rldarmstr Posted March 29, 2018 Share #1 Posted March 29, 2018 https://www.gunbroker.com/item/759882247 I bit pricey for my tastes but none the less an interesting piece. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tarbridge Posted March 29, 2018 Share #2 Posted March 29, 2018 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
268th C.A. Posted March 29, 2018 Share #3 Posted March 29, 2018 I have never seen anything like that. What strikes me is a lack of a serial number, I personally have the lowest number Model 1910 I have ever seen. It has a thee digit serial number and dated 1910 with the early latch. I tend to believe its a fantasy piece. I cant wait too hear what others say.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
No Quarter Posted March 29, 2018 Share #4 Posted March 29, 2018 M-191 Bolo Bayonet Basic Information The M-1915 Bolo Bayonet was designed as a replacement for the M-1909 Bolo Bayonet. It is an extremely scarce, although over 6,000 were manufactured. In FY 1916 there were 3,200 M-1915 Bolo Bayonets produced at the Springfield Armory, and 2,804 were made there in 1913. Designed and issued for field use, no actual records of widespread use have been found in military documents to date. It appease to have only been used in the Phillipines. Great care should be taken in acquiring and authenticating this rare bolo bayonet. This info is from a website called "The Springfield Edge" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Retired Army Noncom Posted March 29, 2018 Share #5 Posted March 29, 2018 Great care should be taken in acquiring and authenticating this rare bolo bayonet. This info is from a website called "The Springfield Edge" Personally, I wouldn't touch it................. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teamski Posted March 29, 2018 Share #6 Posted March 29, 2018 I'm not a bayonet collector at all, and I would not touch this one at all. How suspicious it is that the finish ends right near the hilt and you have a scoured blade from there on end. Yeah, I think this was a put together. No close ups of the blade.......mmmmmmmm....... -Ski Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
268th C.A. Posted March 29, 2018 Share #7 Posted March 29, 2018 I guess it could be real....but scarce I'd say. That's the first time I've ever seen that one...Thanks for posting. It is interesting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frank Trzaska Posted March 29, 2018 Share #8 Posted March 29, 2018 They are real for sure, I am not commenting on this one but they were made. The pattern was developed and 40 test pieces were made at Springfield Arsenal, so far three have shown up that I know about. Our forum member Robin has one that I used for photos when I wrote a detailed article for the Society of American Bayonet Collectors several years back. Our old forum member Carter Rila and I pulled some files from the National Archives on Bolos and made the case as written proof and Robins bayonet was the physical proof. Since that time another has shown up and now this one. Super Rare but I would want to physically handle it before commenting on this one. If it is real it is the nicest one out there. It is not the tool room or prototype model, that one is different and exists also in a fellow collectors collection. All the best Frank Trzaska Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robinb Posted March 30, 2018 Share #9 Posted March 30, 2018 OK, I'll say it. FAKE. They posted all of those pictures but managed to not post the one detail that would be hard to fake. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rldarmstr Posted March 30, 2018 Author Share #10 Posted March 30, 2018 Here's another one that just showed up on eBay. https://www.ebay.com/itm/U-S-MODEL-1915-ORIGINAL-BOLO-BAYONET-S-A-DATED-1916/332601677676?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649 I think they are both real enough. There are easier items to fake that still bring a good return for the faker's. The last one I saw sold went for $3000 about 6-7 years ago, with the scabbard. It was not quite as nice a blade as the Gun Broker listing but better than this eBay listing.and the scabbard was in very nice condition. Guess that was a bargain? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rldarmstr Posted March 30, 2018 Author Share #11 Posted March 30, 2018 Regarding the comment about the finish: A 'blue line' was common on most bright blade bayonets and bolo knives from both Rock Island and Springfield. It varied from just a hair line to about an 8th of an inch on different models. It appears that my initial post of the GB item may have been sold by James Julia Inc. auction Co. in 2009. Ref; https://jamesdjulia.com/item/lot-1102-extremely-rare-prototype-bolo-bayonet-for-the-model-1915-37699/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ccyooper Posted March 30, 2018 Share #12 Posted March 30, 2018 Here is what bayonet blue lines would look like from 1912 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Retired Army Noncom Posted March 30, 2018 Share #13 Posted March 30, 2018 My bolo's blue line or what's left of it......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rldarmstr Posted March 30, 2018 Author Share #14 Posted March 30, 2018 Yes....and RIA blue lines were narrower than SA blue lines. So? Are you saying that the 1915 that started this thread is fake because it's blue line doesn't exactly match your pictures? There seems to be a propensity on this forum to discredit almost anything that is listed. This was not always the case. It used to be that there was honest discussion and evaluation before pushing the "FAKE" button. I have no vested interest in this item but it is difficult to imagine anyone faking this particular 1915 bolo bayonet. Too may parts are unique to design. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
