#3 Orion27

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Posted 11 July 2018 - 01:15 PM

The officer may be Capt. George H. Mallon.  33rd Division.  If you look at a blow up of the pick it appears he is just wearing it at his neck, there appears to be no neck ribbon.  



#4 Orion27

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Posted 11 July 2018 - 01:21 PM

Here is a Sgt. wearing his in a similar way.

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#5 FFZFlyer

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Posted 11 July 2018 - 01:37 PM

The MoH recipient on the left is Clayton Slack; to his left is George Mallon; on the far right is Berger Loman.  All of these men were members of the 33d Infantry Division.  The soldier on Loman's right is an unknown DSC recipient.  Marine John Kelly, who earned an army and a navy MoH for the same deed, is in the center.  I've no idea why he's there with soldiers, but perhaps it had something to do with them all being connected  some how to Illinois.

 

Neck ribbons were available for the army MoH even prior to the adoption of the 1904 design.  I am not of the understanding that there were any regulations regarding their usage on uniforms or civilian clothes.  At that time those cravats did not have the folded pad from which the medal was suspended.  In both the photos provided you can see the recipient tucked the cravat inside his uniform's collar.



#6 Orion27

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Posted 11 July 2018 - 01:42 PM

You can see the 33rd Division patch on the soldier at the right of the picture.  



#7 Mark Costa

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Posted 11 July 2018 - 03:00 PM

If you look closely you can see the suspension ring from which the neck cravat from which the medal is being hung from. As stated above, Mallon has tucked the neck cravat inside his uniform collar.   Both style of medals were available at this time and it continued well into WWII.  WWII recipients were sometimes presented with pinback MOH's, while other received neck ribbon MOH with and without pads. And some WWII MOH recipients actually had pinbacks attached to a neck ribbon.  It was just a matter of what was available at the time of presentation.  See photo here of Leon Johnson wearing what was presented to him.
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Edited by Mark Costa, 11 July 2018 - 03:07 PM.


#8 BigJohn#3RD

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Posted 11 July 2018 - 03:56 PM

I believe that the medals were presented with both items in the presentation case and it was up to the individual to choose to wear which one. Just a SWAG but I believe I am correct based upon what I have seen display in museums over the years.



#9 bobgee

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Posted 11 July 2018 - 05:17 PM

Interesting photo. But NO.....there is but ONE class of the MOH, Different types however. I'm w/ Big John. There was a breast badge with pinback bar AND a cravat. I'm unaware that there are or were any regs telling MOH recipients which to wear. Bob



#10 roadrunner

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Posted 12 July 2018 - 06:08 AM

Thanks for all the information. I need some more time for research.

At Wiki there is a interesting information that says the Navy had two versions, a combat and a non-combat version.

"The Tiffany Cross Medal of Honor arose immediately after World War I, as the US Navy decided to recognize via the Medal of Honor two manners of heroism, one in combat and one in the line of a sailor's profession. The original upside-down star was designated as the non-combat version and a new pattern of the medal pendant, in cross form, was designed by the Tiffany Company in 1919. It was to be presented to a sailor or Marine who "in action involving actual conflict with the enemy, distinguish[es] himself conspicuously by gallantry and intrepidity at the risk of his life above and beyond the call of duty and without detriment to his mission."[2] This pendant became the Tiffany Cross."

https://en.m.wikiped..._Medal_of_Honor

Michael

#11 4STARCHRIS

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Posted 12 July 2018 - 02:43 PM

Who is the Sgt in #4?

4starchris



#12 Mark Costa

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Posted 12 July 2018 - 06:14 PM

The Sgt is Samuel Woodfill.

 

Mark




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