Pics of flak helmet with reversed Swastika

[cricket]

 

 

Any Ideas on the reversed Swastikas??

[dustin]

cricket that looks to be newly painted M-3 awfully fresh looking, can you still smell the paint up close sounds funny but a good check or a souvenier piece possibly.

The person that painted it just simply did not know how to put the swastika on correctly it seems to me IMHO it is a FANTASY piece painted in correctly.

[cricket]

cricket that looks to be newly painted M-3 awfully fresh looking, can you still smell the paint up close sounds funny but a good check or a souvenier piece possibly.

The person that painted it just simply did not know how to put the swastika on correctly it seems to me IMHO it is a FANTASY piece painted in correctly.

Dustin thanks for the reply. I have to admit that when I previewed the post before submitting it I thought the exact same thing. Then when I looked at the post today from work on a different monitor (different color settings) it looked even worse. I will say however in hand the paint does not look so fresh, Nor does it smell fresh. It is in fairly good shape however but keep in mind this is not a combat used M-1 that has been kicked around. I think so many are used to seeing painted helmets that have been treated with sand paper then given washes of varnish etc. throw in a little dirt and there you go, the typical easy green treatment. I will try to take some close ups of the paint and maybe I can capture it a little better. As I sit here looking at the one pic however I would think the exact same thing It does look extremely fresh. Thanks again,

cricket.

[usmc-collector]

The person that painted it just simply did not know how to put the swastika on correctly it seems to me IMHO it is a FANTASY piece painted in correctly.

 

Historically the swastika symbol (from Sanskrit svástika स्वास्तिक ) is an equilateral cross with its arms bent at right angles, in either left-facing (卍) or right-facing (卐) direction. So using of left facing is correct historicaly, but nazi symbols use swastika righ faced.

 

Left faced swastika was symbol of prosperity and good fortune and is widely dispersed in both the ancient and modern world. It originally represented the revolving sun, fire, or life. The swastika was widely utilized in ancient Mesopotamian coinage as well as appearing in early Christian and Byzantium art, where it was known as the gammadion cross. The swastika also appeared in South and Central America, widely used in Mayan art during that time period. In North America, the swastika was a symbol used by the Navajos. The swastika still continues today to be an extensively used sign in Buddhism, Jainism, and Hinduism.

[Jeeper704]

Even the Polish Army had these signs in their insignia till 1939.

 

And as we all know, the 45th Infantry Division used it too till 1939 or something, after they changed it to the Thunderbird.

I wonder why they used the swastika ... because they had a lot of Hopi or Navajo soldiers in their ranks?

 

Erwin

[usmc-collector]

And as we all know, the 45th Infantry Division used it too till 1939 or something, after they changed it to the Thunderbird.

I wonder why they used the swastika ... because they had a lot of Hopi or Navajo soldiers in their ranks?

 

Erwin

 

For the first fifteen years of its existence as a Division, members of the 45th Infantry division proudly wore on their left shoulders an ancient "good luck" symbol, the swastika, in yellow on a square red background. But when the swastika was adopted by Adolph Hitler and his Nazi party in Germany during the late 1930's, it became an odious symbol and was abandoned as the insignia of the 45th Infantry Division.

 

While members of the 45th took off their swastikas and wore no insignia for many months, the Adjutants General and Commanders of units of the 45th Infantry Division in Oklahoma, New Mexico, Colorado and Arizona called on guardsmen and citizens of all four States to suggest designs for a new insignia. Hundreds of designs were submitted, and a Board of Officers was appointed to consider all the designs and recommend one for adoption.

 

Before it's first meeting the Board obtained information from War Department files on the symbolism of the original insignia. It was learned that the four sides of the square red background represented the four States in which units of the 45th Division were located, the red and yellow colors were indicative of the Spanish heritage of the area, and the swastika had been selected as a typical American Indian symbol.

 

At the first meeting of the Board, held in Oklahoma City, members went through all of the designs and discarded those which were considered too fanciful, those which were not representative of all four States and others which were lacking in symbolism. In a discussion following this action, members of the Board agreed that the new insignia should retain the original red an square background and the red and yellow colors of the original insignia, with a new design replacing the swastika. All suggested designs which did not meet these criteria were then eliminated from consideration.

 

A second meeting of the Board concentrated on the remaining suggested designs and selected three which were considered to be the best. First choice was Thunderbird, submitted by Joe Tice of Oklahoma City, former enlisted man in the 45th; by Sgt. Raymond S. McLain Jr. of Oklahoma City, and also by Brigadier General Harold H. Richardson, the Adjutant General of Colorado. Second choice was a Colt revolver, caliber .45, of the type worn and used by frontiersman in 'winning the west'. Third choice was the figures "45" in various configurations.

 

These designs were submitted to the four Adjutants General in Arizona, new Mexico, Oklahoma, and Colorado. Major General Alexander M. Tuthill, himself a former commander of the 45th Infantry Division, returned the file to General Barrett with the comment: "Of the three designs submitted, I dislike the Thunderbird the least"!

 

After approval of the Commanding General, Eighth Corps Area, and the Chief, National Guard Bureau, the Thunderbird design was officially approved by the War Department and authorized for manufacture and wear. The document approving this design, stated that the Thunderbird was an American Indian symbol signifying "sacred bearer of happiness unlimited".

 

The following is reprinted from http://www.grunts.net/army/45thid.html

[Jeeper704]

Thanks for the information.

So it is safe to say the design does have American-Indian roots?

To me, it reminds me of New Mexico mostly.

 

Erwin

[Gregory]

Even the Polish Army had these signs in their insignia till 1939.

You are right, mainly Polish mountain units used reversed swastika symbology as one of the elements of their badges. For example 6. Pułk Strzelców Podhalańskich (6th Podhale Rifles Regiment) or 21. Górski Pułk Artylerii Polowej (21st Mountain Regiment of Field Artillery).

 

Best regards

 

Greg

[Brig]

I've also read of Pennsylvania Dutch painting it on the sides of their barns for good luck

 

I know Coca Cola and the Boyscouts used swastikas, often times left facing (reverse)