Marine Raider Patches - Variations Reference

[stratasfan]

Hi! I am in the middle of making a repro Marine Raider patch, and I spent a while and ended up with only a couple photos. Got me to thinking that I would love for any members who have any Marine Raider patches to post photos and any description of make or something. As a beginner at looking at Marine Raider patches, I have not found a thread or website that really shows the different types. So, am hoping that some of you have photos or scans that you can post for reference! Would love to see more types than I have so far, as there are very big differences in the couple that I've seen so far.

 

 

[ocsfollowme]

The US versions are all of the same with the exception that there is a smaller version that was made for the khaki shirts. The SSI for the uniform/jacket is always fully embroidered while the smaller one for the shirt is on twill. You can find some US SSI ones for the uniform/jacket on wool too.

 

You will find many theatre made ones. Australia, Japan, New Zealand.

[ocsfollowme]

http://www.usmilitariaforum.com/forums/index.php?/topic/145363-ww2-marine-raider-patches/

[Brig]

This is a dangerous request, asking collectors to help you reproduce a patch

[Eric Queen]

There were two (2) full size fully embroidered US made versions ("Casper the ghost" skull and smaller standard skull) and two (2) full size embroidered on wool US made versions (Casper and standard skull). There were three (3) US made smaller versions. One fully embroidered and two (2) embroidered on twill. The twill versions had the standard and "flat head" skulls. Both full size and smaller versions were worn on the green blouse, the blue blouse and on shirts. There were several Australian made versions. HE on wool, bullion on wool, and fully embroidered. Have also seen both Japanese and German made "patch board" examples.

[RedLegGI]

Look's like you're getting some good responses. Looking forward to an update when you get it completed for your display or whatever purpose.

 

 

This is a dangerous request, asking collectors to help you reproduce a patch

 

Innocent until proven guilty.

[Brig]

Look's like you're getting some good responses. Looking forward to an update when you get it completed for your display or whatever purpose.

 

 

 

Innocent until proven guilty.

There was no accusation, just a statement. Anything posted here could be found by any potential fakers who intend to scam. Important to remember when putting words together that could appeal to them in a search engine

[stratasfan]

Hi, all! Thanks for the link above. So far, those are the photos I've found. That is why I started the thread. Actually, I had no intention of opening a can of worms. For one thing, we've been totally into other vintage/collectible items that have fake problems, and fakers are going to figure out how to reproduce long before anyone online is going to come up with photos. Actually, my Marine Raider patch is already well on the way to done, and I didn't have to post on here for photos. This request for photos was not so much for help in making my own patch (which , as I said, I didn't need), it was out of interest because I am making one and was just curious to see some of the variations I've seen mention of on other posts/places.

 

As to my repro . . . for one, they take too long for me to ever be a threat to the market of Marine Raider patches. Besides, anyone who sees mine and knows what they are looking for would be able to tell it wasn't real. Can't help someone who is new like me and doesn't know. (That is why I love the forum . . . I can call for help on things I don't personally have any idea about! ).

 

The whole reason for me making a Marine Raider patch was that another forum member actually had an interest in a Raider patch,as he is a Living History reenactor and didn't want to sew an original expensive patch to his reenactment uniform and was wondering about a repro. I decided, a bit after his query, that I would just make one, as it was a cool patch that is rarer than others. Something fun to do. If my finished patch were mistaken for an original, I'd say someone was totally goofy. Not to brag, (and I really am not saying it that way) and I haven't seen a lot, just stating a fact as I see it . . . the original patches had pretty sloppy sewing, from what I've seen. Besides, my felt and thread (while being wool and cotton) is not antique or vintage, so it wouldn't be hard to tell.

 

I think there is definitely room for good reference places for things like rare types of patches and many other things. Fakers will fake things no matter what. Why let info die just because we might be afraid of China (or other countries that repro). Besides, there are places for repros. I had to buy a repro USS Sellstrom patch. Couldn't afford a real one, when one would have come available online. So . . . I found a repro company. Besides, if you can't put words together for the earch engine, how are legit people going to ever find it either? Just my two cents.

 

Well, that's enough of me on the soapbox! Sorry about opening a can of worms, though. I was just interested in seeing some other variations of a patch that sure doesn't come up on Google image results and is even hard to find on a forum search here.

 

I will make sure and post my patch, though! It is a super fun project, and I couldn't recommend reproing patches more! Really fun to do when you can't afford the originals or can't find them!