suwanneetrader Posted March 30, 2018 Share #15 Posted March 30, 2018 i 2nd the above thoughts by ridarmstr. I'm 80 and have seen, handled and owned many a piece of militaria. But just because someone posts an item I have never seen I usually do not say "fake" as I would not want to make someone feel bad for their expense or harder for them to sell UNLESS I know FOR SURE and then I will say reasons why "FROM MY ACTUAL EXPERIENCE", or just keep my thoughts to myself. Richard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ccyooper Posted March 30, 2018 Share #16 Posted March 30, 2018 Based upon your last comment (14), if you are referring to my post (12), I think you need to take a chill pill. In your post 11, you reference the blue line; however you did not show an example. As a matter of adding to the conversation I displayed a simple picture of two consecutively numbered 1912 bayonets of the same year as the original bayonet posted. I made no opinions regarding the original bayonet because I am not a rare bayonet guru or expert. I thought the common SA bayonets may be relevant to someone unfamiliar with what you described. Some people read these threads to learn. I just took my chill pill.... RAN - nice bolo! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robinb Posted March 30, 2018 Share #17 Posted March 30, 2018 It's not the blue line that concerns me but the fact the photos don't show a particular detail in the grip manufacture. Almost like it was left out of the auction description on purpose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Retired Army Noncom Posted March 30, 2018 Share #18 Posted March 30, 2018 Is there a reason why that year production did not have serial numbers? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reschenk Posted March 30, 2018 Share #19 Posted March 30, 2018 Regarding the comment about the finish: A 'blue line' was common on most bright blade bayonets and bolo knives from both Rock Island and Springfield. It varied from just a hair line to about an 8th of an inch on different models. It appears that my initial post of the GB item may have been sold by James Julia Inc. auction Co. in 2009. Ref; https://jamesdjulia.com/item/lot-1102-extremely-rare-prototype-bolo-bayonet-for-the-model-1915-37699/ It was listed in the Julia sale, with the exact same description. Apparently, however, it was not sold. Maybe the five-figure estimate scared folks off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SKIPH Posted April 1, 2018 Share #20 Posted April 1, 2018 Looking at this bayonet, I can't imagine how difficult it would be to replicate the pommel for attachment to an M1903. I kind of believe it's legit. What a prize to have one of these! SKIP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Retired Army Noncom Posted April 1, 2018 Share #21 Posted April 1, 2018 Looking at this bayonet, I can't imagine how difficult it would be to replicate the pommel for attachment to an M1903. I kind of believe it's legit. What a prize to have one of these! SKIP Why no ser# Skip? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robinb Posted April 1, 2018 Share #22 Posted April 1, 2018 If I'm remembering right, two were made without serial number to be retained as samples. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SKIPH Posted April 1, 2018 Share #23 Posted April 1, 2018 Good point on the serial numbers, but if you can make the bolo bayonet, seems like a stamp and serial number wouldn't be much of an issue. Who knows! But, I suspect to reproduce one, it would be necessary to have an original for exact size, & dimensions. Wonder if any are still floating around the Philippines? SKIP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rldarmstr Posted April 2, 2018 Author Share #24 Posted April 2, 2018 Is there a reason why that year production did not have serial numbers? Not having a serial number is not the end all to authentication of an artifact. The M1905 bayonets went through a period of no serial numbers early in their production. I realize this bolo is not an M1905 bayonet but the principle could be the same. SA dated their M1905 bayonets in 1906. RIA did not serial number their bayonets at the beginning of their production in 1906. They did start to use serial numbers at some point in 1906. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rldarmstr Posted April 2, 2018 Author Share #25 Posted April 2, 2018 It's not the blue line that concerns me but the fact the photos don't show a particular detail in the grip manufacture. Almost like it was left out of the auction description on purpose. Can you be more specific about what it is that you want to see that is not shown? (photos don't show a particular detail in the grip manufacture) What detail are you looking for? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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