[stratasfan]

Here, I'll post the photos I have:

 

 

 

This right here is why I am interested in the variations! The differences are so apparent and these two patches are very divergent looking, in detail!

[Blacksmith]

With all due respect, every topic that I make that point in, I get (basically) told to not worry about it - that it's the Internet, and all this stuff is already out there. I've said this about members getting too detailed on USMC "frogskin" helmet covers, the latest fake helmet fiasco where members detailed what they look for, and several others.

 

BTW Brig - I'm not disagreeing, just saying we're inconsistent in where we recommend prudence. In the case of Elizabeth hand-stitching a Raider patch, I think we're good-to-go. If a faker wants to spend 80 hours repoppin' one, have at it.

 

There was no accusation, just a statement. Anything posted here could be found by any potential fakers who intend to scam. Important to remember when putting words together that could appeal to them in a search engine

[Blacksmith]

Elizabeth - I have two variations that I'll post this evening, if somebody doesn't do so beforehand. I am really anxious to see what you create.

[stratasfan]

Thanks! I'll keep an eye out for your variations! Hoping that mine will be done this week sometime. As I said, I am not asking for repro purposes. I've already got mine practically done. As it is only the stars I have left, I don't think it will really matter which I choose to model them on!

 

However, I suppose the point I always hate to see overlooked, when it comes to collecting things (and particularly historical things), is that we can't afford to lose information simply because we are afraid that it will be copied somewhere. It is sad to have it copied by the wrong people for wrong purposes, but even sadder would it be if it was forgotten for all time because those who knew didn't share it. That goes for written information, too, which probably suffers from this even more than items!

 

However, I can certainly promise that my repros will be rare! Even rarer than the original rare versions, actually! It is kind of like a book I have. The sixth volume of a girls series of books (similar to Nancy Drew) from the 1930s-50s is extremely rare. It was set at the Century of Progress, and therefore considered too dated fro future reprints by the publisher. Even though that book was 1934 and the series continued into the 1950s. The originals are super rare and cost about $300-550, depending on condition. About ten or fifteen years ago, a company did one 100 book reprint. You had to pre-order and they guaranteed no set date, just whenever they got 100 people to pay in advance for a copy. Well, fortunately I found it and was able to jump on it and I got one. Way nicer than the original version, too! They did one more 100 book run, making only 200 volumes of the reprinted version ever made. You know . . . those reprints are rarer and more expensive now than even the super rare originals! That would be my patches! Even if ten people asked me to make them a Marine Raider patch (which I can't imagine would ever happen), it would be way rarer. I somehow think I am never going to compete with the Chinese! hee hee

 

Thanks for all the input! A question about the foreign made varieties mentioned above . . . why would there be Japanese versions?

[Blacksmith]

Here you go E:

[stratasfan]

OH, super cool! Is the one on the left embroidered on twill? That leads me to another quick question. Why are some patched totally embroidered (like the entire background is even embroidered, like modern patches) and some are embroidered on wool (or twill)? Is that just a difference in manufacturing, or is it worn on different types of uniforms?

[stratasfan]

Also, this is so cool, as look at the difference between the pictured ones! The shape even differs, and the skull is so different. This makes it super interesting to me.

[Blacksmith]

The smaller one is indeed on twill. I will defer to any of our experts on Raider patches to say something better-educated, but size and composition are a product of where (country) and when (early-late) they were made. I am under the understanding that the smaller twill variation was early war.

 

Also, this is so cool, as look at the difference between the pictured ones! The shape even differs, and the skull is so different. This makes it super interesting to me.

[Eric Queen]

1. US Fully Embroidered Full Size "Casper" Skull

[Eric Queen]

2. US Fully Embroidered Full Size "Standard" Skull

[Eric Queen]

3. US Embroidered on Wool Full Size "Casper" Skull

[Eric Queen]

4. US Embroidered on Wool Full Size "Standard" Skull

[Eric Queen]

5. US Fully Embroidered Small Size "Standard" Skull

[Eric Queen]

6. US Embroidered on Twill Small Size "Standard" Skull

[Eric Queen]

7. US Embroidered on Twill Small Size "Flat Head" Skull

[Eric Queen]

8. Australian Hand Embroidered on Wool

[Eric Queen]

9. Australian BEVO Weave (J.J Cash & Co.)